Whats wrong with sellers!

simtech

simtech

En-Route
Joined
Aug 15, 2012
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3,122
Location
mississippi
Display Name
Simtech
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KGTR
So..Back in June I was purchasing a Cherokee 180, had a signed agreement, insurance ready to bind, deposit and down payment into escrow, registration filled out and submitted to escrow, the seller submitted his stuff to escrow as well. Everything was moving along and we had a closing day set. This plane is out of state and we agreed for the pre buy that the seller would fly it to the mechanic that I chose. The morning of the pre buy I get an email from the seller saying the mag failed and he couldn’t make it and he would have his mechanic take a look at it. So then 2 days later I get a phone call from his mom saying the mechanic found both mags bad and a crack in the exhaust and it was going to cost $4k and her son didn’t have the money to pay for it so they are taking it off the market but will give me first right when its ready. No contract was made for that. But they did pay for all my fees that I incurred.

So I called back and offered to have the pre buy done anyway and if all else is good deduct the cost to fix from the sale price and ill have it fixed. They said no, so I tried a little harder to go on and say that they are still having to pay for hangar and insurance and they will still have to fix the plane at some point so why not take my offer. They still said no and will sit on it until they get the money to fix it. Okay hey you paid all my fees back to me so whatever sit on it and let it ruin. It sounded fishy to me anyway but whatever.

Fast forward to today....I looked up the tail number just out of curiosity and wouldn’t you know it had a new owner from the same city as the seller dated back in mid august!!! So yeah where was my first right...I'll tell you what happened...Nothing broke, he likely got a higher offer than mine and figured it was cheaper to lie and pay me off and sell it to this person. What a crock and I can't believe this person conducted business this way. And to think they own a flight school as well so I can only imagine how they run that. I'm probably better off but man I sure would have liked to have that plane. All time we spent talking and getting things set up and what not.

Now im wondering if I should email him and ask what happened to my first right? I want him to know I know but at the same time why..just let it go. Oh well vent is over.
 
You should just buy a chainsaw and cut the tree up yourself.
 
Move on. Nothing to be accomplished by putting anymore time/thought/effort into it.
 
We feel your pain,not much you can do ,but learn from the experience .
 
I feel for you. I was lucky that I acquired my plane from a friend....But I agree move on, let it go...you will accomplish nothing by making a stink out of it and it will not make you feel any better.
 
This is why I ended up going through a broker.

First plane, the couple acted offended I wanted to see the logs (they didn't know much about airplane ownership. She was the pilot, her husband was the owner (who died) and her current boyfriend was an ass who tried to run show when I arrived to look at the plane.)

They didn't understand my desire for a prebuy, wouldn't fly it anywhere for a prebuy, and the prebuy would have been done by the same people who did the annual.

Imagine my satisifaction when, months later, I see a big "SOLD" sign on it in Trade-a-plane, but for 20% less than I would have paid. lol.

I paid a broker's commission to let him deal with the crazy. Well worth it, imho.
 
Many things can be made fool proof... but there's no accounting for the morons...

Your experience is frustrating for sure. But the benefit from this is you're going about the process in a good way and this situation sorta proved it.

You used Escrow, you were ready with the purchase contract, you had a good set of purchase terms already stated and agreed on, and you didn't give the seller any more money than was appropriate for the stage you were at.

Do give us details on what you're seeking and what your budget is. So if any of us see something on the field or a bulletin board, we can pass on the details.
 
Dude was unethical and got a better offer.

You may have dodged a bullet because there's a decent chance the airplane was misrepresented in the first place.

End of story. Move on.
 
I always call people on it when they **** me over.

Let 'em know you know what a dirtbag they revealed themselves to be.

It does make you feel better.
 
txflyer said:
I always call people on it when they **** me over.

Let 'em know you know what a dirtbag they revealed themselves to be.

It does make you feel better.
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Wow... so what do you do when someone gives you top shelf service and you can't be happier with how well you were treated? :yes: ;)
 
Red flag : the guy had his mother call you, what was he 14?
 
txflyer said:
I always call people on it when they **** me over.

Let 'em know you know what a dirtbag they revealed themselves to be.

It does make you feel better.
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I'm with you there. If people like this never get called-out, they could just continue on with their crap. If people keep calling them out, then it may put a stop to their shenanigans. Although it doesn't necessarily make me feel better, at least it may help someone else.

AggieMike88 said:
Wow... so what do you do when someone gives you top shelf service and you can't be happier with how well you were treated? :yes: ;)
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I let them know. I tip them. I recommend their business. I help them out when they need it. There are many ways to show your gratitude.
 
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simtech said:
So..Back in June I was purchasing a Cherokee 180, had a signed agreement.........Now im wondering if I should email him and ask what happened to my first right? I want him to know I know but at the same time why..just let it go. Oh well vent is over.
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Personally I would email him and his MOTHER and add the link to the FAA database showing the new owner and ask WTF ??????....

It will take ya 1 minute of your time tonight and you will get the final word in on his scumbag tactics....
.

Ps.. You will feel better too...:yes:
 
N801BH said:
Personally I would email him and his MOTHER and add the link to the FAA database showing the new owner and ask WTF ??????....

It will take ya 1 minute of your time tonight and you will get the final word in on his scumbag tactics....
.

Ps.. You will feel better too...:yes:
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I thought about that and I might..But I dont want to be that guy..haha whatever that is..I can let it go and be fine but then again he needs to know I know the real story!
 
I bought a Christen Eagle about 6 months ago. I paid some doctor $75,000 for it and it was a done deal and paid for. When it was time to pick up the airplane the doctor was nowhere to be found. He sent me a email the next day that the plane was no longer for sale and he was refunding my money. He sent a extra $300 for my trouble. What a prick! Me and my son drove from Texas to Tennessee to look at the airplane and make the deal. If it was not for sale he should have not told me to come see it. I hear he is scared of the plane and can't fly it. What a idiot! I guess it is just his little trophy he shows everyone.
On another note, there is a very very nice Cherokee 180 at my airport for around $38,000. Super clean paint, new interior and mid time engine. It belongs to our A&P/IA
 
pigpenracing said:
I bought a Christen Eagle about 6 months ago. I paid some doctor $75,000 for it and it was a done deal and paid for. When it was time to pick up the airplane the doctor was nowhere to be found. He sent me a email the next day that the plane was no longer for sale and he was refunding my money. He sent a extra $300 for my trouble. What a prick! Me and my son drove from Texas to Tennessee to look at the airplane and make the deal. If it was not for sale he should have not told me to come see it. I hear he is scared of the plane and can't fly it. What a idiot! I guess it is just his little trophy he shows everyone.
On another note, there is a very very nice Cherokee 180 at my airport for around $38,000. Super clean paint, new interior and mid time engine. It belongs to our A&P/IA
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Dang for real?! Okay my story aint so bad!

PM sent about the 180.
 
AggieMike88 said:
Wow... so what do you do when someone gives you top shelf service and you can't be happier with how well you were treated? :yes: ;)
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Tip the hell out of 'em.

Money talks and BS walks. ;)

edit in> when I find that one exceptional person, I try to hire them.... :yes:
 
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Luckily, there are a hundred Cherokee 180s on the market at any time. Move on.

It's not just airplanes. I flew to Houston last year to pick up a car I bought from a guy. I had the certified check in my pocket, and a written agreement with him. My daughter was going to drive it home.

The guy never met us at the airport. I called the dirt bag, and he openly and without remorse told me that he had sold the car to someone else. He just laughed.

I could tell you a hundred other horror stories about idiots and azzholes in my business. It's disheartening, but they are EVERYWHERE nowadays. And they vote.
 
I had both those happen to me.

First plane the Seller wouldn't execute one last document, he ended up holding on to the plane another 11 months, taxes, tied owns, interest, and insurance.


Second plane, had an agreement with an old guy, he was losing his medical. I agreed to wait 3 months while he still had his medical,.. He claimed he lost my number, and I was checking in with him every 2 weeks, and sold it to someone else (for $5k more).

Looked at 3-12 more planes, stumbled across a new Barnstormers listing on plane 1, offered same money I did 11 months earlier. Seller had a $3k annual in the meantime, plus insurance, plus interest, etc....

Sellers are funny.
 
At least he refunded your money and expenses. Sometimes that doesn't happen without lawyers.
 
I would bet he got a deal that allowed him to keep access to the plane or someone gave him more money.
 
I know we are banging on sellers here, but buyers ain't much better. ;)
I would at least send an email and call the guy out. :nono:
 
It's a two way street.
Just had a fella offer to buy a 2 acre property with a really nice house from me. It was one of the deals where I had to buy the house to get the farm. I didn't want the house, but ya gotta do what ya gotta do.
I quoted price and he said OK. Then calls back and says it will be Nov 1 before he will have the cash.
I said OK, BUT it is still for sale to the first person with cash.
So he calls back and says he can have the cash in 3 weeks.
I say that is OK BUT it is still, etc. etc.
He came to see me yesterday and said he will have the cash in 10 days.
I said OK, B U T (you fill in the rest)
He texted me this morning that he will have a 20% down payment in my hands Monday, 9AM sharp.
Now I believe him, but if anyone here wants a to buy a really nice country house (cathedral ceilings, granite countertops, stone sink, jacuzzi bath) with an apple and pear orchard and a grape yard, and horse corrals and barn, before Monday 9AM gimme a buzz (p.s. bring money) .:D

The point of this story (true) is that money talks and bs walks. You want me to hold something for you, put money in my hand.
Otherwise it can/may/will be gone before you get back.
 
The point of this story (true) is that money talks and bs walks. You want me to hold something for you, put money in my hand.
Otherwise it can/may/will be gone before you get back.
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I agree with your policy, Denny. But this needs to be made clear from the get-go, which apparently didn't happen with Simtech. I sold a car once to a guy while another guy was out driving it. The second guy had cash in hand and bought it without trying to negotiate me down on the price When the first guy got back and started picking at the car, I just told him don't bother, it was already sold. He was mad at me, but I it felt good to me that I could ignore his picking at everything wrong because it was worth my asking price to someone else in as-is condition. It was already priced cheap.

I think Simtech was not treated right. There is not a lot of honor left around. If he had known at the outset, he might have acted differently.
 
somorris said:
I think Simtech was not treated right. There is not a lot of honor left around. If he had known at the outset, he might have acted differently.
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I don't think he was treated honorably, but in America he was not treated 'wrong'. There is no honor in America when it comes to money, we are a '**** You, I'll get what's best for me' culture. According to our business ethic, he was treated more than fairly by being given his costs back.
 
What's the point of a contract and down payment? I've bought multiple houses and have put earnest money down while due diligence and home inspection takes place. The rest comes at closing. No different..if contract won't or can't be honored then why bother.
 
simtech said:
So the. What's the point of a contract and down payment? I've bought multiple houses and have put earnest money down while due diligence and home inspection takes place. The rest comes at closing. No different..if contract won't or can't be honored then why bother.
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Good question.:dunno: Mostly so lawyers can make money.
 
simtech said:
What's the point of a contract and down payment? I've bought multiple houses and have put earnest money down while due diligence and home inspection takes place. The rest comes at closing. No different..if contract won't or can't be honored then why bother.
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Nothing is final until it is final, unfortunately.

I am selling a piece of property that has progresses from "handshake" to "Letter of Interest" to "Memorandum of Understanding", and, waiting this week for "Purchase Agreement".

It is only final when we get paid, in my opinion.
 
simtech said:
What's the point of a contract and down payment? I've bought multiple houses and have put earnest money down while due diligence and home inspection takes place. The rest comes at closing. No different..if contract won't or can't be honored then why bother.
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You have a legal claim to enforce the contract, unless there were options for the Seller to back out.

Real world it isn't worth your time to pursue someone to force them to sell the plane or waste your time in court.

The end of the day, a "verbal contract" is worth just about the same as a written contract + escrow" if one party intends not to complete their obligations.

( yeah, there are judges and lawyers available, but, in my experience, 99% of those who threaten lawsuits don't follow thru! and, 100% who do follow thru regret the decision to sue.)
 
JoseCuervo said:
You have a legal claim to enforce the contract, unless there were options for the Seller to back out.

Real world it isn't worth your time to pursue someone to force them to sell the plane or waste your time in court.

The end of the day, a "verbal contract" is worth just about the same as a written contract + escrow" if one party intends not to complete their obligations.

( yeah, there are judges and lawyers available, but, in my experience, 99% of those who threaten lawsuits don't follow thru! and, 100% who do follow thru regret the decision to sue.)
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I see..the only obligation they had contractually was to pay all incurred fees in which they did. And yeah as petty as this I would not have wasted my time going after them. Not worth it for sure!
 
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