Arizona aircraft registration (a rant)

Timbeck2

Timbeck2

Final Approach
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Vail, Arizona
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Timbeck2
I've owned my airplane since June 2015. At the time of purchase I was required to send in a registration application in order to register the aircraft to me plus a money order for $30 which I did.
(rant section follows)

For the past two years, the renewal notice they send me states that the aircraft is registered in Maricopa county. Last year I sent them the notice along with payment and wrote a note on the registration to "please change county of registration to Pima." This year I got the renewal and again, Maricopa country is listed. So I called "Norma" at the aircraft registration division of Arizona Department of Transportation and asked her if she could change it for me. She said that I needed to fill out another registration application along with another $30 fee for that to be changed. I told her that I refuse to do that since the aircraft was already registered to me. After a while she relented, told me to fill out the application anyway along with the renewal notice and the $25 renewal fee and they'd take care of it.

(aha section below)
As I was filling out the registration application it occurred to me that the ONLY place a county is required to be filled out is in the Notary Public affidavit section. As Ronald Reagan said: "In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem."
 
Never registered with a state.
 
Massachusetts uses a registration fee, graduated by weight, rather than a sales tax. If taxed, it would be 6.25% at time of sale. Instead, I pay 160 a year for a single engine under 3,000 pounds.
If I moved the home airport outside of Ma, they would still find the plane parked locally. More than 30 days consecutive and they would still want their vig. Hard to avoid.
 
In the People's Republik of Illinois you get to pay sales tax on your plane, then you must "register" your pilot certificate every two years and register your aircraft too. In years past you got a little card in the mail for your pilot certificate registration and a sticker for your aircraft registration. Then they said it cost too much to produce and send that stuff out so they stopped.....and raised the fee.
 
State aviation depts tend to be fairly useless, or, at best, marginally useful, relative to thier cost. Somplace to employ appointees and functionaries. Maybe do a little good work, layer on pointless bureacracy, justify fees (taxes), the usual parasites. . .
 
In Virginia, we have a sticker that goes on the plane, after paying the sales tax.. then it's like $5 or something a year. After the first year I thought I dodged the personal property tax...

Then I got a letter from the commissioner of the revenue that basically stated.. we noticed you rent a hangar out at sfq, please tell us what you keep in it and how much it cost.
 
ifly4fun said:
In Virginia, we have a sticker that goes on the plane, after paying the sales tax.. then it's like $5 or something a year. After the first year I thought I dodged the personal property tax...

Then I got a letter from the commissioner of the revenue that basically stated.. we noticed you rent a hangar out at sfq, please tell us what you keep in it and how much it cost.
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Business related material.

Worth, I traded for it, OVC.

How is that any of their business.
 
ifly4fun said:
In Virginia, we have a sticker that goes on the plane, after paying the sales tax.. then it's like $5 or something a year. After the first year I thought I dodged the personal property tax...

Then I got a letter from the commissioner of the revenue that basically stated.. we noticed you rent a hangar out at sfq, please tell us what you keep in it and how much it cost.
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I thought all planes cost just $1. ;):D
 
SkyDog58 said:
I thought all planes cost just $1. ;):D
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Let's say I put a fair number down.. when I got the bill they came up with some off the wall number of their own, like $4k I think.. bill was like $30, I wasn't going to complain.. my car was $300
 
Still, I think it is a big overreach for states to stick their nose into aviation which to me is already adequately regulated by the fed and taxed via fuel.
 
I'm glad Alaska is not into taxing us for our planes. I'm sure it will not be to long before they start such a thing. They took away 1/2 of our permanent fund this year to help balance the budget.
 
ifly4fun said:
In Virginia, we have a sticker that goes on the plane, after paying the sales tax.. then it's like $5 or something a year. After the first year I thought I dodged the personal property tax...

Then I got a letter from the commissioner of the revenue that basically stated.. we noticed you rent a hangar out at sfq, please tell us what you keep in it and how much it cost.
Click to expand...

So how does VA track you down? I'm an Ohio resident on active duty and will be moving to Fort Lee for a whooping 12 months starting in July. I haven't seen anything that says military non-residents are exempt from the aviation tax and registration in VA (didn't have to pay a sales tax when I bought the plane). I'm getting tired of every state I move to doing something different. NV sent me a bill, but I worked with Washoe County and had the veteran's exemption applied, but it took more than a few phone calls because they don't see many active duty members up here. Fallon and Vegas sure, but not in Reno where they usually just deal with the ARNG and Air Guard.

Cheers,
Brian
 
And furthermore............$25 registration fee for my new RV-9A, over $700 for my Chevy truck, go figure.
 
In NC we paid county property tax every year. Didn't register with the state, but had to register with another county when we moved.
 
flight2000 said:
So how does VA track you down? I'm an Ohio resident on active duty and will be moving to Fort Lee for a whooping 12 months starting in July. I haven't seen anything that says military non-residents are exempt from the aviation tax and registration in VA (didn't have to pay a sales tax when I bought the plane). I'm getting tired of every state I move to doing something different. NV sent me a bill, but I worked with Washoe County and had the veteran's exemption applied, but it took more than a few phone calls because they don't see many active duty members up here. Fallon and Vegas sure, but not in Reno where they usually just deal with the ARNG and Air Guard.

Cheers,
Brian
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I am about to fight this battle........I own a mooney hangared in Arkansas, but I spend a reasonable amount of time tied down in VA, with no lease, just daily rate. Somehow the taxing authorities got my N number and said I owed sales and property tax..... As far as I am concerned all paid and registered in AR and I never exceeded the 60 days they claimed. Will see if they believe me.....
 
SkyDog58 said:
Still, I think it is a big overreach for states to stick their nose into aviation which to me is already adequately regulated by the fed and taxed via fuel.
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Really? Fed avgas tax is $0.22/gal. Average Cessna 172 flying 75 hours per year, burning 9 gph, that is less than $150/year. To cover all ATC infrastructure and airport improvement funds. Do you really think that alone and tiedown/hangar fees would fund your local airport?
 
flight2000 said:
So how does VA track you down? I'm an Ohio resident on active duty and will be moving to Fort Lee for a whooping 12 months starting in July. I haven't seen anything that says military non-residents are exempt from the aviation tax and registration in VA (didn't have to pay a sales tax when I bought the plane). I'm getting tired of every state I move to doing something different. NV sent me a bill, but I worked with Washoe County and had the veteran's exemption applied, but it took more than a few phone calls because they don't see many active duty members up here. Fallon and Vegas sure, but not in Reno where they usually just deal with the ARNG and Air Guard.

Cheers,
Brian
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The tax is rediculously low on airplanes, it's a generic personal property tax, the same applies to boats, cars, rvs etc... lucky for you, military non-residents are exempt from ppt. Youll probably still need the va dept of aviation sticker, but it's only like $5/yr.

I'll also add it's a city imposed tax, and varies from locale
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Really? Fed avgas tax is $0.22/gal. Average Cessna 172 flying 75 hours per year, burning 9 gph, that is less than $150/year. To cover all ATC infrastructure and airport improvement funds. Do you really think that alone and tiedown/hangar fees would fund your local airport?
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Soooo, what funding and/or services does a local GA airport receive from the state of VA???
 
ifly4fun said:
The tax is rediculously low on airplanes, it's a generic personal property tax, the same applies to boats, cars, rvs etc... lucky for you, military non-residents are exempt from ppt. Youll probably still need the va dept of aviation sticker, but it's only like $5/yr.

I'll also add it's a city imposed tax, and varies from locale
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I saw the exemption for the cars (I'll still retain my OH plates, drivers license, etc like I always do), but after reading their website, I'm more concerned about the 2% "sales tax" they will try to collect on the plane (low is relative I guess, but $2K is still $2K....:(). Didn't see any exemption for active duty military in that portion on their web page. I'm planning to base the plane at KFCI: Richmond Executive for the time I'm there. We shall see what happens...

Brian
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Really? Fed avgas tax is $0.22/gal. Average Cessna 172 flying 75 hours per year, burning 9 gph, that is less than $150/year. To cover all ATC infrastructure and airport improvement funds. Do you really think that alone and tiedown/hangar fees would fund your local airport?
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No, it wouldn't. . .but that's not the sole source for local airport support, and the Feds have played the shell game with the aviation trust fund for decades. Local/state level is murkier - my guess would be, if you could get truthful numbers, that the income exceeded the expense, and/or someone was featherbedding, in the cases where the "costs" aren't recovered. And our 172 averages about five times that number of hours.
 
flight2000 said:
I saw the exemption for the cars (I'll still retain my OH plates, drivers license, etc like I always do), but after reading their website, I'm more concerned about the 2% "sales tax" they will try to collect on the plane (low is relative I guess, but $2K is still $2K....:(). Didn't see any exemption for active duty military in that portion on their web page. I'm planning to base the plane at KFCI: Richmond Executive for the time I'm there. We shall see what happens...

Brian
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Ahh, yeah I'm not sure about the sales tax, I was referring to the annual personal property tax. And by low, I meant relatively (compared to car, I think my plane was 1/10th of the car)
 
I can tell you in the state of Iowa that the state aviation department funds a lot of airport improvement projects, and covers the gap between what local governments can afford and what the federal government will pay for. And if you compare the registration fee for your aircraft versus what your car costs annually, it's not a bad deal
 
Rushie said:
In NC we paid county property tax every year. Didn't register with the state, but had to register with another county when we moved.
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What's the % run these days? IIRC it was close to 1% in some counties.
 
As a follow up, I got a call from "John" at the Arizona Department of Transportation a couple of days after I sent in the $25 for the registration fee, a letter explaining that all I wanted was for someone to change the county of registration to Pima instead of Maricopa and a copy of their registration application form which doesn't have a place in which to state the county of registration. They go by the airport it is based out of, but nobody ever noticed that it was no longer at Falcon Field in Maricopa country and is now based out of Tucson International. He apologized for the confusion, told me that it was changed and for me to have a faboo day. (he didn't say that, he said "good holiday weekend" but faboo is my term and I like using it) I'm happy now.
 
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teejayevans said:
What's the % run these days? IIRC it was close to 1% in some counties.
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We paid about .6% in Johnston County to the best of my recollection without going and getting the paperwork and a lot less in Ashe County but I'm sure it's higher in the populated counties with the big airports.
 
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