Which plane would you lean towards for upgrades?

J

Jthamilton

Line Up and Wait
Joined
May 31, 2012
Messages
616
Location
Steamboat Springs, CO
Display Name
Okie182
Home Airfield
KCAG
So taking my wife and 2 kids (11 and 9 in a month) to Kcut in morning to see Mt. Rushmore. While doing my weight and balance it struck me that it won't be long before we're making short hops for fuel. We have a 2002 T182t and its a great plane for now.

Now it got me to thinking that what am I going to upgrade too if anything? For the 200-300 nautical mile trips here in the mountains is the T206 the best aircraft? Then do the flights back to Oklahoma and desire to make long family trips to see the parents warrant something's like a B36tc,

If I had the cash (I don't ) I would consider a piper matrix.

What would you do?
 
That's a nice aircraft you have...have you thought about sending your luggage FedEx the day before you leave? It'll be cheaper than a new plane. :lol:

Seriously though the kids grow up fast, don't they?
 
It's rediculous how fast they grow. Just last fall my son walked nose first into rear stabilizer carrying the chocks. He reminded me today that he was nowhere close to being at risk of doing it anymore.

With the wife going to OSH this year I'm going to prime her a little on aircraft we need before we go!:yes:
 
I'd wait and see how the trips pan out, which usage patterns emerge over the years, if the need for fuel stops is real vs imagined (especially east-bound) and how you feel about all that stuff then rather than now.

PS: BTDT 30+ years ago.
 
wabower said:
I'd wait and see how the trips pan out, which usage patterns emerge over the years, if the need for fuel stops is real vs imagined (especially east-bound) and how you feel about all that stuff then rather than now.

PS: BTDT 30+ years ago.
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Yeah I'm not dropping the current aircraft this year. I figure I can do some calorie reduction with the kids dinner and get some additional fuel for awhile :D

The trips to Oklahoma are a given and have to be done to check on my parents and some property I have there. Gonna fly from Steamboat to San Antonio to sea world next month. We would probably have to stop with most aircraft with that one anyway. I have soft spot in my heart for south TX, that will always be on our list of places to go?
 
I'll bet you a Dr. Pepper that you'll have at least a half-dozen opportunities to do some kind of favorable deal with plane owners on your airport between now and the time the current plane becomes a problem.

Jthamilton said:
Yeah I'm not dropping the current aircraft this year. I figure I can do some calorie reduction with the kids dinner and get some additional fuel for awhile :D

The trips to Oklahoma are a given and have to be done to check on my parents and some property I have there. Gonna fly from Steamboat to San Antonio to sea world next month. We would probably have to stop with most aircraft with that one anyway. I have soft spot in my heart for south TX, that will always be on our list of places to go?
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I will take that bet!

Not but a few aircraft at KCAG, most are the family that does all the cropdusting in the mountains and predator control for ranchers. Watched one of the sons fly 100agl over the town 2 nights ago for mosquito control. Great family, they have the original piper their granpa used since 1950 or 1951. Their stable primarily is crop dusters, 1 turbine and 2 piston.

Very laid back setting at KCAG, come and go as you want, do as you want within reason and surrounded by beautiful country.
 
In that case do you want regular or diet? Something you posted made me think that you moved to the big airport.

Jthamilton said:
I will take that bet!

Not but a few aircraft at KCAG, most are the family that does all the cropdusting in the mountains and predator control for ranchers. Watched one of the sons fly 100agl over the town 2 nights ago for mosquito control. Great family, they have the original piper their granpa used since 1950 or 1951. Their stable primarily is crop dusters, 1 turbine and 2 piston.

Very laid back setting at KCAG, come and go as you want, do as you want within reason and surrounded by beautiful country.
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wabower said:
I'd wait and see how the trips pan out, which usage patterns emerge over the years, if the need for fuel stops is real vs imagined (especially east-bound) and how you feel about all that stuff then rather than now.

PS: BTDT 30+ years ago.
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:D

I agree
.
9 years ago, I had 2 kids and remarried a woman with a child of her own.

All of a sudden… my 4 passenger M–35 wasn't going to carry all of us and I needed to upgrade…

I justified myself all the way up to a 340, not only for the increased number of seats, but also how many more trips we could all take together as one big happy family.

We made exactly one flight with all 5 of us on boardBefore my oldest left for college:goofy:
 
Well I'd sell that 182, those late models are way to heavy and $pendy IMO

Maybe look into a Comanche, commander, white lighting, C210.

Of course this depends on what tickets you hold, how many hours a month you fly too, I mean if you only log like 50hrs a year, you probably shouldn't be flying anything over 120kts or a retract or IFR
 
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Jthamilton said:
So taking my wife and 2 kids (11 and 9 in a month) to Kcut in morning to see Mt. Rushmore. While doing my weight and balance it struck me that it won't be long before we're making short hops for fuel. We have a 2002 T182t and its a great plane for now.
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Wait, what? You have a Skylane, and two kids, and you're worried about payload? Something doesn't add up.

What is the true useful load of that plane?
 
Jay Honeck said:
Wait, what? You have a Skylane, and two kids, and you're worried about payload? Something doesn't add up.

What is the true useful load of that plane?
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Shut UP, Jay! Jim's got him looking at 340's, let's watch. :D
 
If you want to stay single engine and have an easy transition - why not look at a 210 or even a P210?
 
That's how my co-owner in the T-210 got hooked and bought in. His T-182 wouldn't carry the growing family plus bags. The 210 would haul 89 gal fuel plus 1,000# in the cabin plus all the bags they owned and handle the high DA at Farmington, Salida and Aspen.

stratobee said:
If you want to stay single engine and have an easy transition - why not look at a 210 or even a P210?
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wabower said:
I'd wait and see how the trips pan out, which usage patterns emerge over the years, if the need for fuel stops is real vs imagined (especially east-bound) and how you feel about all that stuff then rather than now.

PS: BTDT 30+ years ago.
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I'm liking this line of thinking. Switching planes is not without a significant cost, and it might be a while for you to achieve a proper ROI.

Wayne counseled me a long time ago to think hard about how many times the load would be maxed out (very few) and how often the flight will be solo or with just one passenger (all the time). Then he said to purchase for the main mission and flying, and get "rental access" to the bigger aircraft that handles the bigger missions.

Keep networking around your area to find someone with a larger plane that might work a decent dry rental arrangement with you.
 
Yep, it's not every day you get to see an invoice that brings a grown man to tears. 340 owners get to see them every year.

JimG. said:
:goofy:

Everybody should upgrade to 1 at least once in their life:D
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wabower said:
Yep, it's not every day you get to see an invoice that brings a grown man to tears. 340 owners get to see them every year.
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Not to mention the weight loss benefits of throwing up…:D
 
wabower said:
He's talking about upgrades, not going the other way.
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OUCH!

However depending on the UL of his plane going the other way might not be a bad option. My 83 will haul 1250lbs and she isn't the most trim lady on the block.

For us however even if we started having kids now (and stuck with a planned limit of two) it will be quite a while before we need more payload.

Now more speed.....
 
Funny. Atlas will spank a 182 in every, single performance parameter.

Not to mention, comfort for someone like my wife, who can't even see over the ridiculously tall panel that most 182s inexplicably sport.

Not to hijack the thread, but does anyone know why Cessna made the Skylane panel so tall? The Pathfinder's panel is a good 2" shorter, which makes all the difference for someone like Mary, at 5-foot-nuthin' tall.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Not to hijack the thread, but does anyone know why Cessna made the Skylane panel so tall? The Pathfinder's panel is a good 2" shorter, which makes all the difference for someone like Mary, at 5-foot-nuthin' tall.
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Tubes took up a lot of room in the old days?

My old 172 had a high panel for my short ex-wife to see over as well.

I just bought her a fold up booster seat from sporty's and gave it to her for Christmas one year

10124.jpg
 
I assume you understand the significance of the "T" designation for an airplane based in Steamboat Springs? Are you thinking that Stubby can outperform him there? He lives at a higher altitude than you normally cruise, according to your posts on the subject.

Jay Honeck said:
Funny. Atlas will spank a 182 in every, single performance parameter.

Not to mention, comfort for someone like my wife, who can't even see over the ridiculously tall panel that most 182s inexplicably sport.

Not to hijack the thread, but does anyone know why Cessna made the Skylane panel so tall? The Pathfinder's panel is a good 2" shorter, which makes all the difference for someone like Mary, at 5-foot-nuthin' tall.
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Just sitting here watching wife unload pics on camera so she can take more pics here in Mt Rushmore area.

It may have been missed but we do live now in steamboat and I fly out of Craig. DA at 600 am 2 days ago was 7200'. I would like I say I'm pretty chiseled guy at 6'3" and 240 pounds but I will just leave it at I weigh 240. The wife 150 (so she says and I'm not disputing it)! Kids weigh collectively 140 pounds and are growing fast! Then per CPA mountain flying recommendations of flying no more then 10% Gross it just got me curious!

The 182 definitely is great aircraft and Im just picking everyone's brains. Well she is done and I'm forced to drive again! Thanks
 
JimG. said:
Tubes took up a lot of room in the old days?

My old 172 had a high panel for my short ex-wife to see over as well.

I just bought her a fold up booster seat from sporty's and gave it to her for Christmas one year

10124.jpg
Click to expand...

Yeah, Mary uses something like that in both of our planes. (She's handy with a sewing machine, so she made her own.)

When we were looking to upgrade from our old Warrior, we test-flew a 182 (which I really liked) and her comment was "No way!" She literally could not see anything, even with a pillow! At 6', even I had a really poor view forward.

I wonder if the panels were designed for the old tube radios? That would make a lot of sense.
 
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wabower said:
I assume you understand the significance of the "T" designation for an airplane based in Steamboat Springs? Are you thinking that Stubby can outperform him there? He lives at a higher altitude than you normally cruise, according to your posts on the subject.
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Whoops -- I missed that. If we're talking about a turbocharged engine, obviously there's no comparison for high altitude ops.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Not to hijack the thread, but does anyone know why Cessna made the Skylane panel so tall? The Pathfinder's panel is a good 2" shorter, which makes all the difference for someone like Mary, at 5-foot-nuthin' tall.
Click to expand...

You must be .... This tall .... To ride the ride. ;)
 
denverpilot said:
You must be .... This tall .... To ride the ride. ;)
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They had me in mind when the built the thing! I still have to run the adjustable seat all the way down. I have flown Diamonds, pipers from Cherokee 140s to Cheiftains, and Beechcraft from the skipper to the bonanza, the only thing that fit like a Skylane was the skipper
 
Skylane81E said:
They had me in mind when the built the thing! I still have to run the adjustable seat all the way down. I have flown Diamonds, pipers from Cherokee 140s to Cheiftains, and Beechcraft from the skipper to the bonanza, the only thing that fit like a Skylane was the skipper
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Wow -- you are tall! I'm 6', and could wear a top hat in a Skipper. :D
 
I would consider both a T206 or aT 210 for the money the 210s are probably a better deal the T206s still get all the money great resale value. I would prefer the fixed gear T 206 overall.
 
Jay Honeck said:
Wow -- you are tall! I'm 6', and could wear a top hat in a Skipper. :D
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I'm all torso, I occasionally would bump my head in the skipper.

I would gladly shed 4-6" if I could, maybe then I could fly a 150 and be comfortable in a Bonanza
 
I flew a jillion trips (give or take) between various Colorado airports and KC over 27 years of C-210 and T210 ownership. In fairness, I limited the trips to Denver or COS in the C, simply because we were usually heavy and I didn't want to worry about the rocks. Our loads in the T was usually four adults, full fuel (but usually didn't fill completely for the trip home) bags, golf clubs, fishing gear, bicycles, skis and equipment as dictated by season.

Cruise speed in the T at 60%+ power settings was identical to A-36 at low altitudes but much better if higher. I had full SL turbo available so the useful load, takeoff distance and climb performance were strong from high DA airports.
 
An A36TC, B36TC or an A36 TN with the TAT after market turbo setup makes a great 4-seater. Not enough luggage stowage for 6, but with 4 you would be 10% below gross for the missions you are describing. With the TN, you would burn about the same fuel per hour for 25kts more speed. You will spend a bit extra on things like gear maintenance and the cylinders are not as durable as the lycoming product.

The most economical solution is to buy a used minivan for 10k and get a separate liability only insurance policy on it. Put the neighbors boy on the policy and pay him to drive advance party for the payload limited trips. How much luggage do you need if you go to your parents place anyway ? 3 years from now your kids will be at camp anyway and you"ll kick yourself anytime you have to lug around 5 empty seats on your solo flights.

That said, a T206H with G1000, Flint tanks and TKS is an awfully nice aircraft ;-)
 
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