Why is a safety pilot required if on an ifr flight plan?

flyingron said:
Unless you're a helicopter, unless the traffic is a hot air balloon, unless the preferred radar sensor is out, for satellite departures for VFRs that haven't yet been contacted/identified, by the faciltiy You know how to read 7110.65, Steve. As I said, there are exceptions.
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If you're a helicopter you need not be separated from other helicopters. When the preferred radar sensor is out Class C service is not provided. Separation from unknown traffic isn't available in any airspace. I'll give you a point for hot air balloon.
 
roncachamp said:
If you're a helicopter you need not be separated from other helicopters. When the preferred radar sensor is out Class C service is not provided. Separation from unknown traffic isn't available in any airspace. I'll give you a point for hot air balloon.
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Yeah, class C "service not provided" doesn't mean that the "class C airspace" isn't there. The premise was that you didn't need a safety pilot in Class C airspace as you were positively separated. Nobody said anything about it having to be an airplane.
 
Then file an IFR plan to do some approaches on a dark moonless night to some country airports. As long as you navigate solely by instruments, that fulfills requirements, yes?
 
teejayevans said:
Then file an IFR plan to do some approaches on a dark moonless night to some country airports. As long as you navigate solely by instruments, that fulfills requirements, yes?
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Or why not simply practice in IMC?
 
roncachamp said:
VFR/IFR minimum radar separation in Class B airspace is 1.5 miles between aircraft that weigh more than 19,000 pounds and all turbojets. With aircraft of lesser weight the minimum is target resolution; the radar targets must not touch. VFR/IFR minimum radar separation in Class C airspace is target resolution for all aircraft.
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Not between VFR’s in C. Target resolution is between VFR and IFR. That being said, many controllers just do it anyway. It’s easier than calling traffic over and over again and then hitting the panic button with a ‘traffic alert.’
 
luvflyin said:
Not between VFR’s in C. Target resolution is between VFR and IFR. That being said, many controllers just do it anyway. It’s easier than calling traffic over and over again and then hitting the panic button with a ‘traffic alert.’
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I said nothing about VFR/VFR separation.
 
teejayevans said:
Because in some areas(Florida), benign IMC is rare.
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Sure, so in those places grab some foggles and find a safety pilot. It just seems odd to dedicate so much discussion to find ways to try to fly with a view limiting device but not another safety pilot.

I'd also suggest that benign IMC isn't *that* rare in Florida. KSGJ is advertising 4 & 800' right now, no T-storms in sight.
 
At least the FAA got their head bent around having safety pilots without instrument ratings. It used to be that there was a specific exemption in the SIC rules for safety pilots. When the FAA rejiggered that reg to change the rules for SIC type familiarity, they managed to screw up the sections that the exemption applied to. This was not mentioned in the NPRM nor the final rule preamble nor did anybody mention it in the comments. Essentially, the way the regs literally read is that if you are a SIC safety pilot under IFR, you must have an instrument rating. This means people like me can't use our wife (she's got a private but no instrument) if we are under IFR.

I filed a petition for rulemaking for a simple change to revert the rule with regard to this exception back the way it was since they surreptitiously (and probably inadvertently) made a significant rule change. I got the most bizarre response from Dan Lynch which had me and Levy scratching our heads as to what exactly goes through that sumbitch's mind.

Anyhow, subsequently the legal counsel made a bizarre interpretation that safety pilots who are not PIC are not "in command" at all (second or otherwise) and the whole rule doesn't apply to them. OK, makes little sense to me, but I gave up petitioning to change the rule.

I was more successful in my petition to get night fixed. One of two times my name has been written into the final rule preamble.
 
ChiefPilot said:
Sure, so in those places grab some foggles and find a safety pilot. It just seems odd to dedicate so much discussion to find ways to try to fly with a view limiting device but not another safety pilot.

I'd also suggest that benign IMC isn't *that* rare in Florida. KSGJ is advertising 4 & 800' right now, no T-storms in sight.
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Depends on time of year, and it’s worst as you go further south.
And it’s back to VFR. Personally I prefer real approaches, more educational and they are more satisfying.
 
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