Anybody ever been asked or coerced to fly illegal cargo?

kontiki

kontiki

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Kontiki
Do many pilots get approched by people that want to traffic in illegal things?

Aside from trying to avoid trouble how can you protect yourself if it finds you?
 
I've heard of it being stashed on planes that are parked while people vacation, then they report the registration numbers to their people state side, but not me personally.
 
kontiki said:
Do many pilots get approched by people that want to traffic in illegal things?

Aside from trying to avoid trouble how can you protect yourself if it finds you?
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Not illegal, but I was asked once to fly some passengers from Cat Island to Nassau because there wasn't room on the commercial flight. I just said "no."
 
You betcha, Angie was asked by a former coworker. She took the liberty of turning him down.
 
yeah I met a dude at the hangar once after a shady phone conversation, turns out he was selling amway. No lucrative adventure for me.
 
An Iowa newspaper my company did contract business with begged me to go pick up a part for their press in the middle of the night, which was broken.

It was winter, and I wasn't instrument or commercial rated. I told them no.
 
I have no doubt it's happened to a lot of us. Take Nancy Reagan's advice -- "Just say 'no'." And then walk away and don't ever have anything to do with those people again. BTW, if you get "cold called" on something like that, I suspect it's about even odds that the person asking works for DEA or FBI, not the cartels.
 
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I flew a few new planes back from ICT in the 1970's. I always maxed out the load with Coors, but it was all for personal consumption.
 
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I doubt this happens very often TBH, the cartels would normally have their own pilots and their own fleet of aircrafts, right?
 
Tarheel Pilot said:
I doubt this happens very often TBH, the cartels would normally have their own pilots and their own fleet of aircrafts, right?
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...and like terrorists, they are very suspicious of anyone who isn't already family. I'd think the odds of anyone being approached cold on the street (or the ramp) by a cartel member are pretty slim. You'd probably have to work on them to get into their operation rather than the other way around. I suspect that a cold approach would more likely come from amateurs.
 
kontiki said:
Do many pilots get approched by people that want to traffic in illegal things?

Aside from trying to avoid trouble how can you protect yourself if it finds you?
Click to expand...

I've been approached 5 times, 3 times in Mena AR, and once in Staniel Cay when I was checkimg out an A-26 on the ramp. I turned down the offer but got a ride anyway. It's on my 'I Want One' list, problem is you gotta haul cocaine to pay for the gas. R-2800s are thirsty girls. The other time it was the US Govt Joint Drug Interdiction Task Force wanted me to use my plane to fly the cartel dope for a cartel paycheck and keep tabs for them, get this, as an independent contractor...:rofl::rofl::lol: I told them when I got a government ID, paycheck, and pension we'll talk.

I've managed to avoid temptation so far but I'll tell ya, this last year has been a hard test.
 
Ron Levy said:
I have no doubt it's happened to a lot of us. Take Nancy Reagan's advice -- "Just say 'no'." And then walk away and don't ever have anything to do with those people again. BTW, if you get "cold called" on something like that, I suspect it's about even odds that the person asking works for DEA or FBI, not the cartels.
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Seems that would be a textbook definition of entrapment.
 
kontiki said:
Do many pilots get approched by people that want to traffic in illegal things?

Aside from trying to avoid trouble how can you protect yourself if it finds you?
Click to expand...

Well, I talked to some guy who wanted to sell me investments once...

Just kidding. I know what you meant.

Flying out of a modern TSA-anti-terrorism-compound-lockdown airport probably does have the side-effect of keeping the riff-raff out...
 
Closest I had was some idiot in a bar one night trying to talk me into flying him to some other city so he could buy meth. Thanks, but no thanks.
 
I've had DHS think I was and search my plane, does that count?

Of course, they found nothing - there was nothing to find. Other than dog cages. Man, that was funny.
 
Lots of smuggling that doesn't involve the cartels. In this area guns, ammo and cigs go to Canada. Meth, extacy & people make the trip to the USA.
 
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bartmc said:
Seems that would be a textbook definition of entrapment.
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It probably is, but entrapment is a defense to be raised at trial. You still gotta pay the lawyer.

You've also got Spike's story of the plane that was seized because it was used for drug trafficking, and took years to be returned. The lawyers made a boatload of money there too, proving the owner was innocent.
 
You guys should watch cocaine cowboys (1st one). It's a documentary in part about flying drugs. Willingness to do it is one thing, skill (for those other than Henning of course) is another. How about flying 10 AGL over water for 800 miles in dark night conditions and then shooting an unpublished approach into a farm field with a couple of pickup truck lights. Oh yeah, if you crash, get hurt, break down, run low on gas, anything, then expect to be shot and thrown in some hole, so no pressure.

Most just can't handle that kind of thing.
 
I got stopped in Aruba. We were just about to push back from the gate when the cops came and surrounded the plane. They made us unload the plane and they searched it all.

There are 12 stations on a 727-200 and each station has a cookie sheet that pallets of cargo go on. On this flight station 12 was BBQ sauce. Cookie sheet with 4 pallets of the stuff. Each pallet was stacked with cases of BBQ and each case had 6 bottles of BBQ.

So there we are on the ramp with all the pallets off loaded. The cops go right to the BBQ and have the ramp tear down the pallets. They open a case of BBQ and nothing. But then they tear apart the cardboard inside the case that separates the bottles of BBQ and there is cocain stuffed inside the card board.

The BBQ was on our GenDec so the crew and airline were off the hook. Near as we could figure someone didn't get paid and ratted out the operation. Those cops showed up and knew exactly what they were after.
 
Alexb2000 said:
You guys should watch cocaine cowboys (1st one). It's a documentary in part about flying drugs. Willingness to do it is one thing, skill (for those other than Henning of course) is another. How about flying 10 AGL over water for 800 miles in dark night conditions and then shooting an unpublished approach into a farm field with a couple of pickup truck lights. Oh yeah, if you crash, get hurt, break down, run low on gas, anything, then expect to be shot and thrown in some hole, so no pressure.

Most just can't handle that kind of thing.
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That all changed in the 80s though. Mickey was pre 'War on Drugs' he flew for Ocholo and the Medellin cartel who Bush vowed to put out of business because of his psycho pit bull shooting up all of South Florida. Once the shipments started coming from Calais cartel stuff was protected flying into Mena Arkansas with troopers providing the security and Madison Guarantee processing Clinton's skim. At the same time operations in So America selective target defoliation by air of competing sources and suppliers as well as spending many billions of tax money on the interdiction of competing shipment and using the proceeds of the seizures and such to fund law enforcement programs that congress would not fund.

The answer you need to asses the risk is "Who are you flying for?" If you're flying for the right people the risk is very low.
 
Henning said:
The answer you need to asses the risk is "Who are you flying for?" If you're flying for the right people the risk is very low.
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You would describe the risk as very low????

How about the skills required?
 
rainsux said:
I flew a few new planes back from ICT in the 1970's. I always maxed out the load with Coors, but it was all for personal consumption.
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Don't you know that taking Coors Beer east of the Mississippi is Bootleggin'!
 
Alexb2000 said:
No doubt a continuation of someone's "corporate flight".
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Yeah, and they didn't seem the least bit grateful. :dunno: But then rather than their intended destination we went to a DEA disposal facility.


Fearless Tower said:
Did you put a snowlake on the bird?
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Actually the snowflake is reserved for the units actually making the bust, we were just transport after the fact.
 
I had B61's under the wings one day, clearly prohibited by treaty less than 200nm from Vladivostok - should I have declined?
 
Send it ALL East. We already have ten thousand varieties of bottled water.

Coors Light... ... isn't that redundant!?

Something like making love in a canoe.
 
rainsux said:
I flew a few new planes back from ICT in the 1970's. I always maxed out the load with Coors, but it was all for personal consumption.
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SO True! Back in the 70's we couldn't get Coors in the state of Washington. You would think it was the holy grail of beer. I flew it home any chance I got.
 
kgruber said:
SO True! Back in the 70's we couldn't get Coors in the state of Washington. You would think it was the holy grail of beer. I flew it home any chance I got.
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Rocky Mountain Trout P&*$. Or something like that.

Taking the tour of the Coors brewery many years (decades) ago the question was asked about the difference between their 3.2 beer and their regular beer. The answer was that for the 3.2 runs they make sure it is no more than 3.2% alcohol. Their regular runs are about that anyway, but for the 3.2 runs they make sure.

Not like some good Belgian dark beer I had many decades ago, that's for certain. :D
 
> ... bootleggin'!

1975-1977. I suspect I was probably breaking some (tax?) regs. But it was an
infreq/unsched thing.

>> SO True! Back in the 70's we couldn't get Coors in the state of ...

Ditto for Ohio & Michigan. I think my single biggest haul was 50-something cases in a
C4<something><something>. All for personal consumption. Yep. Personal consumption.
The beer was free to friends. The transportation fee was $10/6-pack.

Gawd, I did some truly stoopid things back then. I once hauled 800# of gunpowder
and a parrot!

I knew of some folks that were rumored to fly contraband. They never invited me,
and I never inquired.

>>> Mena, AR

I don't know when the illegal things began at Mena. I was trying to deliver
a new T210 to Seattle. No radio, but a FGP. I was trying to pick my way
thru a monster storm and got no farther than Mena. I planned to sit out
the wx, but the locals were exceptionally unwelcoming. No hotels/motels.
No info. No rides. No restaurant. No, you cannot sleep on the FBO couch.
Everything was: No. No. No. No. No.

So I flew back (scud run) to LIT and spent 5-days trying to wait-out the storms.
I was running out of time (had to return to school), so I departed LIT,
formation IFR (NORDO), flying on a the wing C206 with navcoms. Stoopid.
Stoopid. Stoopid.
 
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Alexb2000 said:
You would describe the risk as very low????

How about the skills required?
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One well known "world champion" waterskier got busted for flying drugs (MJ I think) across the Mexican border about 15 years ago. From what I know he screwed himself by bragging to "friends". Another well known skier went to jail for smuggling Coke inside waterskis. I don't know if that area of interest is unusually well stocked with smugglers or if they just tend to get caught.

I also recall hearing about a fellow pilot's attorney (on Beechtalk?) who lost his airplane to the Feds even though it was pretty clear that he had no idea that his charter pax brought drugs along.
 
bartmc said:
Seems that would be a textbook definition of entrapment.
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No it isn't. Entrapment is the government actor making you do something illegal that you wouldn't normally do.

"Can you carry this for me?" "Sure, load it up!" Not entrapment. You had the opportunity to say no but didn't do so.

"Can you carry this for me? And you better say yes, or I'll break your legs and kill your little dog." "Umm. Sure, load it up!" Most definitely entrapment. You didn't have the opportunity to say no.

Entrapment has been expanded where the government actor has made repeated requests to the point of annoyance.

"Can you do this?" "No."
"Can you do this?" "No."
"Can you do this?" "No."
"Can you do this?" "Dammit! I said no!"
"Pretty please?" "Shut up!"
"Pretty please with sugar on top?" "Oh, fine, if you'll shut up, then load it up." Entrapment. ( Sorrells v. United States)

Oh, and with trafficking nowadays, you won't know that you're a mule. Lots of busts recently around vehicular border crossings where they notice you drive across, plant contraband while you're away from your vehicle, follow you back across (or tell their cohorts on the other side who to follow) and collect the contraband on the other side with the mule none-the-wiser.

--Carlos V.
 
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