What happened to the 182 JT-A's?

JustinD

JustinD

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JustinD
So when Cessna first started the 182 JT-A project it seemed like a cool idea that could have some good integration and uses, I was looking forward to checking it out myself.

Anyway fast forward as we all know they dropped the project, but my question is what happened to all the JT-A 182's that they built? There were pictures of plenty of them made and just on the ramp at Independence waiting on certification. Did they scrap em? Use em for parts? Modify them for the lycoming engine, although I'd imagine that would be quite the adjustment with the changes in the engine mounting, upper and lower cowling, throttle quadrant etc.

Just curious if anyone knew! Or had a good guess
 
I did google and tried finding it quite a bit, but couldn't find an answer...which is why I asked here, so thank you for posting a result that you found that addresses it which I could not

That article is from 2015, does anyone have any info on if this moved forward and whats going on with it? I wouldn't be amused if I purchased a new 182 today and found out it was actually built 3 years ago and was completely modified and altered for an engine swap.
 
Cessna 182 JT-A, does the "A" mean it has an AOA? You know, because this is POA and that's required to be asked, no offense.
 
I'm in Africa right now and flew on a 182Q retrofitted with a Diesel from some company in France. Jet-A burning at 10gph and a monkey could fly it because it's simple and automated with the FADEC.

Engine costs about twice as much to overhaul but when Jet-A is $15 cheaper per gallon in this part of the world, it makes sense.
 
Bonchie said:
I'm in Africa right now and flew on a 182Q retrofitted with a Diesel from some company in France. Jet-A burning at 10gph and a monkey could fly it because it's simple and automated with the FADEC.

Engine costs about twice as much to overhaul but when Jet-A is $15 cheaper per gallon in this part of the world, it makes sense.
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Over the years I have seen a few Cessna conversions that were targeting markets such as missionary work in Africa, where 100LL avgas is very expensive and often difficult to source. Cessna is a volume manufacturer and these are not volume markets. A new diesel 182 from Cessna probably costs more to buy and maintain than a used Caravan...a far more capable platform.

Since the technology driven increase in unconventional oil drilling, which has dramatically increased the supply of light crude oil, and the inevitable collapse in oil prices in 2014 I don't see much incentive for North America to move away from avgas.
 
In new platforms, no.

But I could see conversions making sense even in the US if we had a local provider of the engines (I think they have to ship to France for overhauls from where I'm at).

Saving 4gph and probably an average of around $1 per total gallon burned because JetA is cheaper adds up.

4gph in savings is $30k over a 1500 TBO at $5 a gallon. If you can get JetA for a $1 cheaper per gallon (seems about average), that's another $20k in savings. At that point you are saving money even though the engine can only go to TBO from what they told me (certain parts can not be taken past legally).

But, the initial outlay is twice that of a regular 182 overhaul, I don't know if anyone in the US even does the conversions, and there's no guarantee you reach TBO (although the reliability of the diesel over carbureted says you probably will).

So I agree that it isn't much of an option here.

But for folks who were paying $20 a gallon for 100LL and there was only one airport in the entire region who sold it, diesel conversions are pretty awesome.

This outfit's next move is a 210 that burns mogas though just because it'll save them money on the overhauls while fuel costs stay about the same. Plus they need another 6 seater after selling their 100LL burning Saratoga years ago.
 
Bonchie said:
...So I agree that it isn't much of an option here.

But for folks who were paying $20 a gallon for 100LL and there was only one airport in the entire region who sold it, diesel conversions are pretty awesome.

This outfit's next move is a 210 that burns mogas though just because it'll save them money on the overhauls while fuel costs stay about the same. Plus they need another 6 seater after selling their 100LL burning Saratoga years ago.
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I can't see piston diesel economics working in North America either. Remote locations such as Africa it makes sense. For high fuel tax jurisdictions such as Australia or western Europe perhaps it does too.

Diamond Aire in Montana builds Geronimo conversions from the older version (PA-23 Apache) of my airplane. Last year they built up a very nicely set up Geronimo for a west African government that needed a high endurance coastal surveillance aircraft. Had to put low compression ratio Lycomings in it because it was to be run on mogas as high octane avgas almost impossibly expensive and difficult to maintain a reliable supply there.
 
I think Europe may see some more conversions just because the providers are local and the operational cost savings make even more sense at that point.

I think 100LL is $18 a gallon in Niamey right now but they used to pay $22 a gallon back when they had the Saratoga. Getting those JetA 182s basically saved their operation. But with the 210 having a mogas STC and being easier/cheaper to maintain (they can take the engine way past TBO compared to the diesel with as much as they fly), that'll be a big help to them as well next year.
 
GRG55 said:
I can't see piston diesel economics working in North America either.
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Even with off road diesel?

Just a point to be made... nobody would care if your diesel in your airplane was dyed red...
 
Just to correct myself, that 182 conversion has a TBO of 2000 hours.
 
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