Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux)

[wsuffa]

The camel's back is cracking and is almost broken for me. Last night took the cake.

About 4:15 AM this morning, I awoke to loud music coming from my android, which was on a charger across the room. It was an ad, blasting music loudly. I leave the volume down/off - apparently it accessed the volume/media settings, turned them up, and played whatever obnoxious ads (there was more than one) it was told to.

I leave the volume down & usually reset the device to home screen. Seems I must have left the device on a web page - the device went to sleep & I never really knew I'd left it on the page. Most pages don't auto-reset when the phone's sleeping. This one did, resulting in the load of a LOUD audio ad (that itself reset the mute/volume functions), and waking me from my slumber & leaving me in a very bad mood.

1) Web pages should not be able to reset the volume settings without human intervention (Android - FAIL, Advertiser - FAIL).
2) When the phone sleeps, it should sleep, not wake up to play an obnoxious ad (Android - FAIL, Advertiser - FAIL).

What's next? Malicious app install? There are already reports of malicious apps installing themselves to run audio ads. And Google has incentive to install such techniques as it sells ads.

Next Rant: privacy violating app updates. I currently have 7 uninstalled app updates (and most of these are sold/installed into both Apple and Android platforms) because they go too far in auto-setting permissions (with no ability for the user to adjust):

1) Bypass Lane app (BypassLane) - this app was useful; use it at a ball park to pre-order food from your seat & pick up from expedited line. No standing in line. The revised version allows itself to "have full audio recording privileges" on your device. Excuse me? Why does it need to record audio? Oh, and that's not all - the Apple version's EULA says:

Consent to Receive Commercial E-mail. YOU CONSENT TO RECEIVE COMMERCIAL E-MAIL MESSAGES FROM OR ON BEHALF OF BYPASS AND OUR PARTNERS, AND ACKNOWLEDGE AND AGREE THAT YOUR PRIMARY EMAIL ADDRESSES AND OTHER INFORMATION MAY BE USED BY BYPASS FOR THE PURPOSE OF INITIATING COMMERCIAL E-MAIL MESSAGES.

You've opted in to Spam spam spam spam....

2) Facebook. Send, receive, read, edit SMS messages. Act as account & authentication administrator, manage accounts list. Read & write contact data. Discover all your known accounts.

3) Google Voice: read sensitive log data, read & write contact data, intercept outgoing calls. Discover all known accounts, view configured accounts.

4) Pandora: Add & modify calendar, send email to guests, read contact data, modify/delete memory contents.

5) Google Maps: record audio. Discover known accounts. Read & write contact data.

For Apple, the Twitter and one other app auto-send your entire contact list to the app provider, no opt out.

After the 4:15 AM wake-up this morning, I'm ready to dump the smart phone and go back to the Blackberry full-time.

 

[Bob Noel]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I'm so glad my cellphone is just that, a cellphone.

 

[Tom-D]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Thanks for that, I was thinking of up grading.

 

[Sac Arrow]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I have a similar issue with my Iphone 4G, but not quite as bad. It has a hardware speaker mute switch (Great!) but it doesn't POSITIVELY control the speaker. Certain apps and functions (like U Tube) can bypass it. If I have a switch to turn the sound off, I want it to TURN THE SOUND OFF!!

 

[SkyHog]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Recording audio is done on Android devices as part of the voice recognition.

Both Google+ and Facebook use your contacts to match up status updates with your known contacts.

Google Voice needing those permissions is pretty self explanatory, since it is intended to replace the built in dialing functions of an android device.

As for the ad? I suspect you did not have your phone muted. There is no way for an app to change your volume setting. It can, at the very best, link to your volume setting page for you to change it, but cannot make the change yourself. Even less so if it was an embedded ad on a webpage.

When a phone is asleep, it is not powered off. That is the difference. If it were off, you couldn't get notifications, have your alarm go off, or anything else that most people do when it is in their pocket. Best bet, if you don't want this stuff to happen at night is to turn it off.

Page autoresetting is controlled by the webpage developer, not the device. One can set an auto-refresh period and have the page reload periodically to make sure the most up to date content is showed. That might have caused the ad to load.

 

[cavmedic]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Every Night at 2224 , my wifes phone pumps out some ad for verizon. She doesnt have a smart phone either. We cant turn it off and verizon claims to not know anything about it.

I learned long ago to turn on vibrate when sleeping. If there is an emergency in the middle of the night, it will still be there in the morning.

 

[wsuffa]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Recording audio is done on Android devices as part of the voice recognition.

There is no reason that should need to be done for an app to order stuff at a ballpark/arena. The app does not claim to have voice recognition. It may be needed for other stuff, but there is no indication of why or what controls are placed on the use of it. In theory, the device could turn on recording any time, including business discussions....

Both Google+ and Facebook use your contacts to match up status updates with your known contacts.

Exactly my point.

And if we don't want that to happen? I don't want G+ or FB (or any other app) to read my contact list without my permission. There needs to be an element of finer control granted. Apple is now having to answer to Congress over the automatic uploading of full contact lists to Twitter and Path.

Google Voice needing those permissions is pretty self explanatory, since it is intended to replace the built in dialing functions of an android device.

Problem is that neither GV nor Skype can be deleted from my device. Likewise Amazon MP3, CityID, and some other crapware that I don't want & don't use. Also problematic given G's new privacy policies.

As for the ad? I suspect you did not have your phone muted. There is no way for an app to change your volume setting. It can, at the very best, link to your volume setting page for you to change it, but cannot make the change yourself. Even less so if it was an embedded ad on a webpage.

I can guarantee that the phone was muted. And, at least on my phone, an app or website can turn on the audio path and set volume. YouTube can (and has), Skype has, and another webpage has.

When a phone is asleep, it is not powered off. That is the difference. If it were off, you couldn't get notifications, have your alarm go off, or anything else that most people do when it is in their pocket. Best bet, if you don't want this stuff to happen at night is to turn it off.

Got that. But there is no reason I should HAVE to turn it off. If one uses a device as primary phone then it would be a bad thing to have to turn it off at night, no? Especially when one has elderly family members to care for.

Page autoresetting is controlled by the webpage developer, not the device. One can set an auto-refresh period and have the page reload periodically to make sure the most up to date content is showed. That might have caused the ad to load.

Got that, too. Is there any reason that the phone should allow this to happen when the phone is sleeping? After all, it not only burns battery but it burns bandwidth. At the very least, the option should exist for one to turn it off.

 

[rpadula]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

And if we don't want that to happen? I don't want G+ or FB (or any other app) to read my contact list without my permission. There needs to be an element of finer control granted.

Heck, I don't want them to read it at all! I've not installed some apps because it sure looked like the only way the "find my friends" features could work would be if it accessed my contact list. NFW.

Apple is now having to answer to Congress over the automatic uploading of full contact lists to Twitter and Path.

http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/15...ion-for-ios-apps-accessing-address-book-data/

Apple will be fixing that soon, but I'm surprised how they let that happen. I can remember looking into J2ME programming for phones many years ago, and contacts were off-limits.

 

[BrianNC]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I have an iPhone, love it, never have a problem with it. Maybe it's user error. :wink2:

 

[ron22]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I have a cell phone that just makes phone calls. Well it can text too
That is what a phone should do right call people not play on the internet.

 

[Jim Logajan]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Try living your life without any cell phone, fancy or plain vanilla.

Don't be a slave to portable communications.

 

[dmccormack]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I had an Android for about 45 days.

Went back to the phone store and told them it was the most worthless piece of phoney-baloney geek tomfoolery ever foisted upon an unsuspecting consumer and should be consigned to the Iscariot level of hell.

What's the point of investing hours managing hundreds of mini-software applications on a handheld device?

I'll keep my BlackBerry.

 

[rpadula]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I have an iPhone, love it, never have a problem with it. Maybe it's user error. :wink2:

Like this?

http://daringfireball.net/2012/01/iphone_mute_switch_design

 

[BrianNC]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Like this?

http://daringfireball.net/2012/01/iphone_mute_switch_design

Yep. You should know your phone when muted will still sound an alarm you have set. It's one of the first things I found out about it. I put my phone on mute every night when I go to sleep but can still use it for my alarm clock. It keeps someone from calling and waking me up, but still allows the alarm to wake me up. I think it's a nice feature. I know how my phone works.

 

[alaskaflyer]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Try living your life without any cell phone, fancy or plain vanilla.

Don't be a slave to portable communications.

And just as at home, just because you have a mobile device doesn't mean you have to answer it whenever it demands your attention. At least outside of work

 

[wanttaja]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

When a phone is asleep, it is not powered off. That is the difference. If it were off, you couldn't get notifications, have your alarm go off, or anything else that most people do when it is in their pocket.

'Cept in my case: My Droid turns itself back on. Power down all the way, and two minutes to twelve hours later, it pops back on. The only way to prevent it is to remove the battery after the power-down (it can be re-inserted immediately without the phone coming back to life).

My Droid does it, my wife's Droid does it, and according to hundreds of folks on one of the Droid forums, their phones do it to. Wide variety of Motorola models; folks turn theirs back in, and the new ones do it too.

Most people probably don't notice, since they leave their phones on all the time anyway. I don't....

Ron Wanttaja

 

[Jay Honeck]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

You guys are funny.

I'm on my second Android phone. Mary's got my first one. My daughter is on the third generation. My son is on the second.

I have gotten to the point where I cannot imagine living without it. This single device has replaced:

1. Phone (d'oh!)
2. Car GPS
3. Camera
4. Video recorder
5. Watch
6. Alarm clock/radio
7. Walkman/MP3 player

Additionally, it allows me to text, email, and Facebook. I view pictures and videos on it. I Skype on it. Because I have a gmail account, everything is automatically synced between the phone and my PC.

I can't remember the last time we were together driving when one of us didn't ask a question that required going to "The Cloud" for an answer. I can't remember the last time we drove to an unknown area where one of us didn't ask the 'Droid for directions. (And yes, all you do is ask. No typing involved at all.)

The Android truly is the Swiss Army knife of devices. I would not want to be without it.

 

[Henning]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

That's it, if you don't want the stuff that comes with the apps, then don't get the apps. If the smart phone annoys you with all its features and the associated BS that comes as part of having those features be of no cost to you, then don't get a smart phone. If you don't want spam and other human annoyances though, you're gonna have to get a cabin in the middle of nowhere, because the spam comes from every direction. If you haven't noticed, our entire worlds economy is a giant Ponzi scheme requiring an ever increasing level of consumerism to keep the "upline" paying. Eventually the money runs out. Funny thing is the money ran out decades ago yet we keep borrowing more to throw into the game hoping to get onto a "pay line" in life, doesn't matter if we're talking someone on welfare or the Gov't of the US or almost any nation at this point (though there are a couple who refuse the buy in, and more who can't afford to play), it's all the same. The system we operate under is fundamentally flawed to never work well except for the guys on the top pay line, and every time the scheme crashes, the entire bottom 3 tiers of the pyramid take it in the shorts. The last one was worse though, the hit ate all the way to the third and even second stage of the tier, this time the only people I saw unhurt were the top tier players, the guys ordering 180'+ yachts, they have been the ones really prospering over the last few years, orders are up and they're getting even bigger, new built as yachts over 400' (used to be yachts that size were converted medium sized passenger ships retired from commercial service. Now they are new builds @ around $1BB).

Technology is not the problem, our society is. You see, you'll never escape the complaints you have; 20 years ago you'd be bitching about stacks of junk mail, spam is and always will be part of our economy until we make fundamental changes in our society. You can return to your phone only phone and still get inundated with telemarketers. You can either accept and learn how to deal with the new annoyances or stay upset about them, but the only way to escape them is to go full Kazinski.

 

[Henning]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

You guys are funny.

I'm on my second Android phone. Mary's got my first one. My daughter is on the third generation. My son is on the second.

I have gotten to the point where I cannot imagine living without it. This single device has replaced:

1. Phone (d'oh!)
2. Car GPS
3. Camera
4. Video recorder
5. Watch
6. Alarm clock/radio
7. Walkman/MP3 player

Additionally, it allows me to text, email, and Facebook. I view pictures and videos on it. I Skype on it. Because I have a gmail account, everything is automatically synced between the phone and my PC.

I can't remember the last time we were together driving when one of us didn't ask a question that required going to "The Cloud" for an answer. I can't remember the last time we drove to an unknown area where one of us didn't ask the 'Droid for directions. (And yes, all you do is ask. No typing involved at all.)

The Android truly is the Swiss Army knife of devices. I would not want to be without it.

x about 12 years for me. I've been using "smart phones" before they called them that; I had the original Seimens Pocket PC Phone edition. Without it my life becomes considerably more difficult and less efficient. The small extra operational annoyance that comes from having these units is far outweighed by the benefits they provide me. Like you, I replaced a back pack of crap for a single unit that fits in my pocket and is always with me. The exception is the MP3 player, I don't use my Android for that, the battery life is too weak.

Now if you want to start bitching about technical and ergonomic issues with smart phones, we can can get into a good bitching session there.

 

[Jim_R]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

1) Web pages should not be able to reset the volume settings without human intervention (Android - FAIL, Advertiser - FAIL).

There are different volume settings for media vs. ringers/alerts. You may have had the ringtones turned down, but not the media volume.

There are free apps available with sophisticated time- and location-based automatic settings adjustments that are pretty easy to use. Mine is set to always be on vibrate at the office and at night, and be silent at the theater, for instance. Check out Llama, Tasker, or Locale apps from the Market.

2) When the phone sleeps, it should sleep, not wake up to play an obnoxious ad (Android - FAIL, Advertiser - FAIL).

The phone is not "asleep"...the screen is off. Do you want it to ring when someone calls you? Do you want to know if you get an email or text message? Do you want it to wake you up in the morning with an alarm?

Maybe you don't, but lots of people do, and that's why the phone works that way. If you want it to be silent no matter what, then use the power button and turn the phone all the way off.

What's next? Malicious app install?

Why, yes! It's a completely logical jump to go from "my phone made a noise last night" to "apps are going to magically install themselves and destroy things". That's probably exactly what's next.

I'm ready to dump the smart phone and go back to the Blackberry full-time.

Sounds like that's the right thing for you.

 

[Aztec Driver]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Sure, smartphones do a lot, they just don't do any of it well. I always wondered about all of this new technology, getting smaller and more "versatile." Entertainment, for instance. Who wants to see a movie on a 3" screen? Who wants to listen to music on tiny ear buds or speakers? If I want to look up somethinge on the internet, I want to actually see what it is I am looking for. While I have found uses for this IPAD, I much prefer my laptop.

I just don't have the need to be constantly bombarded with information. Doesn't anyone enjoy silence anymore?

 

[Arbiter419]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

You guys are funny.

I'm on my second Android phone. Mary's got my first one. My daughter is on the third generation. My son is on the second.

I have gotten to the point where I cannot imagine living without it. This single device has replaced:

1. Phone (d'oh!)
2. Car GPS
3. Camera
4. Video recorder
5. Watch
6. Alarm clock/radio
7. Walkman/MP3 player

Additionally, it allows me to text, email, and Facebook. I view pictures and videos on it. I Skype on it. Because I have a gmail account, everything is automatically synced between the phone and my PC.

I can't remember the last time we were together driving when one of us didn't ask a question that required going to "The Cloud" for an answer. I can't remember the last time we drove to an unknown area where one of us didn't ask the 'Droid for directions. (And yes, all you do is ask. No typing involved at all.)

The Android truly is the Swiss Army knife of devices. I would not want to be without it.

I'm with you, Jay. I really like my LG Thrill.

 

[ChrisK]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Sure, smartphones do a lot, they just don't do any of it well. I always wondered about all of this new technology, getting smaller and more "versatile." Entertainment, for instance. Who wants to see a movie on a 3" screen? Who wants to listen to music on tiny ear buds or speakers? If I want to look up somethinge on the internet, I want to actually see what it is I am looking for. While I have found uses for this IPAD, I much prefer my laptop.

I just don't have the need to be constantly bombarded with information. Doesn't anyone enjoy silence anymore?

After my wife falls asleep I watch tv shows on my Galaxy S2 with my headphones in =P

 

[Henning]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Sure, smartphones do a lot, they just don't do any of it well. I always wondered about all of this new technology, getting smaller and more "versatile." Entertainment, for instance. Who wants to see a movie on a 3" screen? Who wants to listen to music on tiny ear buds or speakers? If I want to look up somethinge on the internet, I want to actually see what it is I am looking for. While I have found uses for this IPAD, I much prefer my laptop.

I just don't have the need to be constantly bombarded with information. Doesn't anyone enjoy silence anymore?

True, but for 90% of the time, it does it more than well enough for what we need it to do. For the rest of the time, that's what we have real gear for. Of my facebook photo album probably half of the pictures are taken with my phone. The quality I need in a lens less than 70mm is low enough that I no longer carry a short lens and will just use my phone to cover those needs (unless it's a paying photo gig) or an Olympus Stylus Tough.

 

[L.Adamson]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Sure, smartphones do a lot, they just don't do any of it well. I always wondered about all of this new technology, getting smaller and more "versatile." Entertainment, for instance. Who wants to see a movie on a 3" screen? Who wants to listen to music on tiny ear buds or speakers? If I want to look up somethinge on the internet, I want to actually see what it is I am looking for. While I have found uses for this IPAD, I much prefer my laptop.

I just don't have the need to be constantly bombarded with information. Doesn't anyone enjoy silence anymore?

For my line of business, heating & air conditioning............the smart phone is very worthwhile. I can look up service manuals, service bulletins, product specifications, warranty information, etc...........right on the spot. It's like carrying an office in your pocket.

 

[wsuffa]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

There are different volume settings for media vs. ringers/alerts. You may have had the ringtones turned down, but not the media volume.

How many ways can I say this: the media volume was down. It got turned to "full up" position, which is a setting that I never, ever use ( I hate loud audio).

Why, yes! It's a completely logical jump to go from "my phone made a noise last night" to "apps are going to magically install themselves and destroy things". That's probably exactly what's next.

You've never heard of drive-by downloads, have you.

Or this: http://www.pcworld.com/article/245305/sneaky_mobile_ads_invade_android_phones.html

Or the cell providers/manufacturers that install unwanted apps (in computer terms "crapware") that you can't remove (at least on a computer you can remove them) without rooting the device.

But hey, if you don't care, then just ignore this thread.

Sounds like that's the right thing for you.

Actually, it's not ideal. What's needed is the ability to select options and have them stick to give control of the device back to the user. Perhaps you don't care & you're in the multitude that's willing to sell out every shred of privacy for the ability to use a smartphone. Others do care.

BTW, Apple users are not immune.... Link to today's story about Google deliberately bypassing no-track cookie options in Safari.

 

[Henning]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Actually, it's not ideal. What's needed is the ability to select options and have them stick to give control of the device back to the user. Perhaps you don't care & you're in the multitude that's willing to sell out every shred of privacy for the ability to use a smartphone. Others do care.

Just like everything else in life, if you want it done right, do it yourself. Make us the ultimate smart phone, plenty of good hardware to use, just write new software for it so it does what you want it to do. I might buy one if you build it just right for me too.

Privacy is a myth anymore, there is none, the only protection your privacy has is what your lawyer can get thrown out of a court case because the cops violate the law getting the evidence, that's it. The rest of what you think is privacy does not actually exist anymore. There is very little about your life that is not in some public record being crawled by Google right now.

 

[wsuffa]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Privacy is a myth anymore, there is none, the only protection your privacy has is what your lawyer can get thrown out of a court case because the cops violate the law getting the evidence, that's it. The rest of what you think is privacy does not actually exist anymore. There is very little about your life that is not in some public record being crawled by Google right now.

THere is no reason that we should encourage further extension of the behavior. And there's no reason that the behavior shouldn't be exposed when discovered. As you well know, the government uses the commercial data, too - one mistake in the inference algorithms (or the underlying data) can have pretty substantial consequences. Identity theft is but one example.

Just 'cause you may be OK with it doesn't mean others are.

 

[ClimbnSink]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Ok with it or acknowledging existing reality? With all the corruption among cops and DAs, walking around with a GPS device is probably more likely to clear you of something you haven't done then hang you.

 

[PW_Plack]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Ok with it or acknowledging existing reality? With all the corruption among cops and DAs, walking around with a GPS device is probably more likely to clear you of something you haven't done then hang you.

There are multiple issues in this thread. One if the erosion of privacy. That one's a little complicated. In some ways, we're no less private than we were ten years ago, we're just more aware of it than we've ever been.

Another issue - We may, as a society, require a more precise definition of "free." It literally means, "at no cost," but its legal advertising definition seems to be, "at no monetary cost." There are other costs, including time spent, sleep lost, and security vulnerabilities. That "free" app is usually being offered by a for-profit enterprise. If they're not taking your money, you should expect they'll be taking something else from you that they can resell.

But many of these issues might go unnoticed if not for the real issue here: Software writers who apparently don't interact with actual humans. Some of these apps behave like boorish, socially-inept acquaintances who seem clueless they're ****ing people off. If they'd learn some manners, we might not start thinking of them as borderline malware.

My desktop computer does it to me all the time. Microsoft promises "you may continue working" when I click to install that Windows update, but then pesters me with a "must reboot" nag screen every few minutes once it's installed. If I update Internet Explorer, I get nagged to take a tour of the new features every time I open it afterward until I relent. An Adobe Application I use daily in my work came out with a new version a few years ago that turned the old version's hot keys into destructive commands that alter files.

I've appreciated this discussion, because I'm on the verge of getting my first smartphone. I already keep an old mobile phone which no longer has service by my bedside as an alarm clock, specifically because it won't do anything but keep the time sync'd to the network, wake me up when I've told it to, and make a 911 call if I need it to.

I don't count on my current mobile phone as my only phone service. I have Ooma, which acts just like a landline but works over my internet connection, and apparently was designed by people with manners. Once you buy the hardware, it's free, really free, unless you pay the $10/month for expanded features.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Is there a support group for us dumbphone-lovers? I love the small size, ease of use, lack of complexity or security issues that come with my stupid samsung so much that I just bought another one off ebay.

 

[Henning]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

THere is no reason that we should encourage further extension of the behavior. And there's no reason that the behavior shouldn't be exposed when discovered. As you well know, the government uses the commercial data, too - one mistake in the inference algorithms (or the underlying data) can have pretty substantial consequences. Identity theft is but one example.

Just 'cause you may be OK with it doesn't mean others are.

I'm not 'Ok' with it, to me the futility in the matter makes it a non priority. Now, no matter what we do or how valiant the effort, Pandora's box is open, and it didn't crack open, it exploded.

I just think that triaging our society has me putting that one in the "stick em in the corner and keep fluids in him, if he's still alive when we get through all these other guys who have a chance at survival, he's at the top of the too far gone list".

I appreciate your efforts in my regards, but I'm sorry, I gave up that cause and handle it all on my own. The information out there is what it is and there is no feasible way to stop it from continuing and morphing further.

You do have an option though. You can learn Spanish and work in an underground cash economy/society, likely without having to move very far. There are other 'underground' cash industries in this country. You can live quite easily in this country without having to give out your details though, just live off cash, everything. Doctors, hospitals, lawyers. Live with roomates no bills in your name... You can be anonymous as soon as you detach yourself from Wall Street. Once you let them know everything about your life by swiping your card, you basically signed away any logical expectation of privacy. Banks are evil (little e, not big, as in 'don't care about your best interests and will steal everything they can from you to increase their bonus including selling your info to marketers), evil begets evil, therefor you should expect that anything a bank does will be evil.

If you buy into the rest of American society though, this comes with it because people are just plain f-d up, and there's so many people total that even a small percent with use of the communications technology available can cause any efforts to control the problem an exercise in futility. As with all regulation that has been brought up on this, it's either been shouted down as Draconian (Censoring communications basically) or given up on or proven ineffective and typically too late anyway as technology had already moved on.

We shouldn't be looking to moving backwards to a 'way that was', rather forward to a better way of filing all your data with more difficult access and a unique finger print when that block of data is accessed by someone so that person can be identified anywhere in the world and held criminally responsible for breeches in data dissemination regulation. Unfortunately the only way I can figure out to make the system work is if everybody who wants access to any electronic media formats has a personal transponder chip implanted that interface with all electronic data devices and finger prints every exchange, and I'm not that fussed about my public info accessability to go there. So, since I see no feasible solution I like better than the status quo, I have resigned to accept what is.

 

[RyanShort1]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Interesting Henning.
Sounds a lot like what some people fear from a biblical "end-times" standpoint is exactly what you are seeing as likely.

Ryan

 

[Jim_R]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Actually, it's not ideal. What's needed is the ability to select options and have them stick to give control of the device back to the user. Perhaps you don't care & you're in the multitude that's willing to sell out every shred of privacy for the ability to use a smartphone. Others do care.

No, I agonized over the privacy issues and I'm still not thrilled with them. I'm also not thrilled about the price of avgas or many of the regulations that burden certificated aircraft. I'm not particularly pleased about my choices for political representation, or how some of my tax dollars are spent. I wish there were more healthy options when I went out to eat.

But I still fly, and vote, and eat at restaurants. I guess that makes me part of the problem.

BTW, Apple users are not immune.... Link to today's story about Google deliberately bypassing no-track cookie options in Safari.

Don't need to tell me that. I tried to tell you that weeks ago, but you were reluctant to believe it. Guess it's starting to sink in, now.

Smartphones come with costs to the user, not all of which are monetary. TANSTAAFL is as much in effect today as it ever was.

Until someone devises and implements a business plan that provides all the same conveniences that customers have come to expect from smartphones without extracting the value that businesses get from the thousand paper cuts of privacy intrusion that happen with typical usage today, you have a simple choice:

Pay the "privacy tax", or don't.

 

[Dean]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

I dumped the smartphone about a year ago and I haven't missed it one bit.

 

[Henning]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Interesting Henning.
Sounds a lot like what some people fear from a biblical "end-times" standpoint is exactly what you are seeing as likely.

Ryan

Funny thing that, I was raised non religious. I was Baptized a Lutheran but my dad had been raised and educated at a Catholic monastery during WWII and realized that if these were 'Men of God' then God could not exist as they claim and is a very Stoic atheist, a more morally driven person of his own accord than any religious zealot I have ever met. I was familiar with the Cecil B DeMill Bible Story Epics, it wasn't that religion was shunned, it was just viewed in a historic and cultural context and the movies as entertainment.

I didn't read the bible in its entirety until Donna Beuhner, a Born Again boss at Balboa Boat Rental gave me my own copy. I thought it a good read although the Book of Begats gets a bit tedious. I typically agreed with Jesus' assessment of the situation and the eventual outcome. Since there has been no substantial change in the essence of mankind since that time there is no reason the outcome could not be accurate. Everything between then and now has just been a progression of the same type of competitive mindset. We still have primitive brains in those regards and as our technology and population increases further in this mind set, the odds of it actually coming to fruition go up. There is also the matter of the 'missing years of Christ' in the Bible and where was he and what was he studying. For the last two years I lived with 2 Indians on my crew and tell me of the stories in their culture also acknowledging Christ during the years he studied there. What I read of Christ's teachings sounded a lot like Eastern Philosophy which is a lot like Quantum Physics as well.

When I look at all of it with nothing invested in any particular dogma, I find myself seeing the brilliance in the question Carl Sagan proposed to ask an alien race making contact, "How do you survive to make it that far without killing yourselves?" What the hell, here's a subjet that multiple factions of people basically agree on yet go to war and commit atrocities over. Then I look and I see that none of these people who claim to be acting in behalf of their God are actually doing anything in behalf of anyone except some evil power hungry bastard (and his following legacy of the throne of power applicable and empire they created) with major ego and self loathing/worth/ego issues.

Then I stop and look at all the other reasons people fight and I realize that man is like any other mammal and we are pre-programmed to fight and compete, we missed that evolutionary jump where we stop being competitors and start being cooperators. Insects you don't see this behavior because they developed to their evolutionary potential long ago being much older and considerably simpler. When you have finished evolving into your place of the great engine that is the universe, then there is no longer a need to be competitive because no further development is required. Basically the the point that Jesus was trying to get across was "Look, there is no exclusivity to God, It's not about what you think it's about. Quit fighting, cooperate and everything comes to you." In this message he utterly failed at getting it adopted by society, they completely misconstrued what he was saying to fit personal agendas not minutes after he died.

Taking just this bit into consideration with everything else, I just resolve to play my little insignificant part in the engine that is our universe and have some fun realizing that we are likely a doomed species approaching critical mass and I'm watching the show to see what happens next, it's as interesting a way to occupy the mind as anything else trying to see where opportunity for mankind lies and watch the roads we as a species choose.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

<SNIP>
Then I stop and look at all the other reasons people fight and I realize that man is like any other mammal and we are pre-programmed to fight and compete, we missed that evolutionary jump where we stop being competitors and start being cooperators. Insects you don't see this behavior because they developed to their evolutionary potential long ago being much older and considerably simpler. When you have finished evolving into your place of the great engine that is the universe, then there is no longer a need to be competitive because no further development is required. <SNIP>

I guess you've never witnessed the scene below where two ant colonies of the same species fight it out.

 

[SCCutler]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Is there a support group for us dumbphone-lovers? I love the small size, ease of use, lack of complexity or security issues that come with my stupid samsung so much that I just bought another one off ebay.

You need this:

http://www.greatcall.com/jitterbug/

 

[Jim_R]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

Uh oh--need to start wearing the tin foil hat when shopping at Target now, too. (If you're female and gravid, that is.)

 

[rainsux]

Re: Why I'm thinking of dumping smartphone (Google, Apple, Apps Makers are evil redux

> ditch ... smartphone

I did it in late Nov. Went with an iPod Touch. I do use VoIP over WiFi. So I'm
immune to the nonsense of the cellco's themselves. I leech WiFi from businesses.
When that's not avail, and I need to make a call, I turn-on the MiFi.

> story about Google deliberately bypassing no-track cookie options in Safari.

... and IE ... and Firefox. Google is exploiting a loophole in the (voluntary) P2PP
[cough] standards.