Almost Had To Sell The Plane

Rushie said:
It's not. It just happened to my husband. He was "reorganized" out earlier this year. He turns 64 in December. Age discrimination pure and simple. Big severance package in exchange for not suing for age discrimination. *******s actually bolded that paragraph indicating that that's exactly what it was. We knew it and they knew it and their lawyers bolded it so everyone would clearly know that's exactly what they were doing.
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What company?
 
Good for you Don. That has happened to me a few times over the last 35 years. Your advice about debt free is spot on. We worked to pay off the house and kept cars for a long time. Once the car was paid off we banked the car payments for several years while driving the old cars. Eventually we had enough to start paying cash for vehicles. Living with out debt does eliminate a lot of stress from you life.
Bill Jennings said:
And, those who get severances should count themselves lucky. Many companies just cut you, period. And, when they also get rid of some young deadwood in the same round of cutbacks, it's much harder to make the age discrimination dog hunt.
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Most companies now have eliminated the defined benefit pension plan that made you a target as you approach retirement age. It has also eliminated any reason for young people to stay at a company. 401ks are portable and vacation is negotiable these days. The company I work for pays well, but young people still jump ship at the first opportunity. They are worried about the “grey tsunami” as well.
 
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Jim_CAK said:
Good for you Don. That has happened to me a few times over the last 35 years. Your advice about debt free is spot on. We worked to pay off the house and kept cars for a long time. Once the car was paid off we banked the car payments for several years while driving the old cars. Eventually we had enough to start paying cash for vehicles. Living with out debt does eliminate a lot of stress from you life. Most companies now have eliminated the defined benefit pension plan that made you a target as you approach retirement age. It has also eliminated any reason for young people to stay at a company. 401ks are portable and vacation is negotiable these days. The company I work for pays well, but young people still jump ship at the first opportunity. They are worried about the “grey tsunami” as well.
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This is exactly why I prefer 401ks. My money is mine.
 
Stingray Don said:
After 22 years of working for AT&T, my position was eliminated in March of last year. I was off work for 5 months before I landed a contract position as a project manager. The project wrapped up two months ago and have been out of work since. My beloved 172N is my biggest expense and without income, it was about to go on the market. Yesterday I was offered a job with BC Forward (PMO for Eli Lilly) as a project manager. I will be working at the Eli Lilly campus here in Indy. It is step down in position and compensation from what I had at AT&T, but it will pay the bills and allow me to keep flying N8050E. I think a celebratory flight and perhaps a $100 hamburger may be in order today!

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Congrats on the new job!!!
 
Rushie said:
It's not. It just happened to my husband. He was "reorganized" out earlier this year. He turns 64 in December. Age discrimination pure and simple. Big severance package in exchange for not suing for age discrimination. *******s actually bolded that paragraph indicating that that's exactly what it was. We knew it and they knew it and their lawyers bolded it so everyone would clearly know that's exactly what they were doing.
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I "retired" in 2007, as in, I took early retirement from my employer. Went looking for a Fed job, to double-dip, so to speak, and was curious to see how my age affected my job search - and found it was 'inverted"; the retirement stampede from Uncle Sam was starting, and several agencies were glad to see me. If there was age bias, I didn't pick up on it. I also presumed being a white male would shove me down the list, and while I did perceive some of that, there were other agencies that clearly didn't care about age, race, gender, being a cyclops, or a Druid. . .just bring the skill set.

The pay sucks, of course - but I knew all that going in. Somewhat by buying back my military time for retirement.
 
Stingray Don said:
After 22 years of working for AT&T, my position was eliminated in March of last year. I was off work for 5 months before I landed a contract position as a project manager. The project wrapped up two months ago and have been out of work since. My beloved 172N is my biggest expense and without income, it was about to go on the market. Yesterday I was offered a job with BC Forward (PMO for Eli Lilly) as a project manager. I will be working at the Eli Lilly campus here in Indy. It is step down in position and compensation from what I had at AT&T, but it will pay the bills and allow me to keep flying N8050E. I think a celebratory flight and perhaps a $100 hamburger may be in order today!

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Congrats. Nice bird. Sorry to hear about the slight downgrade. Guess no cheese on the 100 dollar hamburger! Gotta make cuts where you can! Eli Lilly is a great company with a solid product line
 
Rushie said:
It's not. It just happened to my husband. He was "reorganized" out earlier this year. He turns 64 in December. Age discrimination pure and simple. Big severance package in exchange for not suing for age discrimination. *******s actually bolded that paragraph indicating that that's exactly what it was. We knew it and they knew it and their lawyers bolded it so everyone would clearly know that's exactly what they were doing.
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VERY sorry to hear that. :( I hope the severance package was plenty big, and that he can find something else soon (assuming he is looking, that is).
 
Stingray Don said:
In my case, I am vested in my pension and 401k, so that wasn’t an issue. The retiree health benefits was important for me, so now it is not likely that I will be able to retire early.
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Being vested in the 401k is a big deal. Really that's the main employee retention program that exists. I was laid off two jobs ago about 2 months before I hit full vesting in the 401k, which I don't think was accidental. I was still 80% vested, though, so most of the way there on the matching.

I started getting recruited for this job a couple months before hitting full vesting at the last job, and got my offer 2 weeks before I hit the full vesting point. I said "Ok, I accept your offer, but I have to work here another two weeks before I can turn in my notice." The current company was very understanding.

Full vesting + 1 day, check the 401k, "Hey boss, got a minute?" :)
 
CC268 said:
That seems to be very common amongst large corporations, unfortunately. My current employer does this all the time (another large aerospace corporation). When I first graduated I interviewed at a small company. The owner knew I was also interviewing at the current large corporation I am at now. He warned me about that exact thing. Thought he might just be blowing smoke, but he was right on.
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Stingray Don said:
Yeah, I had been surplused several times over the years but always landed a new role. This time they just eliminated are whole office. I was just a few weeks shy of retirement benefits. Still a sore spot for me.
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Glad to hear you landed on your feet!

It's the reason I left Big Oil in the '90s. Used to be a great place to work. Then turned into a "waiting for the next layoff to start"environment. Have worked for myself in companies I co-founded for more than 20 years now. Started the latest partnership two years ago. Working my freakin' azz off, but at least there's some control over ones life and the outcomes.

Made a vow to myself when I left; I'll never work in a company that is not growing ever again. Companies that are slowly shrinking are s****y places to spend your life. Wish I had figured that out a few years earlier than I did.
 
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azure said:
VERY sorry to hear that. :( I hope the severance package was plenty big, and that he can find something else soon (assuming he is looking, that is).
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Thanks. Yes it was just as @SkyDog58 said, they worked out the exact size of severance package that made it not worth our while to sue them. Fortunately we are in good enough shape financially that we can actually retire now if we choose, somewhat less comfortably than we wanted to, but still pretty well off. I have a pension that just kicked in and it includes health insurance, so we are both covered fully now and secondary to Medicare when we each hit 65, so that's a load off our minds. I'm still working as an independent contractor and plan to as long as I have a functioning brain so that brings in some irregular money.

Yes he is looking. He's getting lots of interviews but no offer yet. It looks suspiciously like once they realize his age they lose interest or maybe they interview him so they can document in the record that they are considering "old" people and not discriminating. He's almost 64 but will work to 70 if the job is a good fit.
 
Rushie said:
Yes he is looking. He's getting lots of interviews but no offer yet. It looks suspiciously like once they realize his age they lose interest or maybe they interview him so they can document in the record that they are considering "old" people and not discriminating. He's almost 64 but will work to 70 if the job is a good fit.
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If he is getting lots of interviews then I doubt they're all just doing it to check a box. Most likely he *will* get an offer before too long. But I very much understand the heebie-jeebies about this, had them myself when I was on the job hunt that landed my present position. I didn't even get many interviews, in fact two in all, and only one offer... but then again very few academic openings exist after February. I sent in a total of something like 8 applications and was very much afraid that my age would nix any chances I might have had. But for some reason, this place called me back right away.

Keeping my fingers crossed for you guys. It's good to hear that you are reasonably secure in the short run as is, but I suspect things will get better. :thumbsup:
 
genna said:
First, you can get better deals on cars if you do NOT pay cash(dealers get some money from the lenders). Nothing stops you from paying off that loan in a month or two. However, in many cases(although that is changing now with rates climbing), the interest is lower than inflation and way lower than you could otherwise make with disciplined investment of that cash. Even if just using that cash for paying down mortgage faster. This is even more true for longer loans such as house purchase.

Paying down 3% cheap mortgage with today's more valuable dollars(rather than 20-year-from now 50% less valuable dollar) while missing out on potential 6-10% investment return is not the best financial strategy. Easiest and maybe safest, but not best.

https://financialmentor.com/investment-advice/pay-off-mortgage-early-or-invest/7478
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This is excellent advice if your in your 30's-40's as you are at one of the most robust periord of your earnings... However, in my personal opinion, once you get past the 50 year mark you should really look to get the mortgage monkey off your back and soon... Even if your earnings are in a good stride....

As for a car 100% correct... our last car we bought, we hammered them on the price and let them give us a 7% loan when we qualified for the 1% financing knowing full well the loan was getting paid off with the first payment.. Got a letter form Toyota Credit the next week, called the 800 number, got the pay off balance, and the check was to them 20 minutes later... Funny, we got a call from the dealership after a few weeks... thought they were checking up on ow we liked the car, etc.... there was one very upset sales manager on the other end...
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Being vested in the 401k is a big deal. Really that's the main employee retention program that exists. I was laid off two jobs ago about 2 months before I hit full vesting in the 401k, which I don't think was accidental. I was still 80% vested, though, so most of the way there on the matching.

I started getting recruited for this job a couple months before hitting full vesting at the last job, and got my offer 2 weeks before I hit the full vesting point. I said "Ok, I accept your offer, but I have to work here another two weeks before I can turn in my notice." The current company was very understanding.

Full vesting + 1 day, check the 401k, "Hey boss, got a minute?" :)
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Meh. 20% of the employer match? That can't have been that much. Sure, if you can swing it to lock that up, great. Go ahead and do it. But I am doubtful that that amount would make a huge difference if you're moving on to an attractive new position.
 
PPC1052 said:
Meh. 20% of the employer match? That can't have been that much. Sure, if you can swing it to lock that up, great. Go ahead and do it. But I am doubtful that that amount would make a huge difference if you're moving on to an attractive new position.
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The vesting policy at the 2nd job I referenced that I quit was 0% vesting until 3 years, then 100% vesting. So that was a big deal.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
The vesting policy at the 2nd job I referenced that I quit was 0% vesting until 3 years, then 100% vesting. So that was a big deal.
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I guess I got confuzzled. Conflated the second job with the first. Reading comprehension.
 
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