182 drivers and steep turns

flhrci

flhrci

Final Approach
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David
Hey 182 drivers,

I am looking for specific entry engine settings for steep turns. Have the maneuvering speed already. I can't remember and I will have to demo one or two here soon. Commercial steep turns by the way although it won't matter much.

Thanks!

David
 
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How is a 182 different from another aircraft? The CS prop? Substitute 1" MP for where you would have used 100 RPM fixed pitch.

Go up there and practice.

As a matter of proficiency, you should be able to do steep turns at a variety of speeds, not just Va. PTS doesn't specify an entry speed.

It makes a difference if this is a demo for a buyer, a student pilot, or a check ride.
 
Moving target. Subtle changes with weight and density altitude. Just go up and try a few...I'll take a SWAG and say to add 2-3" MAP after the bank is established; not too soon, or you will climb, and not too late, either. Think of it this way: When you bank for a steep turn, you are reducing the vertical component of lift, so you add back pressure to compensate...but that increases induced drag. What do you have available to overcome drag? Thrust! So as you are dumping lift, be ready to counter the increased induced drag. How much? Beats me, but my guess is as noted above. be ready to go back to your initial power setting as you level the wings upon completion of the turn. If the examiner wants back-to-back 360s, leave the power alone and use the elevator control to maintain altitude as you roll from one bank into the other...that's no time to be grabbing the throttle.

Bob Gardner
 
MAKG1 said:
How is a 182 different from another aircraft? The CS prop? Substitute 1" MP for where you would have used 100 RPM fixed pitch.

Go up there and practice.

As a matter of proficiency, you should be able to do steep turns at a variety of speeds, not just Va. PTS doesn't specify an entry speed.

It makes a difference if this is a demo for a buyer, a student pilot, or a check ride.
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Having only flown the 182 twice and only since November, and not having flown since January, I definitely need the practice. Lacking some confidence also.

You are right MAKG1.

This will be a training syllabus for a skydiver driver job actually that I may take. Have the 182 scheduled for Friday morning and can't get it again until the 26th but have reserved for then to.

David
 
bobmrg said:
Moving target. Subtle changes with weight and density altitude. Just go up and try a few...I'll take a SWAG and say to add 2-3" MAP after the bank is established; not too soon, or you will climb, and not too late, either. Think of it this way: When you bank for a steep turn, you are reducing the vertical component of lift, so you add back pressure to compensate...but that increases induced drag. What do you have available to overcome drag? Thrust! So as you are dumping lift, be ready to counter the increased induced drag. How much? Beats me, but my guess is as noted above. be ready to go back to your initial power setting as you level the wings upon completion of the turn. If the examiner wants back-to-back 360s, leave the power alone and use the elevator control to maintain altitude as you roll from one bank into the other...that's no time to be grabbing the throttle.

Bob Gardner
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Thanks Bob. Good reminders but I was kinda looking for just an initial starting RPM and manifold pressure. Definitely will need to practice a bunch.

David
 
As a renter, I have the prop at the top of the green all the time except for takeoff and landing (when it's fire walled). It's safe for the engine to be at high RPM, low throttle, as opposed to the other way around, as long as prop and throttle are both in the green (some engines have "avoid" areas).

It may be quieter and/or use less fuel at lower speed to have lower RPM. See the POH cruise table. Though I doubt I would want to be fiddling with the prop in a steep turn unless I had to.
 
MAKG1 said:
As a renter, I have the prop at the top of the green all the time except for takeoff and landing (when it's fire walled). It's safe for the engine to be at high RPM, low throttle, as opposed to the other way around, as long as prop and throttle are both in the green (some engines have "avoid" areas).

It may be quieter and/or use less fuel at lower speed to have lower RPM. See the POH cruise table. Though I doubt I would want to be fiddling with the prop in a steep turn unless I had to.
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My rental 182 has the avoidance area. I believe it is 2000-2200 RPM.

I am thinking 2400RPM to start with would work and 22 inches MP. Have an email into my checkout CFI to make sure. Probably should have done that first.

David
 
Trim for 90kts level with full RPM, (maybe 20" :dunno:) crank in 60° of bank (lead with the rudder, you may need top rudder in a left turn) and give it full throttle, that should have you pretty close for a light effort steep turn, adjust the throttle going through 45° rolling in and out.
 
MAKG1 said:
It's safe for the engine to be at high RPM, low throttle, as opposed to the other way around
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This is entirely untrue, especially in normally-aspirated aircraft.

25"/2500rpm and 50* ROP is the WORST way to run your engine.
 
MAKG1 said:
As a matter of proficiency, you should be able to do steep turns at a variety of speeds, not just Va. PTS doesn't specify an entry speed.
Click to expand...

Establishes the manufacturer’s recommended airspeed or if one is not stated, a safe airspeed not to exceed VA.
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
Right. It's impossible to talk about proper what is good for your engine without including ALL engine controls.
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If you're below about 70-75% power, it doesn't make much difference where the mixture is set, so long as the engine isn't running rough.
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
This is entirely untrue, especially in normally-aspirated aircraft.

25"/2500rpm and 50* ROP is the WORST way to run your engine.
Click to expand...

Oh, now ya done it...

I happen to agree with you, but you just started a 20-page reply war on that subject...
 
Since you have to maintain airspeed at +-10, start around 90 and you'll have plenty of power to just add whatever's needed in a 182. Even up here at our altitudes. Prop at top of green works fine. Note that if it's really hot and high up here in summer you might need the prop full forward to do it faster than 90. But there's no actually limitation on the O-470 182s on being above the top of the prop green arc. Can't speak for the Lycomings.
 
Jeff Oslick said:
If you're below about 70-75% power, it doesn't make much difference where the mixture is set, so long as the engine isn't running rough.
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I disagree. Maybe if I was flying someone else's bird, I wouldn't care as much and would do what they want me to do. They're paying for the insurance.

airguy said:
Oh, now ya done it...

I happen to agree with you, but you just started a 20-page reply war on that subject...
Click to expand...

I won't get into it too much here. Too many old farts whose ego I would brush up against and get the emotions flowing. I'll just run my engine they best way I know how.
 
denverpilot said:
Since you have to maintain airspeed at +-10, start around 90 and you'll have plenty of power to just add whatever's needed in a 182. Even up here at our altitudes. Prop at top of green works fine. Note that if it's really hot and high up here in summer you might need the prop full forward to do it faster than 90. But there's no actually limitation on the O-470 182s on being above the top of the prop green arc. Can't speak for the Lycomings.
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Thanks Nate. I did not read yoru post till just now having jsut gotten back from flying.

I did figure it out. 2200 RPM and manifold pressure set for around 95-100 IAS. Worked good. This was at 3000 MSL.

David
 
flhrci said:
Thanks Nate. I did not read yoru post till just now having jsut gotten back from flying.

I did figure it out. 2200 RPM and manifold pressure set for around 95-100 IAS. Worked good. This was at 3000 MSL.
Click to expand...


Cool. 182 makes it easy. 172 up here on a hot summer day, struggles. ;)
 
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