The Mechanic Wants to Talk to Me...

SCCutler said:
That ain't all that bad. Read what Charlie Melot wrote...
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I'm thinking the IA doesn't know Cherokees, hasn't looked at the parts manual, and has experience with Cessna horizontal stabilizer spar cracks. The IA also failed to notice that there are no fasteners to interior structure there...
 
flygirl34q said:
And then there is this...

IMG_1880.jpg


This is a dent in the middle underside of the left stabilator that the mechanic said would need to be taken apart to check for hidden damage and then rebuilt. And repainted. I have no idea how this even happened.
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I told you those turf strips were dangerous.
 
the mag has no high time requirement, and this is not an airworthy issue. as long as you have a good mag drop its no biggy, tell the A&P-IA where he gets the idea that it must be overhauled or replaced

don't fix sh-- that ain't broke.
 
Tom-D said:
the mag has no high time requirement, and this is not an airworthy issue. as long as you have a good mag drop its no biggy, tell the A&P-IA where he gets the idea that it must be overhauled or replaced

don't fix sh-- that ain't broke.
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yep, it would have been on my "discressionary" item list. Might even recomend it if it's REALLY high time.
 
Skylane81E said:
yep, it would have been on my "discressionary" item list. Might even recomend it if it's REALLY high time.
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His argument when I brought that up was... "Well, you don't want to be somewhere in Sheepdip, Nebraska when that thing fails on a holiday. Better get it taken care of now." And... having just been in a place where maintenance might have been very tough to come by had it failed this past weekend and having also been in the situation where something important did fail on me in a place very like Sheepdip, Nebraska and been stuck there on a holiday in the past... I have to tell you that I could definitely see his side of things. It is/was well past the 500 hour recommended time for overhaul/replacement. :rolleyes2:
 
This isn't too terrible of a squawk list, but his theory that they need to open up the stabilator seems off...

Most of the items are consumables. Tire, ELT, etc. The magneto is optional. Carry a spare magneto, alternator, and starter with you - those are the three big items that will leave you in a pickle.

Have your chocolate shake. :)
 
Ted DuPuis said:
This isn't too terrible of a squawk list, but his theory that they need to open up the stabilator seems off...

Most of the items are consumables. Tire, ELT, etc. The magneto is optional. Carry a spare magneto, alternator, and starter with you - those are the three big items that will leave you in a pickle.

Have your chocolate shake. :)
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Yeah, on that stab, don't wanna say what I'd do with out it in front of me but odds are good my fix would be cheaper.:dunno:
 
flygirl34q said:
His argument when I brought that up was... "Well, you don't want to be somewhere in Sheepdip, Nebraska when that thing fails on a holiday. Better get it taken care of now." And... having just been in a place where maintenance might have been very tough to come by had it failed this past weekend and having also been in the situation where something important did fail on me in a place very like Sheepdip, Nebraska and been stuck there on a holiday in the past... I have to tell you that I could definitely see his side of things. It is/was well past the 500 hour recommended time for overhaul/replacement. :rolleyes2:
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So you put the new one on, and it breaks in Sheepdip anyway. Same diff. BTDT. :)

How far past? :)

I liked the post someone made once saying to gather up items that are hard to source that tend to break on your airplane and have them in boxes ready to ship and someone back home who'd toss 'me off at FedEx.

If it's not a hard to source part, you're waiting on FedEx from a parts supply place anyway. Same thing.

Or as Ted points out, you can lug around a magneto. That's bound to guarantee it won't fail. :rofl: Something else will. :)

At Gaston's there was an A&P hanging around... (grin) who'd probably have helped ya out. And probably a few more only a 40 minute drive away. It's not that remote. ;)

I suspect for most of us weekend flyers the real problem will be that most shops, even in big cities, are only open M-F. And parts suppliers are typically maybe only open on Saturday, if at all, on weekends.

So you're looking at placing an online order or leaving a message for a FedEx part on Saturday, it'll ship on Monday, and you'll maybe be fixed and headed home by Tuesday afternoon after it arrives at 9AM.

The "stock your own in ready to ship boxes at home" trick would mean ready to fly Monday afternoon. Or if the parts suppliers have a strange shortage of something.

Clark may have other thoughts on mag rebuilds/replacements, though... since his fire-breather didn't seem to enjoy running on one mag too much.

There are folks on some boards who stock half an airplane worth of parts in the kits they carry in the aircraft. They just don't want to be stuck anywhere. Ever.

And I'd bet more than a few of them have swapped something without an A&P anywhere in sight and cooked the books later. Not sure that's wise, but if you were flying the deep backcountry somewhere, I could see it.

I bet someone out there has launched to somewhere with maintenance available on only one mag before, too. Again, not recommending it... but sure it's been done.
 
flygirl34q said:
It is/was well past the 500 hour recommended time for overhaul/replacement.
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Any mag that has gone well past 500 hours is not going to fail catastrophically, it will start giving you larger and larger mag drops, and the engine will become difficult to start. then fix the discrepancy you have.

Any mag that has 250 hours on it will have a bad (will not pass the inspection) distributor block and rotor gear, yet they more than often go to TBO of the engine with no maintenance.
 
The carb heat shroud is spendy to replace. BTDT. From Piper, it's nuts. I think Aircraft Welding repairs fairly reasonably if it's not too badly cracked or can sell you a PMA'd one. IIR ours was around $200 per half. Piper was double that. The rest of your list doesn't sound too bad actually.
 
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Tom-D said:
Any mag that has gone well past 500 hours is not going to fail catastrophically, it will start giving you larger and larger mag drops, and the engine will become difficult to start. then fix the discrepancy you have.
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Not true. The nylon gears in some mags will fail without any warning, and I have had a 1000+ hour mag have a catastrophic failure.
 
One of the turbo heat shields in my engine compartment had a crack that was welded at an exhaust shop. It's been fine ever since.

If it makes you feel any better, I had a cylinder rebuilt this year due to a leaking exhaust valve. :hairraise: And within 100 hours of buying the plane developed a hairline crack in the engine case - we finally discovered that was the issue causing oil leaks.

Some things I do proactively: vacuum pump, alternator belt, etc. to ensure high (IFR) dispatch rate. Other things are IRAN.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
Not true. The nylon gears in some mags will fail without any warning, and I have had a 1000+ hour mag have a catastrophic failure.
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Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't that one of the problems with the new Slicks and why it is better to repair the old ones than buy new?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
Tom-D said:
Any mag that has 250 hours on it will have a bad (will not pass the inspection) distributor block and rotor gear, yet they more than often go to TBO of the engine with no maintenance.
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That's some funny stuff right there. :rofl:

If that were true they'd all be replaced at overhaul or 500 hr inspection, possibly as mandatory items. They're not. Even factory overhauls can come with old blocks and gears. Very seldom have I needed to replace them at 500 hrs unless it was their second time around. 250??? :loco: You must mean a Slick (complete crap), and by then the coil tab is worn too.
 
flygirl34q said:
His argument when I brought that up was... "Well, you don't want to be somewhere in Sheepdip, Nebraska when that thing fails on a holiday. Better get it taken care of now." And... having just been in a place where maintenance might have been very tough to come by had it failed this past weekend and having also been in the situation where something important did fail on me in a place very like Sheepdip, Nebraska and been stuck there on a holiday in the past... I have to tell you that I could definitely see his side of things. It is/was well past the 500 hour recommended time for overhaul/replacement. :rolleyes2:
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No, no, no... Taylor with Fly Arkansas had a mechanic on standby for us all weekend at KBPK. And you had Duncan there, too. :)
 
Chip Sylverne said:
The carb heat shroud is spendy to replace. BTDT. From Piper, it's nuts. I think Aircraft Welding repairs fairly reasonably if it's not too badly cracked or can sell you a PMA'd one. IIR ours was around $200 per half. Piper was double that. The rest of your list doesn't sound too bad actually.
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Yup, she needs to talk to these guys; they do WONDERFUL work:

http://www.dawleyaviation.com/index.php/gallery
 
TangoWhiskey said:
Deer, eating grass under the stabilator. Looks up suddenly when a car drives on property.
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That is the best idea yet..... I know Lynn takes darn good care of her toy and there is no way she would have not noticed the dent during a preflight.... My first thought was the mechanic hit it while loading the hangar during the annual but looking close there is not any scratches in the paint, just a dent, so the head of a deer would make perfect sense.
 
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N801BH said:
That is the best idea yet..... I know Lynn takes darn good care of her toy and there is no why she would have not noticed the dent during a preflight.... My first thought was the mechanic hit it while loading the hangar during the annual but looking close there in not any scratches in the paint, just a dent, so the head of a deer would make perfect sense.
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And there were a LOT of them around the airplanes at night... that's those dark pictures Greg put up in the Gaston's thread, with the van's headlights illuminating (poorly) the parking area.
 
denverpilot said:
Battery box: Of all the things you listed, this is the one I like the least. Reason is... I want to know where the battery acid is coming from that's eating it and why. I want a good look around for corrosion. But if yours is an original, it's probably due. They're not hideously expensive, but they're overpriced for what they are. If the box is newer, and battery acid is eating it, I'd want to get a good look around it and make sure there's not other corrosion and get the area cleaned up well. Baking soda and water. All that jazz.
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If you fill the battery to the bottom of the split rings, it will spit out acid while the alternator is charging it. That split-ring level is only valid if the battery is actively charging and has been for awhile; then you top it to that level. The acid generates gas bubbles inside the cells and this expands the electrolyte. Off charge, the bubbles work their way out and the level drops.

This is per the instructions you get with a new battery.

I always topped them to halfway between the plates and the bottom of the split ring and never had any acid in the box. A guy helping me once filled a couple of them to the rings and there was acid on the batteries and in the boxes 50 hours later when I checked them again.

Dan
 
N801BH said:
That is the best idea yet..... I know Lynn takes darn good care of her toy and there is no why she would have not noticed the dent during a preflight.... My first thought was the mechanic hit it while loading the hangar during the annual but looking close there in not any scratches in the paint, just a dent, so the head of a deer would make perfect sense.
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I am currently in the process of trying to get my insurance to pay for the repair to the stabilator... my mechanic also noticed the lack of scratches in the paint. It looks like a straight up blunt force blow to the metal when the airplane was not in motion.

LOL... I wonder if an old magneto would make a good bookend?? Maybe I should ask the mechanic to save it for me. I keep all my aviation books and other reference and reading material in my basement scrapbooking space. It might be an interesting conversation piece. :rolleyes:

I'm trying my best not to be upset at what I see as a "bad" annual (high AMU count) with the possibility of a longer than usual downtime. But, that is why we all work hard, right?? So we can have the money to keep our airplanes flying! :)
 
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flygirl34q said:
I am currently in the process of trying to get my insurance to pay for the repair to the stabilator... my mechanic also noticed the lack of scratches in the paint. It looks like a straight up blunt force blow to the metal when the airplane was not in motion.
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Jesse hit his head on it removing the Claw. :rofl: Kidding...
 
You may want to find out how much the repairs on your stabilator will cost before making an insurance claim, since your "not in motion" deductible might be high. Also, even a single claim might raise your rates, so you might be ahead simply paying for any repairs.

Hopefully he won't find any spar damage. Looks like the repair choices could range from pulling the dent, Bondo, or reskinning. Sand, prep, and either strip all the paint or just do one area, plus possibly mass balance. Still, you don't want an elevator failure under any circumstances, so you should know if there's any damage inside.

I would want my engine to have two good working mags as well- these are not items are that expensive.

If you have to nickel and dime every preventative maintenance item, or you defer replacing worn out parts, perhaps you're flying too much airplane.
 
flygirl34q said:
I am currently in the process of trying to get my insurance to pay for the repair to the stabilator... my mechanic also noticed the lack of scratches in the paint. It looks like a straight up blunt force blow to the metal when the airplane was not in motion.
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Do you use the seat belts as a control lock (i.e. yoke full aft, stabilator up)? If so, it might have been hit from behind. Or if it's been parked outside with snow or ice accumulating, it might have rocked back due to the weight on the tail and struck something on the ground.
 
Knowing there is no supporting structure in the Stab of a Piper, who believes this is an airworthiness issue?

Shouldn't we be worried about the control linkage ?
 
Fearless Tower said:
Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't that one of the problems with the new Slicks and why it is better to repair the old ones than buy new?
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All my planes have Bendix mags. If I bought a plane with Slicks, they would get promptly removed.

Translation: I don't know the answer to your question. :)
 
flygirl34q said:
S
1. Right magneto needs overhauled... too much time on it.

1. Left main tire needs replaced.
2. ELT needs new battery.
3. Battery box cover broken/ Box itself corroded.
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We've done these since we've bought, and also had to:

have the exhaust welded
have the constant speed prop hub rebuilt
have the prop blades overhauled
have the cylinder studs replaced
have the brake pads replaced
have the transponder replaced
have the battery replaced
have the starter replaced
have the alternator replaced
have the fuel injectors cleaned

This is off the top of my head without going thru the logs.

And the latest that just happened this spring, the King 55A HSI stopped progressing during turns. The master gyro in the avionics bay in the back went TU, rebuild was 3AMU.

I don't begrudge the plane, it's 30 years old and stuff happens! What are you going to do :dunno:

You pays your money and keep flying. Your annual looks fairly normal to me.
 
AcroBoy said:
You may want to find out how much the repairs on your stabilator will cost before making an insurance claim, since your "not in motion" deductible might be high. Also, even a single claim might raise your rates, so you might be ahead simply paying for any repairs.

Hopefully he won't find any spar damage. Looks like the repair choices could range from pulling the dent, Bondo, or reskinning. Sand, prep, and either strip all the paint or just do one area, plus possibly mass balance. Still, you don't want an elevator failure under any circumstances, so you should know if there's any damage inside.

I would want my engine to have two good working mags as well- these are not items are that expensive.

If you have to nickel and dime every preventative maintenance item, or you defer replacing worn out parts, perhaps you're flying too much airplane.
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I have a zero "not in motion" deductible... and definitely hoping for some GOOD luck somewhere in this annual! Stay tuned... the mechanic may want to talk to me again. Ugh. :rolleyes2:


Pilawt said:
Do you use the seat belts as a control lock (i.e. yoke full aft, stabilator up)? If so, it might have been hit from behind. Or if it's been parked outside with snow or ice accumulating, it might have rocked back due to the weight on the tail and struck something on the ground.
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I never use the seat belt as a control lock and I'm always hangared at home and don't recall being parked outside during that heavy a snowfall over the winter to have caused a tail strike. :eek: I'm leaning towards the deer theory at Gaston's proposed earlier. Wow.
 
Looking at the picture of the stab I must admit all I see is a dent without any sharp edges that would possibly become a fatigue crack like a sharp crease might.
Does the stressed skin flanging have a go-no go limit on damage?
I've been taught any damage to a "supported" type structure that involve a rib/skin intersection needs to be investigated but even then a dent between the ribs that merely deforms the skin (within limits) but doesn't displace rivits, etc. is OK with inspection...

Chris (still in A&P sponge mode)
 
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