Aaaand the Delta scamming begins ...

[BigBadLou]

I need to vent.

We bought a pair of airline tickets to Europe to go see family. It is our fault that we agreed to fly Delta. Again. Against our own judgment and past bad experience. I guess we forgot how Delta scammed us last time we flew to Europe (6 years ago or so).

Back then, we bought some decent tickets about 1/2 year ahead (so that there were still good flights and seats available). Got a nice direct flight from Texas to New York, then to Frankfurt and then on. About a month before the flight, I looked at our reservation online and to my disbelief, the flight to New York has been canceled and our tickets were invalid. Glad that I noticed! I called up Delta immediately just to be told that they could not fill the flight and they will reroute us, no problem. Yes, through Miami and Detroit (or similar, can't recall exact hubs). So practically, they collected our money for a direct flight and then put us on empty flights they could not fill across the nation, adding about half a day to our travels just across the US. We had no choice to accept.
Then a week later, they canceled our return flight from New York to Texas. Again, no notification. I had to call and they rerouted us via BFE (I think they originally offered SLC).

Best part? Week before our actual trip, Delta recreated the direct flights to and from New York. Same flights, same duration, same airplane, same times. Well, nearly. Plus/minus 5 minutes from the original timetable. And a slightly different flight number. That way, it was "not" illegal. And the tickets for each flight were logically more than our whole tickets to Europe.

Can you say illegal Delta scam? Sure. Could we get on those new direct flights? Not without paying a few thousand extra, we were told. So instead, we told Delta to go suck a lemon and canceled the continental legs with them, got a partial refund and took a chance on the timing (weather was forecast to be great anyway) and bought cheap direct tickets on a great airline JetBlue.


Soooo, fast forward to this year. A week ago, we made the mistake of giving Delta our money again. For a transatlantic flight. Direct to the eastern seaboard. And we expected to fly that route. Oh how foolish we can be.

Today, I received an email from Delta regarding "minor" changes in the trip schedule.
A big improvement over last time, at least they sent an email about how they are enjoying raping us up our a**es.

Sorry for the long story but I just cannot believe such practices are legal.
So my question to you smart people (pilots) is: WHAT CAN WE ACTUALLY DO ABOUT IT? Do we have any recourse?
I mean besides calling Apu in customer service again just to hear "vee are soorry but there is noothing vee can doo".

 

[oregonboy109]

So my question to you smart people (pilots) is: WHAT CAN WE ACTUALLY DO ABOUT IT? Do we have any recourse?

Fly United?

 

[BigBadLou]

Fly United?

I wish it was as easy as telling Delta "we don't like how you steal our money and scam us, we will go to a different airline" since airline tickets can only be purchased for "partner" airlines. You can't choose to fly good airlines, you are stuck with partners. It's like elementary school all over. Can't pick a classmate, you might get stuck with a paste-eater or window-licker.

 

[Henning]

I have found the pricing model has changed, buying tickets far in advance is no longer particularly advantageous, and I often get considerably better prices booking 24-48 hrs out than 2 weeks.

 

[jesse]

I have found the pricing model has changed, buying tickets far in advance is no longer particularly advantageous, and I often get considerably better prices booking 24-48 hrs out than 2 weeks.

I find 2 months to work well. You can get a hell of a deal at 24 to 48 hours if the flight isn't selling well. If it is selling well it'll cost about triple what it would have 2 months before.

 

[kayoh190]

Honestly, as much as I love to give my Delta pilot friends crap about their stupid wind checks and the fact they seem to go nordo more than anyone else - they run a better airline than any of the other legacy carriers, including mine.

I'm sorry you had a bad experience Lou, but it's not really any better anywhere else. At least in the US.

 

[Henning]

Honestly, as much as I love to give my Delta pilot friends crap about their stupid wind checks and the fact they seem to go nordo more than anyone else - they run a better airline than any of the other legacy carriers, including mine.

I'm sorry you had a bad experience Lou, but it's not really any better anywhere else. At least in the US.

Yep, if you want to fly for the service and travel experience, fly a foreign airline. If you want to fly for the cheapest price pick a US airline. We won't even begin on the eye candy aspect.

 

[JHW]

I never buy an airline ticket more than 2 weeks ahead of time, it's just asking for trouble. Typically between australia and the US I'll buy my ticket the morning of the prior day.

 

[Henning]

I never buy an airline ticket more than 2 weeks ahead of time, it's just asking for trouble. Typically between australia and the US I'll buy my ticket the morning of the prior day.

Yep, I do the same thing, even business class.

 

[SkyHog]

Most of my flights are booked within a week of departure since I have no idea when/where I am flying.

I get pretty good prices there. I also don't fly Delta or United anymore. American only for me now.

 

[comanchepilot]

We've got American, Delta and United. Or, you can fly British Airways, Lufthansa. Etc etc etc.

Don't fly Alitalia.

 

[TazzyTazzy]

I think there's an Asian based airline that has smoking deals all the time now. #toosoon?

I like Eva airlines. I despise Cathay Pacific due to their knee crushing, non-reclining seats...they slide down and forward, thoroughly smashing your knees into the seat in front of you.

 

[Jay Honeck]

One word: Lufthansa.

Two words: Free beer. All the way to Germany.

Good beer, too.

 

[timwinters]

Thanks for the heads up Lou. We're contemplating a trip to Europe this year and I didn't know they pulled this crap.

 

[JOhnH]

My experience was different. I had booked a RT flight to Paris with a return trip out of Barcelona. We booked their upgraded coach seats on the way out and Business class on the return trip. Delta cancelled our departure flight, but put us on the next flight and upgraded us to Business class for no charge.

Delta service has degraded over the years, but with everyone using the internet and 99% of the people selecting the airline that is a nickel cheaper, regardless of other factors, they have have little choice but to cut as many corners as they can. I just hope they aren't cutting safety corners.

And as Henning has said, I have given up on the hopes of a little eye candy on any domestic flight, and that makes each flight seem much longer and the seats more noticeably uncomfortable. Fortunately, I rarely fly commercial.

 

[Gerhardt]

My one and only bad flying experience was also with Delta. Our family of 4 showed up plenty early to check in for a flight from Pensacola to STL. It's slow, but we finally make our way to the front of the line, only one woman checking in bags. Except she's helping a customer and it's going on and on and on. I can hear what it's about. He thinks he's been cheated out of frequent flier miles and she doesn't think so. So we're a minute or so from our required check-in and I walk up and try to tell her that I need to make the check-in requirement. "Sir, you need to get back in line." So I do.

10-15 minutes later they finally finish and I'm told that it's too late to catch our flight because we didn't make the check-in time requirement. We had to catch a flight later in the day at a cost of over $400 more.

Never again, even if their flights happen to be cheaper.

 

[wsuffa]

I certainly wouldn't call it "scamming", especially if you read the contract of carriage (CoC) that you implicitly agreed to whey you bought the tickets. ("What, you mean you didn't read all the several hundred pages!?!?")

Essentially you buy transportation from point A to point B. The CoC gives them the right to alter the route of transportation and/or the specific planes involved (even the class of service, in some cases) to accommodate a variety of changes. Including flight cancellations or changes. So they said they'd get you there via a plane-change rather than a non-stop or "direct" flight (and yes, "non-stop" and "direct" are different)? They're still carrying you from Point A to Point B for the same fare. That's all that's technically required. USDoT won't do anything because it's in compliance with their CoC & all FAA rules. They followed the rules.

It gets stickier if you buy a ticket in First or Business and they move you to coach. Rarely happens, but does sometimes especially when there are weather cancellations/delays. Their obliged to get you there, and in some cases refund the difference. They prioritize the accommodation by fare class, so a full-fare first class ticket will get priority over a discount ticket.... and on most airlines the priority after that goes to the elite members of the frequent flyer program (Diamond, then Platinum, then Gold, then dirt). Oh, and some fares sold as "first class" are really coach tickets with built-in upgrades (done to avoid corporate travel policies that prohibit "first class" tickets).... in case of travel changes, those are treated as coach tickets.

No, it's not fair that they get to make voluntary schedule changes but you don't get to on discount fares. Yes, there are a lot of other things that are not fair about the way things work. Until or unless the Feds decide to re-regulate the industry it's not going to change.

If you think any other airline is better, think again. Each has it's flaws - United, AA/US, Southwest, JetBlue. And each has it's high points. After putting my butt in their airline seats for years (and millions of miles), I've concluded that Delta currently has about the best customer service of the "legacies". AA was pretty good to elite frequent flyers, until US bought them. Southwest has about the best change & baggage policies. JetBlue was great until Wall Street investors made them add more seats and institute bag fees to increase profits. And with consolidation & elimination of competition, it's gotten worse, not better.

(On AA, for example, I took an "award" flight in business class from DCA-SYD and return via JFK. It was all on "saver" awards using AA miles. Got the saver awards from DC-JFK-SYD-JFK, but it was never made available from JFK-DCA on the return. I had a choice: I could burn a separate award at the "high" level, or I could buy a ticket from JFK-DCA. DL sold me a cash ticket in coach (upgraded to First Class) for that one segment for about half of what AA wanted for a coach-only ticket. AA's plane flew half-full.)

The grass really isn't any greener on the other side of the fence.

 

[EdFred]

My sister, who is whatever the premier Delta member is called, says to call back, and go up the supervisory chain, and explain the situation, and they should make it right. She's been through this and hasn't had an issue getting back what she originally booked.

 

[guardrail]

FYI Norwegian is running non-stop's on 787's from their hubs in the US to their hubs in Europe at extremely low rates. Just booked my window seat from Orlando to Norway for less than $1000 round trip...

Also picking up a few jumps in Europe while I'm there to go over to the mainland.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Maybe try to be less of a bigot and treat the Delta customer service reps with respect and you will be more successful.

 

[AggieMike88]

One word: Lufthansa.

Two words: Free beer. All the way to Germany.

Good beer, too.

and with Lufthansa departing direct out of DFW, that's along Lou's route of travel.

 

[wsuffa]

FYI Norwegian is running non-stop's on 787's from their hubs in the US to their hubs in Europe at extremely low rates. Just booked my window seat from Orlando to Norway for less than $1000 round trip...

Also picking up a few jumps in Europe while I'm there to go over to the mainland.

Is that the airline that ALPA and some of the others have tried to stop?

 

[Gerhardt]

Just saw a headline about a plane sliding off the runway at LaGuardia. Couldn't have happened to a nicer airline.

 

[steingar]

You pay months in advance and you've just invested in the airline. Not an investment I would knowingly make.

 

[Ghery]

We've got American, Delta and United. Or, you can fly British Airways, Lufthansa. Etc etc etc.

Don't fly Alitalia.

Amen. I used them in 2009 for some travel in Europe and I won't go near them again.

I think there's an Asian based airline that has smoking deals all the time now. #toosoon?

I like Eva airlines. I despise Cathay Pacific due to their knee crushing, non-reclining seats...they slide down and forward, thoroughly smashing your knees into the seat in front of you.

Interesting. I've had good luck with Cathay Pacific in the past. Is this something new? I've only ridden Eva once, and I have no complaints about that experience. Evergreen Deluxe in a 747 Combi.

One word: Lufthansa.

Two words: Free beer. All the way to Germany.

Good beer, too.

My only concern with LH is legroom, and the last time I rode them in 2009 they seemed to have solved that (much to everyone's surprise). I will NEVER complain about their customer service, however. They have done very well for me in the past in that regard.

 

[guardrail]

Is that the airline that ALPA and some of the others have tried to stop?

Yes, they tried to stop financing for the 787's siting the the below market financing would get Nowegian a competitive edge over US airlines.

"The US Export-Import Bank's below-market financing saves foreign airlines millions of dollars in financing costs when purchasing widebody airliners," said Tim Canoll, ALPA's president. "These foreign airlines then use these US taxpayer-subsidised state-of-the-art aircraft to compete with US airlines in the international marketplace."

 

[SCCutler]

Maybe try to be less of a bigot and treat the Delta customer service reps with respect and you will be more successful.

?

You were listening in, then?

 

[Mason]

Yep, if you want to fly for the service and travel experience, fly a foreign airline. If you want to fly for the cheapest price pick a US airline. We won't even begin on the eye candy aspect.

And if you don't want your flight to disappear into the ocean, you should fly.....

 

[ettsn]

I fly plenty on Delta, and typically have a pretty good experience (1MM, PLT).

BUT if you want to experience a completely higher level of customer service, fly Emirates. That's my carrier of choice to DXB, and everything about it is wonderful.

 

[KSCessnaDriver]

Yes, they tried to stop financing for the 787's siting the the below market financing would get Nowegian a competitive edge over US airlines.

"The US Export-Import Bank's below-market financing saves foreign airlines millions of dollars in financing costs when purchasing widebody airliners," said Tim Canoll, ALPA's president. "These foreign airlines then use these US taxpayer-subsidised state-of-the-art aircraft to compete with US airlines in the international marketplace."

That's not what ALPA is really concerned about. They're concerned about using a flag of convenience, which is exactly what Norwegian is trying to do by running the whole scheme out of Ireland.

 

[Skyscraper]

Best time to buy (according to some story I read and don't want to look for), is 6 weeks prior to the flight. I had some friends I'm flying Virgin with tomorrow buy theirs 8 weeks out and I bought 6 weeks out. I saved $200+ on my tickets.