A question for the lawyers

pmanton

pmanton

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What is the rationale for laws that protect squatters at the expense of property owners?

We just returned from evicting squatters from a property we have for sale. We did it by entering the property and physically ordering them out.

We found out that if the squatters had been smart they could have called the police and had US thrown out and obtained a protection order against us--the property owners. :mad2:

WTF ? The squatters were treating our property as their own. It was obvious that they were in it for the long term.

So why on earth are we burdened with laws that protect thieves at the expense of the rightful property owners?

Paul
Salome, AZ
 
pmanton said:
What is the rationale for laws that protect squatters at the expense of property owners?

We just returned from evicting squatters from a property we have for sale. We did it by entering the property and physically ordering them out.

We found out that if the squatters had been smart they could have called the police and had US thrown out and obtained a protection order against us--the property owners. :mad2:

WTF ? The squatters were treating our property as their own. It was obvious that they were in it for the long term.

So why on earth are we burdened with laws that protect thieves at the expense of the rightful property owners?

Paul
Salome, AZ
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Because Liberalism is a Mental Disorder, and Liberals have had control of the lawmaking an judicial process since FDR.
 
pmanton said:
So why on earth are we burdened with laws that protect thieves at the expense of the rightful property owners?
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Paflyer said it. Because, the bleeding hearts value the votes they can buy with allowing criminals to prosper.
 
"Squatters Rights" as you read it from time to time in the media has to do with adverse possession over a long period of time. It's a practical matter dating from a time when it was hard to know where one property began and another one ended.

So if you're a farmer and you let your cows graze on a piece of land, then eventually erect a barn, build a fence around it - over a long period of time (10 to 30 years), the land will legally become yours. The thinking was this would encourage owners to periodically checking up on their property boundaries themselves, rather than leaving that until generations later and trying to unwind the mess.

However, you have to live openly like this for years - you can't just break into a house and 'adverse possess' it over a weekend.

There's no rights to the squatters in that case - except that you can't personally forcefully remove the squatters, any more than you can forcefully remove any other person who stands in your way. You have to let the court and police deal with that.

But that doesn't have to do with squatter rights - just general use of force.
 
Basically the entire United States is a "squatter country" stolen from the original inhabitants through genocidal acts not only against them, but the bison as well.
 
Henning said:
Basically the entire United States is a "squatter country" stolen from the original inhabitants through genocidal acts not only against them, but the bison as well.
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White man speak with forked tongue, huh?

Who did the Indians steal the land from? :rolleyes:
 
There are good uses of adverse possession - for example to resolve an old surveying error. If you built a house and your neighbor later claims that the property line runs through your front parlor, adverse possession would suggest that you own the property by virtue of you having used it and your neighbor having not complained about it.

Bad uses of adverse possession come about from time to time, especially when very liberal anti-eviction laws prevent a landowner from removing the squatter. Fortunately the laws in the US are pretty well defined and it is somewhat difficult to achieve ownership this way, depending on the locale.

Do you have a specific situation that you're curious about?
 
I have only vacant land but watch for it all the time, post those ugly signs, keep the fences/gates up. It's more difficult for them in Texas, but I just wouldn't want to have the problem. Idiotic laws. How have they not extended that thinking to our belongings, our bank accounts?
 
RotorAndWing said:
Speaking of "genocidal acts", there was this country called "Germany"........ever hear of it? :rolleyes:
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Yeah, what's that got to do with anything? If it wasn't for the terms of the Treaty of Versailles it would have never happened. Greed always leads to genocide. Now, what was your point?:dunno:
 
paflyer said:
Because Liberalism is a Mental Disorder, and Liberals have had control of the lawmaking an judicial process since FDR.
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Gee!! I didn't know Ronnie was a liberal! WOW! I also didn't think Nixon was a liberal! WOW. However I did think Ronnie was not too bright and Nixon was physco . ( Ronnie was the one who started letting illegal Mexicans, etc. Into the country, three million but promised that would be all. )
 
Matthew said:
How is "squatter" different from "trespasser"?
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LDJones said:
Length of stay, mostly.
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Specifically in this instance.

I have heard of people moving into a house when the owners were away. Sometimes due to fraud, they thought they "bought" it, and sometimes just because they could. Once they were in, it was tough to get them out. That's what the OP seems to be dealing with. I'm wondering, too, how there is a difference?
 
Henning said:
You shoot it out, last man standing keeps the property.
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Just thinking, if the squatters have been there long enough, it can be considered their "lawful abode", and thus can shoot the owner NQA who comes and enters his own property?
 
mtuomi said:
Just thinking, if the squatters have been there long enough, it can be considered their "lawful abode", and thus can shoot the owner NQA who comes and enters his own property?
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If he's entering unlawfully and the tenant is afraid for his life, sure.

I have some rentals and even though the lease says I can enter the premises at reasonable times for inspection and repair, I still have to obtain permission from the tenant. I can't just use my key and help myself in. Not in this county anyway. If I enter w/o permission I am trespassing.
 
pmanton said:
What is the rationale for laws that protect squatters at the expense of property owners?

We just returned from evicting squatters from a property we have for sale. We did it by entering the property and physically ordering them out.

We found out that if the squatters had been smart they could have called the police and had US thrown out and obtained a protection order against us--the property owners. :mad2:

WTF ? The squatters were treating our property as their own. It was obvious that they were in it for the long term.

So why on earth are we burdened with laws that protect thieves at the expense of the rightful property owners?

Paul
Salome, AZ
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First, what rights a "squatter" has depends on state law and specific sets of facts. So, without more, no one knows whether what you "found out" is correct in your situation or not.

That aside, in many states (I don't know if its true for Arizona) "self-help" ejection of trespassers is prohibited, the usual reason being to avoid breaches of the peace. Even commercial B2B) repossession statutes typically specify that there cannot be a breach of the peace. In some, even the "normal" eviction process is expedited.

Might be viewed as an allegorical "bleeding heart" thing but the general idea is to prevent real "bleeding hearts," as ridiculous as the whole idea of people killing each other over property might seem (unless, of course, one reads the history of the world since humans appeared).
 
Gerhardt said:
If he's entering unlawfully and the tenant is afraid for his life, sure.

I have some rentals and even though the lease says I can enter the premises at reasonable times for inspection and repair, I still have to obtain permission from the tenant. I can't just use my key and help myself in. Not in this county anyway. If I enter w/o permission I am trespassing.
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Pretty sure that squatters are not going to have a lease.
 
Henning said:
Where the basis of the laws date back to and came from.
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You've got it confused, nothing to do with anything you've added to this thread. As usual, you're making stuff up again.


Back on topic, the OP had it easy getting rid of his squatters. What you need to do to get them out depends on you state and county, as others have posted earlier.
 
Henning said:
Basically the entire United States is a "squatter country" stolen from the original inhabitants through genocidal acts not only against them, but the bison as well.
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True, but most people don't want to acknowledge stuff like that and I doubt that has anything to do with squatters rights.
 
Henning said:
Basically the entire United States is a "squatter country" stolen from the original inhabitants through genocidal acts not only against them, but the bison as well.
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If you are referring to what we call indians, they were doing that to themselves long before the white eyes showed up.

Heck, they are still doing it.
 
I thought in Texas at least, squatters must have taken over the property tax payments and have spent money and time on any parcel before they have rights. The landowner by way of paying the ad val taxes retains title to the property whether he's there or not.

If they just move in and use stuff, that's trespassing.
 
I thought in Texas at least, squatters must have taken over the property tax payments
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Ah. In Texas someone is just going to shoot them anyway. No legal battles to worry about.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Ah. In Texas someone is just going to shoot them anyway. No legal battles to worry about.
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Yeah, you're right. We'd be dealing with criminal law in Texas.

I'd get Dick DeGuerin to convince the jury I shot them and let the hogs eat them because I'm eccentric. :lol:
 
txflyer said:
Yeah, you're right. We'd be dealing with criminal law in Texas.

I'd get Dick DeGuerin to convince the jury I shot them and let the hogs eat them because I'm eccentric. :lol:
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What happened to the "they needed killing" defense?
 
Interesting that this thread just came up. My neighbor who's moving out of State would love it if Adverse Posession could clean up a problem he found when putting his house up for sale.

He started with a survey, and that's when the problem was found.

House sits on 4 acres in a subdivision. Many (unknown) years ago before he purchased the house, the neighboring house owner accidentally "squared off" a portion of the property.

Imagine if you will, lots that are four acres in basically pie slice shapes, but not to a point. Chop off the point in the back for a path that runs behind them all.

His former neighbor squared the line to the road and built his fence along it. His fence at the rear/tip of the pie is at the property line marker. At the street side, he came straight forward instead of the angle needed to make the pie shape.

Cut off about 1/4 acre.

The former neighbor even moved his fence back from what he thought was the easement and horse trail required between the properties. Therefore moving the horse trail over.

Total encroachment at the front? 53'. The fence, horse trail, signage for the horse trail, etc... All wrong as long as the guy selling has lived there, which is 12 years.

New neighbors moved into that place 18 months ago. No records of when the fence or the now well-mature line of trees and shrubs along the fence went in.

Colorado says 18 years. If they can prove 18 years of encroachment, it's theirs.

Guy selling the house lets them know. They say they can't find any documentation on the age of the fence.

Plan B. They go to the County courthouse and ask if he can simply give the 1/4 acre away. No can do. A) County won't let a subdivision be re-divided at all, citing expenses to redraw the plats. B) Can't give the land away. Even if it was a sellable plat, which it's not, a sale must take place and taxes must be assessed. This would also change the tax burden for both pieces of property and require that reassessment also.

Can't give it away, can't sell it. Doesn't care that the fence is 53' on his side of the line.

Realtor says "in Colorado, now that you've notified them, it's their problem". He's moved ahead with the house sale and the encroachment will be shown to any buyers and they can deal with it as they see fit. Technically they could make the neighbors tear down all the fence and rip up the entire line of trees and shrubs and move the stuff back onto their property.

Or they can just ignore it and maybe this time someone will keep record for 18 years.

The part that's amazing to me is, if they had documentation that they'd been there 18 years, the County would be forced by State law to do all those "expensive" things like draw a new picture of the plat. Bank breaking expense there, you know. LOL.

Without the "squatter" law, it'll never get fixed. That fence will be there when I move out of the neighborhood someday, many years hence, I'm sure. The two property owners will have to list it as a problem at any future sales, and nobody will care. They'll wonder why the "idiots" didn't just fix it.

Then they'll drive over to the courthouse and get the same stupid story.

Wash, rinse, repeat.
 
Capitalist finds an empty house and writes up a bogus lease. He leases the house to "renters" and they pay him rent, in cash, weekly. You find squatters in your house, call the cops, they show the lease, they are paying rent. This is not for the cops to decide but the courts.

Meanwhile they stay in your house while you spend $$ to try and force them out. A year later with court delays, they are still trashing your house and you have no income from it.
 
paflyer said:
Because Liberalism is a Mental Disorder, and Liberals have had control of the lawmaking an judicial process since FDR.
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That's spin-zone bs right there man. I live in one of the reddest states in this country and it's just as hard for property owners to get rid of renters overstaying their welcome as anywhere. Maybe *different* from squatters, but not really.

So own up to that fact. If you don't like liberals, then find valid reasons not to like them. This is not one of those reasons.

It's a real pet-peeve of mine to see otherwise educated adults make such blatant accusations against a broad swath of society, where the problems are really much deeper than that. It's simplistic, and immature.
 
Neighbors here actually owned the house, didn't pay BofA for 3 years. That is how long it took BofA to get them out of the place, not much left of it.. BUt if someone is looking for an investment opportunity, PM me.
 
ja_user said:
Neighbors here actually owned the house, didn't pay BofA for 3 years. That is how long it took BofA to get them out of the place, not much left of it.. BUt if someone is looking for an investment opportunity, PM me.
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David White is ordering a flamethrower. He might be willing to let you borrow it.
 
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