simtech
En-Route
I saw an ad for a plane and it said the engine sat in a hangar pickled for 10years. What does pickled mean? I'm guessing with some additives in it??
What is pickled?
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Pickled is slang for preserving the engine for long term storage. It usually involves things like fogging the cylinders with oil to prevent corrosion and installing dessicant plugs among other things.
flyingmoose
Pattern Altitude
It depends. TCM has a service bulliten that states how they want their engines preserved for short and long term storage. Eveybody does it differently so it might be worth asking if you are interested in it.
simtech
En-Route
But a sitting engine is still a sitting engine regardless right? I mean you can fog a cylinder but the cam and crank will still sit unprotected..correct?
Ted
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There are a lot of factors in sitting engines, but they do all contain risk of problems from sitting. Lycoming recommends re-pickling of engines, I forget the letter that discusses this. But you should get details on specifics for sure.
Is there something about this plane that makes it particularly attractive to you?
Is there something about this plane that makes it particularly attractive to you?
simtech
En-Route
Nope not at all. I just read it was pickled and was wondering for future use. I don't like sitting engines regardless. Haha
simtech
En-Route
But since we are talking about sitting engines...if a plane did sit for many years...once active again, what is the time back in service that you would expect problems to arise in? I guess what I'm asking is after a sitting plane has flown say 100 hrs..would it be safe to say it will be fine?
SixPapaCharlie
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Ballpark, how long is too long.
Meaning if I dont fly for 3 months, is that bad?
At what point do you just go fly for the sake of the engine.
I fly a ton so probably won't be an issue but I am new to this so would like to now more.
Thanks and sorry if this is considered threadjacking
Meaning if I dont fly for 3 months, is that bad?
At what point do you just go fly for the sake of the engine.
I fly a ton so probably won't be an issue but I am new to this so would like to now more.
Thanks and sorry if this is considered threadjacking
simtech
En-Route
I read somewhere lycoming recommends at minimum 35 hours a years. I recently went and looked at a plane that sat for 6 years but then in the past two years only flew 75 hours. That was enough to scare me off even though according to lycoming it was in the recommended time.
flyingmoose
Pattern Altitude
No. I just helped pickle one the other day for short term storage and it included plugging up the exhaust and case, installing dehydrator plugs in the spark plug holes per TCM.
I have seen elaborate setups with air pumps and desiccant. I have also seen many engines that have sat a long time with no real ill effect. That is why I say it depends. You need more information.
Additives in the oil, I use Cam Guard and Lucas for storage oil. Get the fuel out of the fuel system, (pull it apart and lubricate all the seals, reassemble, that's a good one. Grease pack the front main seal is another.) Spray fogging oil in the crankcase and cylinder, pull the spark plugs and replace them with the plastic desiccant filled plugs.
If you use supplements like Lucas oil additive (I'll use a gallon in either an 8 or 12 qt engine and top to full or a bit high with clean oil) and Cam Guard, you now have a sticky slime that will leave a thin Cosmoline like coating on everything and has an additive package to neutralize the harmful aspects of 100LL leaving everything pretty well protected after a brief lean run up. Then you back that up with fogging spray in the crank case and you have pretty solid protection in there.
poadeleted20
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Nothing is perfect, but engines can be safely stored for years in the manufacturer-recommended long-term storage configuration. You just need to be sure it was done per the manufacturer's instructions.
poadeleted20
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No, it would not. I'd still want a fairly intrusive inspection before being happy.
poadeleted20
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Not sure about Continental, but Lycoming recommends doing the storage routine if the engine will sit more than 30 days unused. There is nothing which provides any other reliable data to say an engine is OK if left longer than that without preservation, i.e., at that point, it's anybody's guess.
I try not to let the plane sit more than 7-10 days unflown, but sometimes that's unavoidable, so I use Exxon Elite oil which has special additives to provide better corrosion protection than other oils if it's left for a couple-three weeks. You could also use another oil plus CamGuard to provide the same protection. I just don't let it sit more than 30 days, period.
timwinters
Ejection Handle Pulled
I seriously doubt that Exxon Elite provides the same protection as CamGuard.
Ted?
To the OP,
"Pickled" is as nebulous as "top overhaul." Ask questions. Lots and lots of questions.
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poadeleted20
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The difference, as determined by independent testing (see Aviation Consumer's article on point), is not significant. Of course, if you ask the guy who after working on Elite at Exxon/Mobil left that company to develop CamGuard and now sells it, he may tell you otherwise.
Agreed, which is why most of us answering this question have suggested that one should not consider the engine properly preserved unless it was done IAW the manufacturer's instructions. Anything else is a crap-shoot.
No, although Exxon Elite and Cam Guard do have a relationship. There was this dude at Exxon, a petrochemical engineer named Ed. The management at Exxon said to Ed, "Make us the most kick ass excellent aviation oil you can make." So much time, effort, and money went into this program and Ed came back and said to the bosses, "Here it is." From there the thinking likely went on at whatever level that this product was going to be more expensive than the competing product, so it would be better to compete on an even playing field and produce the same product as AeroShell Semi Synth, which is crap.
Ed took this knowledge gained, and went on to create Cam Guard.
Ed's recommendation: Any of the straight weight petroleum based oils, or Phillips multi vis, plus Cam Guard if you burn 100LL.
BTW, is the Castrol Aviation Oil on the US market yet?
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Ted
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Flying once every 2 weeks is worthwhile for the engine and pilot. But I've gone 4-6 weeks sometimes and not worried about it.
Aim for every 2 weeks, definitely go once a month.
Aim for every 2 weeks, definitely go once a month.
Zeldman
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Jim
You don't want to know what Lycoming says...
A service letter about the subject:
http://www.wacoaircraft.com/assets/...-Bulletins---Info/LycomingServiceNo.L180B.pdf
Does not apply to us (Socata) but is good info for people with Lycoming engines and Auto Gas STCs:
http://www.lycoming.com/Portals/0/t...orage of Engines That Use Automotive Fuel.pdf