College degrees and flying

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still learning

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still learning
I know there might be a lot of threads concerning this subject, but I had a specific question about it.

I've got my PPL and want to make flying a career. Currently I am in my first year of college and have been deciding what to major in and I have narrowed it down to psychology and political science. I'll do my undergrad while working my way through ratings and licenses. I've been told that degrees do not have to directly relate to aviation when applying at most airlines, but is psychology or poly sci to out of left field? Or will this be okay if I want to fly commercially? I just think it would be good to have a degree in something else in case flying does not work out.

I know something like engineering would be better, but I have a hatred for math. Advice? Experiences?
 
still learning said:
I know there might be a lot of threads concerning this subject, but I had a specific question about it.

I've got my PPL and want to make flying a career. Currently I am in my first year of college and have been deciding what to major in and I have narrowed it down to psychology and political science. I'll do my undergrad while working my way through ratings and licenses. I've been told that degrees do not have to directly relate to aviation when applying at most airlines, but is psychology or poly sci to out of left field? Or will this be okay if I want to fly commercially? I just think it would be good to have a degree in something else in case flying does not work out.

I know something like engineering would be better, but I have a hatred for math. Advice? Experiences?
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As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.

If you are 10000000000% sure you are only getting a job as a pilot, then yes any degree will do, but if you don't get a pilot job, a degree like polysci is only good at McDonalds
 
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Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.
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Or Comp Sci....learn a programming language or two or three. There will always be a demand for that.
 
LDJones said:
Or Comp Sci....learn a programming language or two or three. There will always be a demand for that.
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+1 though I consider comp sci an engineering. The only majors that are in more demand than me at career fairs are comp sci majors.
 
Take the major with the least amount of credits so you can spend the money on flying.
 
Nothing wrong with a PoliSci degree, it is employable if the flying does not work out.

The Psychology degree is more difficult to find employment without a Graduate degree.

Good luck.
 
It really does not matter. The only benefit you would have is the ability to get a restricted atp with less flight hours if you were to get an aviation related degree from an FAA approved school. Other than that a degree is a degree and won't make a difference. I have flown with plenty crew members with degrees all over the board, even some things I have never even heard about before! The degree essentially shows work ethic and the ability and yearning to further your knowledge. That's what most places are looking at.
 
If flying is your #1 choice of how to make a living then get the necessary ratings to do so. Then for a fall back plan select a degree or other training that could land you your #2 choice of how to make a living. That is about all there is to it. If you can't do the thing that will make you the most happy, you want to be able to do something else that can make you almost as happy. Any other reasoning, theories, etc. do not really mean much.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.

If you are 10000000000% sure you are only getting a job as a pilot, then yes any degree will do, but if you don't get a pilot job, a degree like polysci is only good at McDonalds
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Geez don't mind you. Guess you got it all figured out... I guess all those grade school teachers who helped you along the way who majored in education and all other "soft sciences" were nothing of value to you and your development.

Anyway, I've read Airline Pilot Central forum a lot for fun and it seems like every professional pilot says 4 year degrees in none aviation related fields are most important so the fact that your degree is not in aviation, according to them anyway, are better.
 
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Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.

If you are 10000000000% sure you are only getting a job as a pilot, then yes any degree will do, but if you don't get a pilot job, a degree like polysci is only good at McDonalds
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Lol, I guess I'll take my silly Finance/Accounting degree and throw it in the trash. Engineers are always great at understanding financial accounting . . .
 
Didn't we just have a thread like this?

Don't study anything you hate just because someone thinks it will get you a good job, because then you'll have a job that you hate too.
 
SoonerAviator said:
Lol, I guess I'll take my silly Finance/Accounting degree and throw it in the trash. Engineers are always great at understanding financial accounting . . .
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I have nothing against finance or accounting. Great career choices. I suggested chemistry because the OP has a disdain for math.
 
Listen to the suggestions here. I didn't and went to an "airline school" in the coldest part of the country. I spent $150,000 more on school than people who went the traditional route and I don't have any backup plans like they did.

I was given the same advice you see in this thread, but ignored it and drank the kool-aid and now I regret it. If I ever lose my medical I'm beyond screwed
 
Of the two I'd go with poli sci. I was a double major econ and poli sci and honestly Poli sci is both fun and actually usable if you can get past people going poli sci.. lulz.

Lot of law, statistics, administration, and political theory all translate into business. One thing it will make you hate is political discussions. Hear somebody complain about law/politician/judge and you'll just shake your head.
 
With a poli sci degree, you could have a whole separate career in airline union work or any of the industry associations. Understanding how government works (or doesn't) is an important thing in a highly-regulated industry.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts...
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I'm an engineer and pilot and I can't imagine taking on the workload of engineering school just to have a fallback degree you'll hopefully never have to use.

Nauga,
whose backup plan was 'kept man'
 
Go with something you enjoy. If it's flying, get a flying degree. If you enjoy business get a business administration degree. Your future aviation employer will not care what your degree is. As long as you have a degree that box is checked. I got a degree in Economics and flew on the side. I graduated in May with little debt and have all my ratings except for my multi.
 
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Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.

If you are 10000000000% sure you are only getting a job as a pilot, then yes any degree will do, but if you don't get a pilot job, a degree like polysci is only good at McDonalds
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:rolleyes:

There are very few careers for which a specific undergrad degree is a big benefit. Most of the time there are certs and advanced degrees required to work in that field. Outside of those few fields, many people just look for a 4 year degree to prove that you valued your future enough to stick with the education.

If you want to be an engineer or accountant, then go engineering, accounting or finance, because those matter greatly.

Chemistry is a terrible "general" degree. Many hiring managers may assume you are overly geeky, and there is also a ton of math.

Computer Science is good if you want in that field. There will be opportunities for years and years to come.

Bottom line, use these years to learn about things you find interesting. The Fortune 500 is littered with CEOs and other execs with psychology, business, and yes, even poli sci degrees for their undergrad.
 
nauga said:
I'm an engineer and pilot and I can't imagine taking on the workload of engineering school just to have a fallback degree you'll hopefully never have to use.

Nauga,
whose backup plan was 'kept man'
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And how did that work out for ya?:dunno:.......;)
 
Double major in aviation and something else that you think can serve as a fallback. An aviation degree at a college can get you reduced minimums and a quicker path to the airlines if that is your end goal. Anyone who gets an aviation degree without a backup is taking a huge an unnecessary risk and frankly, if they did any research at all, should know better. That's what I plan to do and I've done loads of research, read articles, threads, talked to people who have been in this same situation and that's the conclusion I've come to.

Good luck.
 
As I mentioned in the previous thread, in hiring I consider degrees to fall into two buckets: "trade school" and "other." A trade school degree actually prepares you to do something useful. Law, accounting, engineering, licensed teaching, etc. fall into this category. A four-year criminal justice degree that also qualified you for a peace officer license also fits the definition. The real skilled trades like A&P would also, of course, fit except that they generally do not involve a 4-year degree.

An "other" degree holder basically graduates as raw meat, ready to be cooked into something useful by an employer's training program. Examples are poly sci and psychology (sorry), marketing, business, literature, art, theater, ... For a backup degree, IMO "other" degrees are bad choices, because the employers are going to be more interested in investing training money in new grads that they can shape at will. A "retired" pilot in his 30s (or older) will not be of much interest.

No coincidence, trade school graduates' starting salaries are higher than those with "other" degrees.

You are wise in planning for backup. If it's just to get a box checked on an airline application, as others have said, the subject of the degree doesn't matter much. But if you have to make your living at it, that's a whole other thing. So ... your choice definitely matters.
 
of those 2, go for psychology. I've flown with lots of pilots for whom I wished I had a psychologist handy.
 
I always advocate students to major in a STEM field. Fact of the matter is not everyone can do it. Lots of students can't do math, that's why engineering pays quite well. Not so many can do chemistry, that's why Chemists can earn good money. Everyone can do Psych, which his why you can't get a job doing it.

Getting a soft degree because you want to fly is short-sighted at best. A pilot is always one medical away from unemployment.
 
Didn't we have this thread last week ?

It's deja-vu all over again.
 
nauga said:
Nauga,
whose backup plan was 'kept man'
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Lol,

Lots of truth to that. If someone wants to get into commercial flying, best long-term strategy is to marry an RN or tenured teacher.
 
Wow thank you for all the opinions and advice! I will take this all into consideration. Just wanted some opinions and life experiences and I appreciate them all.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.

If you are 10000000000% sure you are only getting a job as a pilot, then yes any degree will do, but if you don't get a pilot job, a degree like polysci is only good at McDonalds
Click to expand...


A Business degree is probably one of the more valuable degrees out there it will NEVER become useless. The whole foundation of this country is run on Business. Now my Computer Science degree learning Pascal and Cobol...Poof...gone the second year I got it!!

Everything in this country is a business either you own one or your work for one!
 
FloridaPilot said:
A Business degree is probably one of the more valuable degrees out there it will NEVER become useless. The whole foundation of this country is run on Business.
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The problem is that an undergraduate business degree doesn't qualify a person to do anything. Not enough accounting to really do accounting, not enough real-world marketing to actually go into a responsible marketing position, not enough advertising ... you get the point. It is a degree that readies someone to be a trainee, most often in a large corporation.

For a pilot making the transition to not-a-pilot, he/she will probably be old enough to be unattractive as a trainee. The company hiring a 30 or 40-year old not-a-pilot expects someone who can contribute right out of the box, like an engineer, lawyer, etc. as I described in a previous post.

An MBA or MS/Business with a quantitative emphasis like accounting, statistics, big data, etc. is another matter, but the OP is not looking to get a graduate degree at this point.

So just because business is everywhere, that is not an argument for the OP to get an undergraduate business degree.

FloridaPilot said:
Now my Computer Science degree learning Pascal and Cobol...Poof...gone the second year I got it!!
Click to expand...
If all you learned were a couple of languages you got cheated. I'm not even a programmer by trade and I have probably learned half a dozen languages over the years. Computer Science should be about learning the basics: parsing, sorting, stacks, objects, debugging, business process analysis, and many others. Using a particular language to implement your design is just a detail. Yes, it's a PITA to express yourself in some new syntax and to work in some new IDE, but it's really no different than a lawyer or CPA keeping up with the laws and regulations or an engineer keeping up with new materials and techniques.
 
weilke said:
Lots of truth to that. If someone wants to get into commercial flying, best long-term strategy is to marry an RN or tenured teacher.
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Absolutely. I flew with an FO the other day that's senior to me. His wife is a nurse, and intentionally stays put in the right seat for the schedule. The guy works something like 5 days a month, never weekends or holidays, and spends all his time with his kids. I'm guessing we have around an $80K pay differential.

I don't have a family, so weekends and crazy time off isn't huge to me, but the older I get, the more I realize that he's the one doing it right, not me.
 
FloridaPilot said:
A Business degree is probably one of the more valuable degrees out there it will NEVER become useless. The whole foundation of this country is run on Business. Now my Computer Science degree learning Pascal and Cobol...Poof...gone the second year I got it!!

Everything in this country is a business either you own one or your work for one!
Click to expand...
I would say the opposite. Businesses are run by people who know the business. They learn the business by working in a job that requires skills. The skills start with a degree in something needed by the business. That's not a degree in business.
 
Have you thought about a marketing degree?
 
airdale said:
The problem is that an undergraduate business degree doesn't qualify a person to do anything. Not enough accounting to really do accounting, not enough real-world marketing to actually go into a responsible marketing position, not enough advertising ... you get the point. It is a degree that readies someone to be a trainee, most often in a large corporation.

For a pilot making the transition to not-a-pilot, he/she will probably be old enough to be unattractive as a trainee. The company hiring a 30 or 40-year old not-a-pilot expects someone who can contribute right out of the box, like an engineer, lawyer, etc. as I described in a previous post.

An MBA or MS/Business with a quantitative emphasis like accounting, statistics, big data, etc. is another matter, but the OP is not looking to get a graduate degree at this point.

So just because business is everywhere, that is not an argument for the OP to get an undergraduate business degree.

If all you learned were a couple of languages you got cheated. I'm not even a programmer by trade and I have probably learned half a dozen languages over the years. Computer Science should be about learning the basics: parsing, sorting, stacks, objects, debugging, business process analysis, and many others. Using a particular language to implement your design is just a detail. Yes, it's a PITA to express yourself in some new syntax and to work in some new IDE, but it's really no different than a lawyer or CPA keeping up with the laws and regulations or an engineer keeping up with new materials and techniques.
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I definitely do not want to go the graduate school after. You hit the nail on the head. I want to get my instrument rating and my CPL by the time I get my degree and then try to fly commercially.
 
Mtns2Skies said:
As an engineering student with a CPL, dont waste your money on a degree in soft sciences or liberal arts, they're completely useless degrees in this day and age (business too). If you have that much of a disdain for math that you cant do engineering, then do chemistry. Atleast if flying doesnt work out you aren't up sh*ts creek. FWIW when I graduate from engineering I'll have saved enough money from internships I'll be buying my own plane right away.

If you are 10000000000% sure you are only getting a job as a pilot, then yes any degree will do, but if you don't get a pilot job, a degree like polysci is only good at McDonalds
Click to expand...

Chemistry has a good bit of math required.
 
Remember Marketing and Advertising are two completely different subjects. Advertising is what you see on tv, marketing relies much more heavy on statistics and analysis, typically. Even intermediate statistics can be a handful for people who dislike mathematics.
 
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