What is happening to us?

[zaitcev]

While this is true for new planes, it is still quite possible to get a REALLY nice used airplane for $70K.

$70k huh. Well, I had to settle for a nice used airplane for $12k.

 

[Henning]

In the last week I've had talked to quite a few people learning to fly. Two of them in particular both wasted about a hour of my time each on the phone answering their questions and they have yet to schedule a intro flight. Both of them asked me how much it would cost to buy a fighter jet and learn to fly it. Sigh.

Get their phone numbers, report their 'suspicious questions' to the FBI.

 

[Henning]

$70k huh. Well, I had to settle for a nice used airplane for $12k.

True, there is a differenence between 'nice' and 'capable' or 'equipped'. You can indeed buy a nice small Day VFR plane for $12k. It won't haul much and it doesn't have glass, but it flies and looks good. Heck, you can buy a nice ultralight in the used market for <$5k.

 

[Henning]

I even get frustrated with the 99s -- the women's pilots group -- a group I am only associated with as a spouse. The group down here in South Texas is nice enough, but do they FLY? Wouldn't you think they might do occasional fly-outs?

We attended their Christmas party, and had a nice time, but it seemed like Mary was the only truly active pilot, which was sad. There were a couple who were current, barely, and several who were "retired" from flying.

Argh. Where are the young women this group purports to support?

They get taken by rich dudes.

 

[Henning]

In my experience, my female peers care less about what I do for a living than males care about what other males do.

I think this is totally backward. I know many female pilots who are married or in relationships and I get the feeling that the ones who aren't, aren't interested.

Right, females only care about what males do for a living.

 

[N801BH]

Not really. The whole 'individual ownership' model for GA is a very limiting one.......

I respectfully disagree...

If ANYONE wants to fly and own a plane, he/she can.. It takes personal conviction, financial self control and ambition... I see ALOT of young people driving 40-50 Grand SUV's.... Some even ***** that aviation in unaffordable...

They could just have easily drove their old SUV a few more years and built a Zenith, RV, Sonex,,,..

If they want it bad enough, they can get there....

Problem is they are the Gimme, Gimme generation that wants to not work for the end result...........

I say.... let them look up at us and dream..... Frigging slackers...

 

[Alexb2000]

People like the idea of being a pilot and owning a plane. Go to some boring ass neighborhood cocktail party and tell everyone you're a pilot. Its a good way to differentiate yourself from every other aging, hush puppy wearing, penny pinching, know it all in the room. Now you may not have flown much in the last 15 or 20 years and your plane my be far past ready to fly condition, but that won't matter to a bunch of people that don't know anything about aviation. They'll bombard you with questions about the Asiana crash, Air France, the miracle on the Hudson, etc. and you will play the exciting adventurer and stone expert. Something a lot of people clearly need in their lives and are willing to pay for as evidenced by the rotting hulks in every shade port.

 

[ClimbnSink]

So what GA needs is to convert these guys into 'inactive' flying club members. They'd get their bragging rights, the planes would fly, and the pilots flying them would be subsidized by the pilots that just want to brag about flying.

People like the idea of being a pilot and owning a plane. Go to some boring ass neighborhood cocktail party and tell everyone you're a pilot. Its a good way to differentiate yourself from every other aging, hush puppy wearing, penny pinching, know it all in the room. Now you may not have flown much in the last 15 or 20 years and your plane my be far past ready to fly condition, but that won't matter to a bunch of people that don't know anything about aviation. They'll bombard you with questions about the Asiana crash, Air France, the miracle on the Hudson, etc. and you will play the exciting adventurer and stone expert. Something a lot of people clearly need in their lives and are willing to pay for as evidenced by the rotting hulks in every shade port.

 

[tree96]

I'm 34. Middle class income. Mortgage,2kids(twins) a wife. I drive a 2000 car with no payment, or ac for that matter, just to be able to afford to fly. I'm in an equity club with 6 other guys. I've been a member going on 3 years now. None of the other guys fly more than 20 hours a year combined. I'm the youngest member by 28 years.

i have no plans to fly for the airlines. Maybe my CFI. The luster has started to wear off of being a pilot, but I started doing Pilots n Paws flights to have a reason to fly. Activity at my airport is way down as well. Lots of starts but hardly any one finishes.

 

[Henning]

I respectfully disagree...

If ANYONE wants to fly and own a plane, he/she can.. It takes personal conviction, financial self control and ambition... I see ALOT of young people driving 40-50 Grand SUV's.... Some even ***** that aviation in unaffordable...

They could just have easily drove their old SUV a few more years and built a Zenith, RV, Sonex,,,..

If they want it bad enough, they can get there....

Problem is they are the Gimme, Gimme generation that wants to not work for the end result...........

I say.... let them look up at us and dream..... Frigging slackers...

You don't get it, it's not just the money, it's the lack of value for the money. You love to fly, so that is enough for you to justify the expense. You are a rarity, that is why GA is as small as it is, it provides very limited value for the money. The greatest single improvement to value for GA would be making traveling 300-700 miles more cost and time effective, and eliminating outstation lay costs and hassles goes a long way to do that.

If you want to grow GA, the trick is to make GA match more people, not to get people to change their ways to match GA.

 

[Jay Honeck]

You don't get it, it's not just the money, it's the lack of value for the money. You love to fly, so that is enough for you to justify the expense. You are a rarity, that is why GA is as small as it is, it provides very limited value for the money. The greatest single improvement to value for GA would be making traveling 300-700 miles more cost and time effective, and eliminating outstation lay costs and hassles goes a long way to do that.

If you want to grow GA, the trick is to make GA match more people, not to get people to change their ways to match GA.

Boy, I don't know how to make it much better.

Example: Flight to Marfa, TX, an inexplicably popular (amongst the glitterati) near ghost town in the middle of effing nowhere.

Distance from Port Aransas: 583 miles, 10 hours driving. Or... 386 nautical miles, 2.4 hours flying.

On our last flight there, I was getting 18.6 mpg in the RV. That's as good or better than my truck.

Climb to 8500', click on Mr. TruTrack, wake me up when we are in the pattern. It simply doesn't get better.

For whatever reason, the aircraft industry never does "first person account" ads. If Cirrus wanted to sell a boatload of airplanes, they would do a commercial showing this exact flight with the wife and kids, vs. driving with kids for ten hours...

 

[ClimbnSink]

Try that in New England assume you have to be at work Monday morning. Other thing are you in it for the travel or the flying? Autopilot use suggests the former. GA doesn't work well in many places as pure travel, yet that is what we sell.

 

[Henning]

Boy, I don't know how to make it much better.

Example: Flight to Marfa, TX, an inexplicably popular (amongst the glitterati) near ghost town in the middle of effing nowhere.

Distance from Port Aransas: 583 miles, 10 hours driving. Or... 386 nautical miles, 2.4 hours flying.

On our last flight there, I was getting 18.6 mpg in the RV. That's as good or better than my truck.

Climb to 8500', click on Mr. TruTrack, wake me up when we are in the pattern. It simply doesn't get better.

For whatever reason, the aircraft industry never does "first person account" ads. If Cirrus wanted to sell a boatload of airplanes, they would do a commercial showing this exact flight with the wife and kids, vs. driving with kids for ten hours...

A flight to Marfa is Not my idea of "Destination Marketing"

 

[Henning]

Try that in New England assume you have to be at work Monday morning. Other thing are you in it for the travel or the flying? Autopilot use suggests the former. GA doesn't work well in many places as pure travel, yet that is what we sell.

However, say you fly from DC to Cape Cod or the Vineyard and weather shuts it all in, if you could just buy a ticket on the ferry and then catch the train home and not have to worry about te plane, it makes taking a plane a much more attractive and viable option.

 

[N801BH]

You don't get it, it's not just the money, it's the lack of value for the money. You love to fly, so that is enough for you to justify the expense. You are a rarity, that is why GA is as small as it is, it provides very limited value for the money. The greatest single improvement to value for GA would be making traveling 300-700 miles more cost and time effective, and eliminating outstation lay costs and hassles goes a long way to do that.

If you want to grow GA, the trick is to make GA match more people, not to get people to change their ways to match GA.

..

I have been called worse..... And by better people too.......

 

[Dav8or]

Problem is they are the Gimme, Gimme generation that wants to not work for the end result...........

I say.... let them look up at us and dream..... Frigging slackers...

What a load of bull crap! This generation is no different than previous generations. Back in the '60s and '70s, when a guy wanted his own airplane, he went down to the Cessna store, or the Piper store, bought one and flew away. Instant gratification. (other than the whole pilot's license thing) Folks back then didn't have to build there own plane if they wanted one. They got what people now want. If this generation is slackers, so are all previous generations.

One shouldn't have to build their own plane to fly in this day and age. We have moved past the era of the Wright Brothers. Part of the issue is, people now don't look at us up in the sky and dream. They look at us and either think to themselves "***hole!", or "Idiot!" or they don't even notice us.

 

[WhiskeyPapa]

It gets worse. We just bought a hangar. It's at a great airport, with a good amount of social activities, and some people even flying regularly.

Mary and I are the young kids. I am 56 years old. WTF?

.

Dang, that Red Board! Maybe circulate a petition to shut them down? You could be 30 again!

 

[Dav8or]

People like the idea of being a pilot and owning a plane. Go to some boring ass neighborhood cocktail party and tell everyone you're a pilot. Its a good way to differentiate yourself from every other aging, hush puppy wearing, penny pinching, know it all in the room. Now you may not have flown much in the last 15 or 20 years and your plane my be far past ready to fly condition, but that won't matter to a bunch of people that don't know anything about aviation. They'll bombard you with questions about the Asiana crash, Air France, the miracle on the Hudson, etc. and you will play the exciting adventurer and stone expert. Something a lot of people clearly need in their lives and are willing to pay for as evidenced by the rotting hulks in every shade port.

This only last for about 15 minutes. After they get the gist of your explanation of the big aviation events in the news, they're done with your technical analysis and go back to talking about Game of Thrones.

 

[Dav8or]

I'm 34. Middle class income. Mortgage,2kids(twins) a wife. I drive a 2000 car with no payment, or ac for that matter, just to be able to afford to fly. I'm in an equity club with 6 other guys. I've been a member going on 3 years now. None of the other guys fly more than 20 hours a year combined. I'm the youngest member by 28 years.

i have no plans to fly for the airlines. Maybe my CFI. The luster has started to wear off of being a pilot, but I started doing Pilots n Paws flights to have a reason to fly. Activity at my airport is way down as well. Lots of starts but hardly any one finishes.

Yep. I have read that a large number of student starts quit after they solo. Basically, once they have experienced flight by themselves and proved that they could take off and land without dying, they are satisfied with the whole pilot intrigue. A lot more of the general public is aware of the limitations and expenses of GA than we pilots want to give them credit for.

Basically, non commercial GA is only for you if-

• You like the solitude of flying by yourself and watching the world go by underneath you.
• You enjoy the personal challenges and adrenaline of acrobatics.
• You have a spouse/partner/family that enjoy travel by small aircraft and are willing to accept the challenges it presents.
• You enjoy building, or restoring airplanes.
• You enjoy group activities with other pilots, such as fly ins, Young Eagle flights, or Pilots and Paws.

If you look at this list and answer, Not really, no way, nope, that's not for me and Gawd no!, then GA is not for you and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

 

[Dav8or]

If you want to grow GA, the trick is to make GA match more people, not to get people to change their ways to match GA.

Agreed. I believe there will be a rebirth of GA and personal flight when there is a technological revolution in GA aircraft. I believe that will happen when electric airplanes become a practical reality.

Electric propulsion combined with BRS and a higher level of digital automation in the cockpit will result in the personal airplane being way easier to fly and a lot more useful. Increased reliability, safety and ease of use will attract more buyers and participants. I believe I will see this happen in my lifetime, but not in the next ten years, or anything like that.

 

[Dav8or]

For whatever reason, the aircraft industry never does "first person account" ads. If Cirrus wanted to sell a boatload of airplanes, they would do a commercial showing this exact flight with the wife and kids, vs. driving with kids for ten hours...

Oh, they have done this. They've done it for decades. The problem is, the ads are countered by the NTSB reports in the news and they are defused by the accounting for the actual costs involved. This is all before they find out about dispatch reliability issues they will learn during PPL training. Then there is the issue of, can the family handle it? Many, many families will opt for the 10 hour car ride vs. the 2.5 hours of terror and discomfort.

 

[VWGhiaBob]

1. Cost
2. Cost
3. Terrible safety record (improving, but still dangerous overall)
4. Younger-generation itis - The younger folks could care less about driving; planes are not even on the radar screen.

Doesn't stop me...it's my favorite thing to do and always will be. But you and I are part of a generation (I'm a few years your senior) that's entering the "geriatric" phase. We want to keep flying. Thank God for AOPA. They also have an outreach to younger folks. But they have their work cut out for them!

 

[JoseCuervo]

What a load of bull crap! This generation is no different than previous generations. Back in the '60s and '70s, when a guy wanted his own airplane, he went down to the Cessna store, or the Piper store, bought one and flew away. Instant gratification. (other than the whole pilot's license thing) Folks back then didn't have to build there own plane if they wanted one. They got what people now want. If this generation is slackers, so are all previous generations.

One shouldn't have to build their own plane to fly in this day and age. We have moved past the era of the Wright Brothers. Part of the issue is, people now don't look at us up in the sky and dream. They look at us and either think to themselves "***hole!", or "Idiot!" or they don't even notice us.

Exactly.

I have no desire NOR time to build a plane. And, building a plane would be the LEAST cheap method of acquiring an airplane.

My time is far more valuable, if I choose to use it wisely, than for hammering rivets or making wiring harnesses.

I pay people to do that kind of stuff.

 

[Henning]

Agreed. I believe there will be a rebirth of GA and personal flight when there is a technological revolution in GA aircraft. I believe that will happen when electric airplanes become a practical reality.

Electric propulsion combined with BRS and a higher level of digital automation in the cockpit will result in the personal airplane being way easier to fly and a lot more useful. Increased reliability, safety and ease of use will attract more buyers and participants. I believe I will see this happen in my lifetime, but not in the next ten years, or anything like that.

I think it will likely be an expansion of the quad copter design.

 

[Jay Honeck]

A flight to Marfa is Not my idea of "Destination Marketing"

While I agree (once was enough, for us) I know people who will wax eloquent for 15 minutes about Marfa.

But whatever your preference (pick Vegas, or Branson -- whatever) there is simply no better way to travel than by air in your personal airplane. The aircraft manufacturers simply don't seem to want to advertise this, for reasons that escape me.

 

[N801BH]

While I agree (once was enough, for us) I know people who will wax eloquent for 15 minutes about Marfa.

But whatever your preference (pick Vegas, or Branson -- whatever) there is simply no better way to travel than by air in your personal airplane. The aircraft manufacturers simply don't seem to want to advertise this, for reasons that escape me.

I agree.....

If Cirrus and all the other manufacturers would simply show the time savings on a "road trip"...... they would hook ALOT of boomers into learning to fly and buy planes...

 

[dans2992]

I agree.....

If Cirrus and all the other manufacturers would simply show the time savings on a "road trip"...... they would hook ALOT of boomers into learning to fly and buy planes...

Yep.. I, the wife, and 5-year old daughter took a week off in October. We left Phoenix after work, flew to ABQ. Got up at 0-dark 30 the next morning and saw the "special shapes" balloons at the Albuquerque balloon festival, had lunch in Kansas, and arrived that evening at a relative's place in middle-of-nowhere southern IL. Spent the weekend there, flew up to Chicago, spent a week there. Flew to Denver, saw some more relatives and then back to PHX. We did all of this in 7 days, on our own schedule. Not to mention it was rainy/cloudy weather most of the route.

Probably would not have been able to keep this schedule traveling commercially. It was a cool use of GA, but even then, I don't fly for the "practicality" of it, but that's a nice side benefit and keeps the spouse on board.

Funny, when we arrived at our relatives' place and met them at the airport, they all said "oh, you have your own plane, that must save you a lot of money vs flying commercial". Yeeeah, not so much....

 

[Dav8or]

I agree.....

If Cirrus and all the other manufacturers would simply show the time savings on a "road trip"...... they would hook ALOT of boomers into learning to fly and buy planes...

I think all the manufacturers have taken this advertising concept at one point or another. I remember when Cirrus first started, their ads were all about the personal airliner and saving time for the businessman.

Then came the crashes.

When people start dying pursuing the personal airline dream, companies start getting sued... big time. I think there have been enough court cases to where these companies now just emphasize performance and capability and let the consumer figure out what to do with it. I personally think it's a good thing. The personal airliner has always been over sold. Does it really have to be advertised?

Is there a person on the planet that doesn't know that airplanes are faster than cars?

 

[dans2992]

Anything with pressurization and FIKI comes pretty darn close to a personal airliner.

 

[txflyer]

I busted a young man's cherry today in the 180. His first flight outside commercial. I'd guess his age about 28.

He and his young bride bought a car of ours I keep at the hangar, and they were gushing over my plane, so I asked if they wanted a ride? The young bride admitted she was scared and didn't want to go, but encouraged her eager hubby to go.

The guy was stoked. As we were flying, he said "I ride motorcycles, but this is a whole other level!" When we got back, his wife asked him if he was scared, and he said " I was right before I got in the plane, but after we got buckled in and got going, it was like floating, ... very fun!"

 

[dresbackg]

I really think the reason you don't see many in the 30 and under set, (heck, 40 and under set, really) at the airport you can find by a quick look at the Wall St. Journal's articles about Generation X, Y, and the millenials, and what's happened to them.

A lot of advertisers and other people have been trying to figure out how to reach them. In a nutshell, the Gen Y and later group got hosed worse than any other group by the terrible job market and the fallout from the economic crash, right when they were supposed to be starting out buying homes, getting a career, family, and more. More of these young people live with their parents, have jobs that have them significantly underemployed, are still in school, or have lost everything (foreclosures, business failures, etc) than at any other time in the last 70 years. A massive number of 20-30 year olds have sort of not been able to launch yet, in many ways, unlike their parents or grandparents, due to the job market, stagnant wage growth, and tight credit.

This isn't just affecting aviation, there's lots of articles and discussions about it. I think aviation will come back somewhat when the economy comes back. Gas prices dropping would be a huge help. Given that the entire pilot population has been aging, fixing the idiotic 3rd class medical would go a long way toward helping too.

 

[overdrive148]

I busted a young man's cherry today in the 180. His first flight outside commercial. I'd guess his age about 28.

He and his young bride bought a car of ours I keep at the hangar, and they were gushing over my plane, so I asked if they wanted a ride? The young bride admitted she was scared and didn't want to go, but encouraged her eager hubby to go.

The guy was stoked. As we were flying, he said "I ride motorcycles, but this is a whole other level!" When we got back, his wife asked him if he was scared, and he said " I was right before I got in the plane, but after we got buckled in and got going, it was like floating, ... very fun!"

Busted his cherry in the 180 sounds like terrible innuendo! But that sounds like an awesome experience - I hope to be able to take people for rides one day!

 

[Henning]

While I agree (once was enough, for us) I know people who will wax eloquent for 15 minutes about Marfa.

But whatever your preference (pick Vegas, or Branson -- whatever) there is simply no better way to travel than by air in your personal airplane. The aircraft manufacturers simply don't seem to want to advertise this, for reasons that escape me.

I agree, not everyone does. Besides, most people will not spend the extra money required on the esoteric value of GA, and of those who will, most already do.

 

[N801BH]

Originally Posted by Jay Honeck
While I agree (once was enough, for us) I know people who will wax eloquent for 15 minutes about Marfa.

But whatever your preference (pick Vegas, or Branson -- whatever) there is simply no better way to travel than by air in your personal airplane. The aircraft manufacturers simply don't seem to want to advertise this, for reasons that escape me.

I agree, not everyone does. Besides, most people will not spend the extra money required on the esoteric value of GA, and of those who will, most already do.

In my opinion...

The best way to perpetuate our addiction to this thing we call aviation is to get as many people exposed to it as possible and hope the fever transfers over to the newbies.... Kinda like drug dealers feed their future clients with free drugs to get them hooked.

I fly alot and I actively look for others to go flying with me. Most people in town know I am a pilot and own a plane.. Fortunately for me, it is a 4 passenger and the conversion usually goes like this,,,

Hey Ben, My kids would love to fly in a plane around the valley in a plane. I say ABSOLUTELY...... I pick a clear, calm and smooth day and set up a meeting at the airport /fbo... It starts with a tour of the hangars with small pistons and really kool biz jets... I use those planes as a teaching tool to explain rudder /flaps /etc etc... You can actually see their eyes light up and the excitement builds..

On the walk to my hangar I purposely take them down the front row of the T hangars so they can see, hear, smell and watch other planes taxiing , landing and taking off.. On a good day it will be a great mix of small planes, all the way up to 757's taking off and landing.. Since I am escorting them I will take them right up the taxiway hold short line... It is damn close to the action and as close as 99% of the general public ever gets to aircraft operations... The excitement is building for them and they are giddy...

With that I say... Ok,,, we can get alot closer so let's go get my plane out of the hangar and taxi out among them.... Hangar door comes up and the smiles get larger for all of them... They help pull the plane out and I slowly do a very thorough pre flight, letting them all help will all the details.. By now they are so excited their fears are non existent .. If the family is larger then two parents and one kid, I let them decide who goes first... Most times the family is two parents and 3-4 kids. I will escort the whole group back to the FBO, which has a great bench to sit on and watch and give that parent my handheld so they listen to the action....

On the walk back to the plane I let them decide who sits where, but I try to suggest the parent sits up front and the kid /kids sit in back... 99% of the time that plays out.. We load up the kids in the back seat, letting them plug in their headphones and fasten their own seatbelts so they feel involved in the flight... Parent gets in the right front seat and I gave the safety speech to them all...

I get in, start the motor, tune into ATIS and call ground control for taxi.. By now they are so overwhelmed with aviation they all are smiling. I let the parent steer with the rudder peddles and since I purposely didn't install brakes on the right side, they really can't screw up to bad.. Now the parent is totally engrossed... I always let the parent fly the plane once in the air and, so far not one has said no... So.. the kids are lovin it in back, they know mommy /daddy is flying the plane and the family is clearly having a blast and bonding in the true aviation sense.... I return to land and really try to grease one on and taxi back to the hangar... Escort that group back, trade off on the handheld and repeat the experience...

I have done this maybe a dozen times here in Jackson.. More then that when I lived in Fla 25 years ago.... Usually I get a call from the parents to do it again, and sometimes they get a baby sitter and they come back together... Those flights will end up for a 100 hamburger somewhere.. They are now officially hooked.... I would estimate 30-40 % go one to get their license......


I am doing my part to share and perpetuate our addiction..... What are you guys /gals doing.......

 

[SoonerAviator]

They're getting close. A decent new boat for the family is $40-50K. The result is sales are going lower and lower. The boating industry has the same discussions as we do. "How can we get costs down??" Limited production just costs a lot of money and people are having less and less money.

I'm not saying boating isn't expensive (it can be as crazy as aviation), but you can pick up a Tahoe runabout from Bass Pro or similar for $25K brand spankin' new. Is it on par with a Chris Craft or Cobalt? Absolutely not. It's like comparing a Piper to a Beechcraft. However, for the price of a decent mid-size car, you can buy a boat that will get you on the water and uses the same engine lineup as the more expensive brands. How can aviation compete with that? You can't hardly buy a $30K USED aircraft that will carry a family of 4 in comfort, but you can buy a brand new boat that will entertain the family all weekend?!

Again, a bit of apples-to-oranges but the result is the same. The cost of aviation has far exceeded most people's ability to afford ownership. The only way Cessna/Piper, et al have responded to the decrease in demand is to increase the price so that they maintain the same margins. They (along with insurance/regulations) have created their own vicious cycle where no one but the extremely well-off are able to buy new certificated aircraft.

 

[asgcpa]

I flew more this past weekend-10.4 hours than the prior three months due to lousy weather in Chicagoland. Had to go to FL for vacation to do so.

 

[Jay Honeck]

I agree, not everyone does. Besides, most people will not spend the extra money required on the esoteric value of GA, and of those who will, most already do.

I completely disagree with that last statement.

GA has become like the religious orders of old, with the monks cloistered away in isolated fields, miles from civilization. Out of sight, out of mind.

As with any religion, GA is going to need good marketing to survive. Since we can't threaten eternal damnation if people don't adhere to our beliefs, we are gonna have to concentrate on the positive aspects of our religion. High speed travel to cool places that are not accessible by airlines is the best aspect of GA, IMHO.

 

[Bill Watson]

I completely disagree with that last statement.

GA has become like the religious orders of old, with the monks cloistered away in isolated fields, miles from civilization. Out of sight, out of mind.

I completely agree with this last statement, unfortunately.

As with any religion, GA is going to need good marketing to survive. Since we can threaten eternal damnation if people don't adhere to our beliefs, we are gonna have to concentrate on the positive aspects of our religion. High speed travel to cool places that are not accessible by airlines is the best aspect of GA, IMHO.

Good marketing could make the difference. However on the commercial side we probably do have some good marketing campaigns that are effectively putting the proverbial doctor in sleek new Cirruses. Problem is that there are few well priced brand new aircraft for the industry to market. The few that may be in reasonable $$ range don't really do high speed travel to cool places.

On the non-commercial side, there's just us and our membership associations. I agree that we should concentrate on the positive aspects of our religion as much as we can but I'm just having too much fun flying out of my back yard to all the cool places I can.

It's funny that despite the fact that our strip backs on to I-85 and that we are 12 minutes from a vibrant downtown, every visitor's first comment is, "I had no idea this was all back here". Yep

 

[Jay Honeck]

It's funny that despite the fact that our strip backs on to I-85 and that we are 12 minutes from a vibrant downtown, every visitor's first comment is, "I had no idea this was all back here". Yep

OMG, if I had a nickel for every time I've heard THAT.

Even in Iowa City! Look at a map of Iowa City, and you can see that the bottom 25% of the map is the airport -- yet I continually heard "Huh? Iowa City has an airport?"

Argh. Marketing ANYTHING in the internet age is just so freaking hard. In the old days, we could run an ad in the local paper and be certain of hitting all of the literate people (really, the only people you wanted to hit) in the market.

Now? Marketing is like peeing in the ocean... 90% of any effort is utterly unseen and wasted.

 

[SoonerAviator]

I think recreational appeal is the primary way to go after GA if you want an increase in pilots. Sell GA by selling aerobatics, seaplanes, and meetups at the airport and places within an hour or two of the home. Sell it by getting golfers to try new courses that they would ignore for a 4-hour drive. Traveling by air to a vacation destination is nice and all, but most people I know don't take more than one or two long distance runs per year and GA doesn't make that too much better from a logistics standpoint.

If you don't sell the "fun" of GA like boating/sports/etc do, it's a lost cause.