Suggestions for GPS for PP (Renter) for around $200

I don't know of any GPS units that display heading (unless they are getting the input from an HSI or other similar display unit).


Neither do I. Mine displays the desired course, and the TRACK, not heading. That's why its typically different from my DG, unless there is NO wind component.
 
I don't know of any GPS units that display heading (unless they are getting the input from an HSI or other similar display unit).
Well the iPad does have a magnetometer so it's entirely possible that Foreflight could display heading - but I seriously doubt the "compass" would work worth a crap in an airplane so I don't think they do display it. This is why I said it's possbile it could display it but I seriously doubt they're doing that as it'd be inaccurate the vast majority of the time.
 
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Do you have a android phone? If so look at the Naviator app. It's better on a tablet but you can try it out for free for 30 on your phone.
Another Android app worth having is "GPS Essential Tools" - I'm REALLY happy with it so far.

Ryan
 
No. It displays groundspeed.

Yeah, I had that revelation somewhere around 5 a.m. - but I was too lazy to get up and fix it.

What I should have said is, as you pointed out, GROUNDSPEED, and as the other poster noted, TRACK, not heading.
 
I see nothing that indicates that.

Apparently you missed the "Electronic compass" part. It has a built in fluxgate compass.

Or are you arguing that it indicates the direction the GPS is pointing which is not necessarily the heading because it could be mounted at an angle?
 
I've still got the GPSMap 196 available, asking $300. If none of the thread participants are interested, I'll post it in the classified section.
 
I'm tempted to lay out the $300 myself. I like this one because I have no cigarette lighter in my plane and this one has long battery life on a set of Double A's.

Doc

Doc - why don't you go ahead with this - I think there was another person who had a non-Garmin with "lifetime updates" and I'm sure others will come along too.

I think I should spend $300 elsewhere right now, my dog needs his annual visit to the vet and my car needs servicing.
 
My GPS - picked up a HP ipaq PDA on ebay for around 40 and APIC software from approachsystems.com for 9.99 - so about 50 bucks. I also tried the trial from pocketfms.com - worked awesomely.
 
I did a thread search but was unable to find the answers I needed (if I'm wrong please point me to the correct thread).

Though one day I may rent from another airport, for now I am going to keep flying from Petaluma. The 152 and the 172 do not have GPS.

Several pilots have told me that I can buy one for $200 - is this true? Are there monthly fees too? Can I use it in my car when I am not flying or are they strictly for planes?

Sorry but I have never owned a GPS and have no idea. It would be cool if I could use them on hikes, drives, and flights.

Specifically I wanted one due to the Bravo / Charlie airspace around San Francisco, Oakland, Palo Alto, Half Moon Bay, etc.

Thanks everyone for any advice you can give. I don't mind buying used either.


Kimberly


You can buy a new GPS for less than $100, problem is that it won't have an aviation database and let me tell from experience back in the day with old units before databases, it was a royal PITA. Basically everyplace you want to go you have to enter a waypoint for. This becomes tedious fast.

So your low cost aviation solution is going to be a used machine of some type. Before you buy one though you have to make sure that you can still get database updates for it, because without those the usefulness of the unit will degrade over time.

BTW, you are a pilot now, so act like one. You get a 22 and hunt rabbits and feed them with some rice and veggies to the dog. The car no longer sees service, all money now goes into flying....
 
Kim,

I don't know if you're still interested, but i have an Ipaq i'd be willing to give away. I will need to locate the charger, and you'd need to get a GPS for it (bluetooth, SD, or CF). if you want it, it's yours. shoot me a PM
 
Kim,

I don't know if you're still interested, but i have an Ipaq i'd be willing to give away. I will need to locate the charger, and you'd need to get a GPS for it (bluetooth, SD, or CF). if you want it, it's yours. shoot me a PM

OK I will PM you. That sounds very interesting if it would work for flying.
 
I also tried the trial from pocketfms.com - worked awesomely.

Thanks FF for your kind comments.

Just in case anyone is looking for it in the iOS appstore or the Android Google Play store, the iOS/Android version of PocketFMS is called EasyVFR.

Colm
 
Just do without and keep up on your pilotage and other skills. You should be getting pretty familiar with your airspace by now anyway, and take the plane with the GPS when you want to take a trip.
 
Kim, I have had some experiences with Android GPSs that many folks call an outlier. With my own experience developing mission critical systems, I don't believe it's nearly as rare as people here think. Even if it's broken (which I doubt).

There are GPSs, and then there are GPSs that work. It's not easy to know which yours lies in, especially if it's in a phone or tablet.

My worst example was when I transited Class B from WVI enroute to LLR. The tablet lost a signal somewhere around HAF and showed my position as though it were current, northwest of OSI VOR outside of Class B. Fortunately, I'm very skeptical of splashy looking devices and transited the airspace using pilotage. And I knew I was approaching Stinson Beach, just about to come out of Class B on the other side, and had done so with appropriate clearances. That's more than a 20 mile error, presented as though it were perfect.

Had I used that tablet for airspace avoidance, I'd be defending my certificate now. Is it an outlier? Tablet GPSs frequently have problems holding signal inside a metal cocoon. Try putting one on your car seat and see how it does. The thing I object to is that this thing presents a lost signal as though it was not lost. From an engineering perspective, that's a fatal flaw.

KSFO Class B is set up to identify boundaries using VOR radials (mostly from SFO VOR, but the north boundary is an exception, using SAU VOR) and DME. But the "right" way to do this is with visual landmarks on the ground. It's not at all difficult to do this, and that's how you avoid Class B airspace. Even at night, this isn't very difficult. The terrain is more of a challenge, as many of the peaks are not lit. And the last thing you want is your head down at night, as that's just asking for spatial disorientation. It's really dark west of the mountains.

When transitioning from the north, ask NorCal for a transition as soon as you get handed off. The boundary is along a line roughly from Angel Island to the Carquinez Bridge. If you think you're too close, descend to 2000 and you can delay contact until over the City (but Oakland Center can be easily cajoled into a somewhat early handoff for this purpose). There are a TON of good (and lit) landmarks around there. From the south, the boundary is roughly Hwy 92, or Half Moon Bay Airport, below 4000 feet.

I've said this many times. It's easier to get cleared through Class B than it is to avoid it. I don't know if you've tried it yet, but you really should if you haven't. Typically, NorCal tells you to remain west of 101 at 3500. If transitioning west of the mountains, they will want you to stay west, and at a higher altitude. During the few times NorCal hasn't let me through Class B, they did take me through OAK Class C, with step by step instructions how to do so (in a nutshell -- Coliseum at or below 2000, 29 numbers, mid-span San Mateo Bridge below 1500). These guys are VERY helpful.

Trying to avoid using this service with a tablet is placing unnecessary risks on your certificate. The tablet isn't necessarily helpful for this. More importantly, you can't know for sure when it is being helpful and when it isn't.

What it CAN help is preflight planning. There are several planning apps -- like Foreflight, fltplan.com, duat, etc. I rejected Avilution because it rendered the SFO TAC with an aliasing error, and was quite difficult to read. Garmin Pilot is more readable. But they are still working out the crashes (it's a lot better than it used to be). Quality is highly variable; Garmin Pilot suffers the usual poor interface design that every Garmin product does. But a tablet or phone can be useful for logging, flight planning, filing, weight & balance, and several other things. I just don't agree that airborne navigation is one of them.

As a pilot, I'll suggest that the GPS feature is not a good thing to rely upon. If you ever feel you need it to get around, you're in a "bad place" and should get some time with an instructor or maybe another pilot to resolve that.
 
Note that this thread was resurrected from 18 months ago.
 
Unless you use your phone with Foreflight or WingX, I would recommend you try to get something that runs on replaceable batteries. Some of the airplanes you rent may not have a power plug that works. I have a Garmin 196 that I have had for years. It runs on 4 AA batteries (I prefer Duracell). I carry extra batteries with me in a camera bag I bought to keep the 196 and accessories in. I mount the 196 on the yoke in front of me. I tried Foreflight on my iPhone, but the screen size was so small I didn't like it. One of the mini iPads would probably be perfect.
 
Kim, I have had some experiences with Android GPSs that many folks call an outlier. With my own experience developing mission critical systems, I don't believe it's nearly as rare as people here think. Even if it's broken (which I doubt).

There are GPSs, and then there are GPSs that work. It's not easy to know which yours lies in, especially if it's in a phone or tablet.

My worst example was when I transited Class B from WVI enroute to LLR. The tablet lost a signal somewhere around HAF and showed my position as though it were current, northwest of OSI VOR outside of Class B. Fortunately, I'm very skeptical of splashy looking devices and transited the airspace using pilotage. And I knew I was approaching Stinson Beach, just about to come out of Class B on the other side, and had done so with appropriate clearances. That's more than a 20 mile error, presented as though it were perfect.

Had I used that tablet for airspace avoidance, I'd be defending my certificate now. Is it an outlier? Tablet GPSs frequently have problems holding signal inside a metal cocoon. Try putting one on your car seat and see how it does. The thing I object to is that this thing presents a lost signal as though it was not lost. From an engineering perspective, that's a fatal flaw.

KSFO Class B is set up to identify boundaries using VOR radials (mostly from SFO VOR, but the north boundary is an exception, using SAU VOR) and DME. But the "right" way to do this is with visual landmarks on the ground. It's not at all difficult to do this, and that's how you avoid Class B airspace. Even at night, this isn't very difficult. The terrain is more of a challenge, as many of the peaks are not lit. And the last thing you want is your head down at night, as that's just asking for spatial disorientation. It's really dark west of the mountains.

When transitioning from the north, ask NorCal for a transition as soon as you get handed off. The boundary is along a line roughly from Angel Island to the Carquinez Bridge. If you think you're too close, descend to 2000 and you can delay contact until over the City (but Oakland Center can be easily cajoled into a somewhat early handoff for this purpose). There are a TON of good (and lit) landmarks around there. From the south, the boundary is roughly Hwy 92, or Half Moon Bay Airport, below 4000 feet.

I've said this many times. It's easier to get cleared through Class B than it is to avoid it. I don't know if you've tried it yet, but you really should if you haven't. Typically, NorCal tells you to remain west of 101 at 3500. If transitioning west of the mountains, they will want you to stay west, and at a higher altitude. During the few times NorCal hasn't let me through Class B, they did take me through OAK Class C, with step by step instructions how to do so (in a nutshell -- Coliseum at or below 2000, 29 numbers, mid-span San Mateo Bridge below 1500). These guys are VERY helpful.

Trying to avoid using this service with a tablet is placing unnecessary risks on your certificate. The tablet isn't necessarily helpful for this. More importantly, you can't know for sure when it is being helpful and when it isn't.

What it CAN help is preflight planning. There are several planning apps -- like Foreflight, fltplan.com, duat, etc. I rejected Avilution because it rendered the SFO TAC with an aliasing error, and was quite difficult to read. Garmin Pilot is more readable. But they are still working out the crashes (it's a lot better than it used to be). Quality is highly variable; Garmin Pilot suffers the usual poor interface design that every Garmin product does. But a tablet or phone can be useful for logging, flight planning, filing, weight & balance, and several other things. I just don't agree that airborne navigation is one of them.

As a pilot, I'll suggest that the GPS feature is not a good thing to rely upon. If you ever feel you need it to get around, you're in a "bad place" and should get some time with an instructor or maybe another pilot to resolve that.

LOL! "GET OFF MY LAWN!!"
 
Kim, I have had some experiences with Android GPSs that many folks call an outlier. With my own experience developing mission critical systems, I don't believe it's nearly as rare as people here think. Even if it's broken (which I doubt).

There are GPSs, and then there are GPSs that work. It's not easy to know which yours lies in, especially if it's in a phone or tablet.

My worst example was when I transited Class B from WVI enroute to LLR. The tablet lost a signal somewhere around HAF and showed my position as though it were current, northwest of OSI VOR outside of Class B. Fortunately, I'm very skeptical of splashy looking devices and transited the airspace using pilotage. And I knew I was approaching Stinson Beach, just about to come out of Class B on the other side, and had done so with appropriate clearances. That's more than a 20 mile error, presented as though it were perfect.

Had I used that tablet for airspace avoidance, I'd be defending my certificate now. Is it an outlier? Tablet GPSs frequently have problems holding signal inside a metal cocoon. Try putting one on your car seat and see how it does. The thing I object to is that this thing presents a lost signal as though it was not lost. From an engineering perspective, that's a fatal flaw.

KSFO Class B is set up to identify boundaries using VOR radials (mostly from SFO VOR, but the north boundary is an exception, using SAU VOR) and DME. But the "right" way to do this is with visual landmarks on the ground. It's not at all difficult to do this, and that's how you avoid Class B airspace. Even at night, this isn't very difficult. The terrain is more of a challenge, as many of the peaks are not lit. And the last thing you want is your head down at night, as that's just asking for spatial disorientation. It's really dark west of the mountains.

When transitioning from the north, ask NorCal for a transition as soon as you get handed off. The boundary is along a line roughly from Angel Island to the Carquinez Bridge. If you think you're too close, descend to 2000 and you can delay contact until over the City (but Oakland Center can be easily cajoled into a somewhat early handoff for this purpose). There are a TON of good (and lit) landmarks around there. From the south, the boundary is roughly Hwy 92, or Half Moon Bay Airport, below 4000 feet.

I've said this many times. It's easier to get cleared through Class B than it is to avoid it. I don't know if you've tried it yet, but you really should if you haven't. Typically, NorCal tells you to remain west of 101 at 3500. If transitioning west of the mountains, they will want you to stay west, and at a higher altitude. During the few times NorCal hasn't let me through Class B, they did take me through OAK Class C, with step by step instructions how to do so (in a nutshell -- Coliseum at or below 2000, 29 numbers, mid-span San Mateo Bridge below 1500). These guys are VERY helpful.

Trying to avoid using this service with a tablet is placing unnecessary risks on your certificate. The tablet isn't necessarily helpful for this. More importantly, you can't know for sure when it is being helpful and when it isn't.

What it CAN help is preflight planning. There are several planning apps -- like Foreflight, fltplan.com, duat, etc. I rejected Avilution because it rendered the SFO TAC with an aliasing error, and was quite difficult to read. Garmin Pilot is more readable. But they are still working out the crashes (it's a lot better than it used to be). Quality is highly variable; Garmin Pilot suffers the usual poor interface design that every Garmin product does. But a tablet or phone can be useful for logging, flight planning, filing, weight & balance, and several other things. I just don't agree that airborne navigation is one of them.

As a pilot, I'll suggest that the GPS feature is not a good thing to rely upon. If you ever feel you need it to get around, you're in a "bad place" and should get some time with an instructor or maybe another pilot to resolve that.

I've had panel mount 430's go South on me and lose signal as well. The take home message as always cross check your position. Foreflight is pretty good about letting you know if the fix is weak. To the extent that you have a little airplane indicator and a ground speed and ground track indication, I've never observed the position to be off by a visible amount per ground references or via correlation with VOR's.

I'm a fan of using the best tools I have at my disposal, and I use my Ipad with Foreflight as my GPS navigational device. Quite frankly, it does a better job than a 430 for things like plugging in routes, calculating ETA's and fuel burns enroute, etc... If it fails so what, I'm still looking out the window and using pilotage, and I have VOR's, but I'll give critical airspaces greater margin, when they are an issue.
 
If you're interested in something used with an outdated database, Ill sell you my 96c for 175 (missing the yoke mount hence the low price). Shoot me a pm if interested.
 
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