6500' I can nae nae..10000' you must be cray cray

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MotoFlier

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MotoFlier
I don't even know what to say about this because it is completely illogical but I'm sketched out at the prospect of going up to 10,000'? I'm a firm believer that with altitude comes options. I have felt the most comfortable flying at 6,500' and that's is also the highest I have ever ventured. It would only seem that I would be even more at ease a little higher. Normal??
 
MotoFlier said:
I don't even know what to say about this because it is completely illogical but I'm sketched out at the prospect of going up to 10,000'? I'm a firm believer that with altitude comes options. I have felt the most comfortable flying at 6,500' and that's is also the highest I have ever ventured. It would only seem that I would be even more at ease a little higher. Normal??
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Icarus, is that you?
 
MotoFlier said:
I don't even know what to say about this because it is completely illogical but I'm sketched out at the prospect of going up to 10,000'? I'm a firm believer that with altitude comes options. I have felt the most comfortable flying at 6,500' and that's is also the highest I have ever ventured. It would only seem that I would be even more at ease a little higher. Normal??
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You're not even to pattern altitude here yet.
 
Hahaha well I guess that answers that time to grow a set.
 
Mt Hood (11,250') from the window of a 145 HP 1967 172H. So I expect the Cherokee would do the same. And I've been substantially higher in normally-aspirated aircraft and normally-aspirated me.

But more seriously, MotoFlier, the biggest thing to consider is how well you will perform at high altitude. The FAA says we are OK from 12,500 to 14,000 for 1/2 hour but folks differ a lot on their reaction to lower oxygen levels.
MtHood1Half.jpg
 
Search the threads for 'vague feeling of unease at altitude'. hehe

Seriously, I regularly fly in the west, and some mountains, and if you're over sea level terrain, 10k and up can seem a bit daunting but for no reason. Air is generally cooler, mostly less bumpy and affords more options when you have an issue. Downside is you get over some cloud layers.

My typical cruise alt are 11.5 and 12.5 because my plane likes it there. some SE non-turbo planes don't like it up there but are fine at 8 and 9k. Give it a try.
 
Moto, sometimes going higher is a needed item even when VFR.

When travelling out to Gaston, plan was to be at 7500. But the clouds quickly tossed that plan out the window. 5500 would have kept us underneath, but that would be a bumpy ride. Asked for and got clearance for higher and wound up at 9500. Ride up there was very smooth and the view was awesome.

So don't be afraid of the additional altitude. (and no peeking in Mari's office window).
 
Been up at those altitudes plenty of times. Don't like to do it all day as much anymore, I get tired afterwards.
 
I recall coming back from my check ride my CFI says 'ok go on up to 4500' and I was like 'what.....why?' Lol. Now I don't plan for anything less than 5500 if I don't have to, and preferably as high as I can go that makes sense for the length of the flight.

Edit: guess I should note that's it's flat 'round here and about 700MSL
 
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midlifeflyer said:
Mt Hood (11,250') from the window of a 145 HP 1967 172H. So I expect the Cherokee would do the same. And I've been substantially higher in normally-aspirated aircraft and normally-aspirated me.

But more seriously, MotoFlier, the biggest thing to consider is how well you will perform at high altitude. The FAA says we are OK from 12,500 to 14,000 for 1/2 hour but folks differ a lot on their reaction to lower oxygen levels.
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For reasons I don't entirely understand, I have a much easier time above 10,000 feet in a 172 than in a PA28. And it doesn't seem to depend on engine size.

Above 10,000, hypoxia may indeed become a concern, especially at night.

My record in a 172 is 13,500 MSL (for less than 30 minutes) to try to escape moderate turbulence in a mountain pass. You can get higher, but you have to use rising air to your advantage.
 
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Is it the thought of being that high, the view, or perhaps some unease caused by hypoxia?
 
I've taken my Turbo Arrow to 17,000+ before. It cruises pretty nicely at 14-15K, but above that you get issues with mag arcing.
 
fwiw (around here the highest "mountain" is about 6200')

A few years back I had my cherokee 140 at 7500' and it was noticably nose-up compared to the normal attitude - kind of a strange feeling. I later calculated the DA at about 9600'. This was with a tired 150hp O-320 in it.
 
MotoFlier said:
I don't even know what to say about this because it is completely illogical but I'm sketched out at the prospect of going up to 10,000'? I'm a firm believer that with altitude comes options. I have felt the most comfortable flying at 6,500' and that's is also the highest I have ever ventured. It would only seem that I would be even more at ease a little higher. Normal??
Click to expand...

I fly at 10K all the time. Yesterday on a 1.2 hour hamburger (well taco) run, we went over at 11,500' and returned at 10,500'. Totally normal.
 
I will suggest 1 or more skydives from 12000 AGL or better. That should take care of it. :D

David
 
I've taken my Archer 3 up to 15k. (On a DA of 1,500) My altitude decisions are based on terrian below, glide distance to airports or suitable off-airport landing sites, and distance between landings. If I'm traveling from point A to point B, I want as much altitude under me as needed for a safe/smooth/efficient flight. If I'm up for giggles, I'm as low as is safe/legal.
 
I'm currently flying under Light Sport limitations, which include a 10,000' maximum altitude.

That said, I will go up to 9,500' to take advantage of tailwinds, or when out west for terrain. And, yes, with more altitude comes more options in the event of engine failure.

But a man's got to know his limitations.

I know personally if I spend more than 2 or 3 hours at that altitude...

1) My cognitive skills take a subtle, but definite hit. Computations are tougher and mistakes more frequent.

2) After several legs like that, the next day I can feel pretty beat up.

3) I'm in decent shape and don't smoke, but I'm also 66 and I think age factors in.

That said, 17,500' in the Cirrus was fun to do on occasion. For any extended flight much above 8,000', I know I do much better with supplemental oxygen.
 
MAKG1 said:
For reasons I don't entirely understand, I have a much easier time above 10,000 feet in a 172 than in a PA28. And it doesn't seem to depend on engine size.

Above 10,000, hypoxia may indeed become a concern, especially at night.

My record in a 172 is 13,500 MSL (for less than 30 minutes) to try to escape moderate turbulence in a mountain pass. You can get higher, but you have to use rising air to your advantage.
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It is the Hershey bar wing. I have had mine to 11,500, but it took a long time and didn't climb well getting there.
 
I've taken my RV-9a up to 18,000 for testing, and routinely fly at 13 or 15k. With an IO-320.

It does great. I just strap on the O2 bottle and go!

-Dan
 
Sac Arrow said:
I've taken my Turbo Arrow to 17,000+ before. It cruises pretty nicely at 14-15K, but above that you get issues with mag arcing.
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Well I've had my Turbo 'kota to 18,000 before. Pressurized mags and fine wire plugs are the way to go. Neener, Neener!
 
Sunday I was coming down the Appalachians and the wind was pretty high. It was really bumpy at 6500 and there was a broken layer at @ 8k. I either had to ride em' cowboy or climb, and since I am a sissy, up I went. The airplane I was flying is 160HP and I was only at 10.5 for about 45 minutes till the layer gave way and I could descend. Still felt slightly bad on Monday. I don't necessarily mind the turbulence, but I was flying over the hills AND it was turbulent, Ill take more options and a smoother ride every time.
 
Geez, are none of you skiers? I spend 4+ hours on the slopes at 9-12k' working my butt off and I'm an old man. Yeah, I hurt afterward, but I'm up there beating the snow into submission. :yes:
 
For flight following and radar services you have to get on up sometimes or they can't hear you.
 
Cruising from KRBD to KHKS at 7500' a couple of weeks ago. Clouds forced me to climb to 9500' to get on top. Cherokee did just fine. Had to close the vents though!
 
I go on Oxygen above 9K. Flying at 17.5 VFR is pretty fun. Not much uncontrolled traffic up there. Above FL180 I have no desire to do again in a non pressurized aircraft unless its a critical situation to get above some nasty weather. but, yeah.. 10K. no worries. grow a set! :)
 
The older you get the harder it is to take flights over 10 k without O2. 9500 and lower are my preferred altitudes ,even if I have to take the bumps.
 
Clark1961 said:
Well I've had my Turbo 'kota to 18,000 before. Pressurized mags and fine wire plugs are the way to go. Neener, Neener!
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I did spring for fine wires (ouch! twelve of them!) but held off on the pressurized mags. Fine wires did make a big difference. Bumped the altitude where the mags would start to arc a couple thousand feet, which was good enough for me.
 
10,000' is only a number, just like 6,500'.
Normally you have more options the higher you go, unless you're on fire, then it's a detriment.
 
It only takes 100' to kill you.

No but seriously, it's the AGLs that get to you. And it's relative. When I go higher (17-20k) than I usually do (10-12k), it is noticeable how much higher it feels. The horizon, if it's visible at all through haze, is farther away, objects are tinier on the ground. The difference in height is noticeable and the first time I went up there it was briefly unsettling. But after several hours cruising up there it all began to look normal and has ever since.

Trust your airplane and head on up there and you will get used to it too.
 
MotoFlier said:
I don't even know what to say about this because it is completely illogical but I'm sketched out at the prospect of going up to 10,000'? I'm a firm believer that with altitude comes options. I have felt the most comfortable flying at 6,500' and that's is also the highest I have ever ventured. It would only seem that I would be even more at ease a little higher. Normal??
Click to expand...

Depends. How long have you been a pilot?

When I was a new pilot, I liked to stay low. I felt "safer" down low, which my intellect told me was entirely illogical, but I felt uncomfortable above 3000'.

A couple of decades and a few thousand hours later, and it's just the opposite. We routinely cruise at 15,500' in the RV, snorting O2, and I feel less comfortable below 2500'.

It also helps to have a plane that performs well at these high(er) altitudes. My Warrior was a dog above 7500', the Pathfinder was gasping at 12,500', and the Ercoupe? Well, I took it up to 3500' once. :)
 
In NA pistons, I choose anything between 8,000 and 12,000 and that's it.
 
12,600 ft MSL...and hovering. :yes:
 

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