What car?

Greg Bockelman

Greg Bockelman

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Greg Bockelman
I drive 340 miles round trip, 3 times a month. Roughly 1100 miles a month, just to work. Not to mention around town stuff. My truck gets about 15 MPG and my van gets about 22 MPG. I really need to do something different.

Here is my wish list.

I need something that gets close to 40 MPG, if possible. It needs to be comfortable, because I do spend a lot of time in it. It has to have the standard creature comforts.

What fits the bill? What can I get that is comfortable to drive, gets good milage, and can be had on the used market for under $5,000? We are talking used here. I am not buying another new car.

Ideas?
 
Greg Bockelman said:
...

What fits the bill? What can I get that is comfortable to drive, gets good milage, and can be had on the used market for under $5,000? We are talking used here. I am not buying another new car.

Ideas?
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My 97 Sable gets 20+ MPG and is decent enough that I drove it 1000 miles round trip. It just took me a while to get used to my right leg brushing the center console. Look for a ubiquitous Sable/Taurus. You certainly won't have any trouble finding one or getting parts. Mine has nearly 190K well maintained long trip miles on it. I'd go for any that were country driven and you should have nuttin' but those out by you.

Ford 500?

I'd use CarFAX to see where the car has lived.

Lemme know if you see any. I'd be tempted to get another as my next 2 year disposable until I'm financially ready to move up to my Volvo XC90.
 
The hard part is that you want this vehicle to get close to 40 mpg. I think that 30 is more realistic.

My experience with the Sable/Taurus has been pretty negative at best. I've noticed that they tend to have head gasket issues, and is not Ford's best attempt at a car. Maybe if you own the thing new it's a different story.

The Crown Vic/Grand Marquis/Town Car is one of the best kept secrets to me - those things suffer tons of abuse as taxis, cop cars, etc. and still last hundreds of thousands of miles. Expect mid 20s on the highway.

Another well-kept secret would be any of the GM front wheel drive cars with the 3.8L V6. The Buicks are the cheapest to buy, seeing as nobody wants an old man mobile. Yet they still get 30 mpg on regular, and are extremely comfortable. Expect 200-300k out of them. Easy to get one under $5k, I was looking at a 2003 LeSabre all decked out for about $6000 from a dealer.

I probably drive more than you. Between Thanksgiving and New Years I was putting 1000 miles on my truck per week - and I drive a Ford Excursion that gets 13 mpg on the highway. Plus I probably do about 300 miles to week to work and back and around town stuff on average - most of the miles are weekend trips to New York City from PA when I go. For me, I frequently need to carry lots of stuff on trips, plus I need 4x4 to get up my driveway. I did the math every which way I could, and what it comes down to is that even at a $5,000 car, I will not save a dime, in fact I will lose money. With you having a vehicle that gets 22 mpg, you're in an even more exaggerated state than me. What it comes down to is that the fuel savings will not offset the depreciation, insurance, maintenance, and repair costs that you'll incur. If you want to have that happy feeling of "Oh good, I'm saving money at the pump" that's fine, but I don't think you'll actually incur any net savings. Maybe you can convince yourself otherwise, but I haven't convinced myself on any cost savings yet.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
The hard part is that you want this vehicle to get close to 40 mpg. I think that 30 is more realistic.
...
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Yeah. I missed that. 40mpg and comfort don't come in the same vehicle.

I think if you searched for 40MPG you'd be in bare bones stripper econobox territory. Except for the hybrids, which aren't $5000 yet, and I'll bet will not be on the road when they're 10 years old due to needing new batteries.

A Mini Cooper would do it. Again, too new to be $5000 and I see even that gets only 34MPG on the highway.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
I drive 340 miles round trip, 3 times a month. Roughly 1100 miles a month, just to work. Not to mention around town stuff. My truck gets about 15 MPG and my van gets about 22 MPG. I really need to do something different.

Here is my wish list.

I need something that gets close to 40 MPG, if possible. It needs to be comfortable, because I do spend a lot of time in it. It has to have the standard creature comforts.

What fits the bill? What can I get that is comfortable to drive, gets good milage, and can be had on the used market for under $5,000? We are talking used here. I am not buying another new car.

Ideas?
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Find a Diesel VW Golf or Jetta. I used to get around 50mpg with my Diesel Rabbit P/U and 55mpg with a Diesel Scirrocco.
 
Greg,
My manual transmission 1998 Honda Accord gets, around 30-35 mpg on the highway. It's pretty comfortable, and I think that is probably worth right around 5k. A Honda Civic of the same vintage would probably get around 35mpg, and still be pretty comfortable.
 
I have friend who has a VW Jetta TDI with a veggie oil kit, it gets over 40 on oil and over 50 on diesel.
 
my 3.8L V6 Olds Alero gets in the mid to high 20's on the highway. has been a great travelling car for me as I drive all over iowa visiting the parents and my glider. the most common problem I've had with it is the intake manifold gasket goes out, but is a pretty easy fix. 1st one was gone at 35 or 30k miles, but the new and improved version lasted until 115k. Other than an alternator failure and a serpentine belt shelling out, ive never had any real issues. of course, replaced the brakes.
 
My 14 year old Tercel gets that kind of mileage. You could probably pick one up for a song.
 
If you don't mind being seen driving a lunch box, my wife's Prius gets 50 mpg in town, over 40 on the highway, and is very comfortable to drive. It pulls hills better than my Tahoe and has good accelleration. If I were buying for myself I'd consider one.
 
My '95 Saturn SC2 gets about 40, usually a little less.. It's plenty fast and has very good acceleration too. 5 speed manual, it burns gas quite a bit faster after about 60 mph, once you're at around 85-90 its down to maybe 25 mpg (not that I've ever done that of course :) ). Cost me $800, car was a freebie it just needed a new engine. Just needs a little work inside.
 
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Thanks for the responses. The 40 MPG is a wish, not necessarily a hard requirement. We got my son a Chevy Cavalier that gets 35 or so on the highway. It is OK, but a bit light on creature comforts. That is where I am leaning now because I know a guy locally that I can get them for a reasonable price.

The VW's were what I had in mind for the higher mileage, but I don't know how comfortable they are for long periods of time.

Keep the ideas coming.
 
My wife is now driving a 99 VW Passat. V-6, 5-speed, cruise, cloth interior, CD, heated mirrors, power everything. We got it for ~$7500 2 years ago with 106k miles. So far (over 160k), no problems with it other than replaced CV boot ($20 part, $100 labor that I should have done myself) and new tires. It gets 25mpg on the highway at 75-80mph. Drop the speed down to 70mph and you can get close to 30mpg.

It's a fun little car and does well on the snow. The biggest thing for me (and you, too, I know) is that I actually FIT in it! I can actually drive it comfortably without having the all the way to the rear stops.

My mother-in-law has a 99 VW Jetta. 4-cyl, 5-speed. Not sure how much they paid, but I don't like it NEARLY as much as the Passat. It just doesn't ride as well as the Passat, and I don't fit as well in it, either. Of course, if you're considering the Cavalier, then the Jetta probably wouldn't bother you too much.

Just something else to throw into the mix. :)
 
Maybe a Toyota Corolla. They get about 35 mgp. I don't know about older models, but last August, I drove a 2007 Corolla from Georgia to Oregon and found it very comfortable even when driving 8 - 10 hours a day.
 
Hardest part for me to get you is the the $5k or under. Despite what many people will tell you, the best hidden secret is the 2.0 4 cyl. Mazda3 Sedan. I had one for 3 years. Took a trip to Detroit from Grand Rapids . . . round trip I averaged 38.5 mpg on the highway. Why Mazda doesn't market them for the gas-sippers that they are I'll never know (and that is with a father who worked for Mazda for 25+ years as a sales/marketing person).

Don't know about getting one under $5k though. Let us know what you get!
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Thanks for the responses. The 40 MPG is a wish, not necessarily a hard requirement. We got my son a Chevy Cavalier that gets 35 or so on the highway. It is OK, but a bit light on creature comforts. That is where I am leaning now because I know a guy locally that I can get them for a reasonable price.

The VW's were what I had in mind for the higher mileage, but I don't know how comfortable they are for long periods of time.

Keep the ideas coming.
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I had a 83 Jetta that I used to do a 7 1/2 hr commute quite comfortably in, and they have only gotten better since...YMMV, but I think they're pretty good cars.
 
Economical
Comfortable
Inexpensive

Pick any two. However I would caution you to give due attention to crashworthy.
 
CJones said:
My wife is now driving a 99 VW Passat. V-6, 5-speed, cruise, cloth interior, CD, heated mirrors, power everything. We got it for ~$7500
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I had my mom buy a new one of these (with an automatic though) a few years ago, I don't think it's needed anything but tires and brakes. It's been a pretty good car for her. Had my dad buy the Audi A6 Quattro since he had to drive in all weather around the Ft Wayne IN area.
 
Not gonna do new. Done that enough. Can't afford new. Can't afford the nearly 50% first year depreciation on them.
 
Is there any way of finding out what mileage a particular car should get without getting smoke blown at me?
 
I own a 2001 Golf Gti, and I have to say it is quite comfy, and good to drive on longer trips. The only issue is that German cars have poorly designed cupholders (the ones in the golf cover up the radio), But then it's a "driving machine" and not a snack bar :)

Pete
 
Greg Bockelman said:
Is there any way of finding out what mileage a particular car should get without getting smoke blown at me?
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No. Too many variables anyway, the biggest one being the speeds at which you drive, the grades you drive on, and your requirements for accelleration and how far into a red light situation you stay into the throttle. Example, my 800+hp Camaro, I could get anywhere from 4mpg-25mpg depending on how I drove it.
 
Greg,

My first car (1999 -> 2004) was a 1998 Dodge Neon. It wasn't the nicest overall (noisy), but did 36mpg easy - had a few 40mpg tanks when I did 55 and was very, very gentle on the throttle. It was reasonably comfortable for my 6'2" frame, and was surprisingly easy to work on. Might be hard to find a clean one on the used market, but it would be worth it to look around. I put 169k on mine before selling it to my friend's father as a s-box commuter, he still has it - with just a hair under 300k on the clock!

Cheers,

-Andrew
 
vontresc said:
I own a 2001 Golf Gti, and I have to say it is quite comfy, and good to drive on longer trips. The only issue is that German cars have poorly designed cupholders (the ones in the golf cover up the radio), But then it's a "driving machine" and not a snack bar :)

Pete
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When the Mercedes engineers in Germany were told that American buyers were looking very close at the cupholders they couldn't understand it. :goofy: When you're going 120MPH down the Autobahn the last thing you're gonna think about doing is looking down for your cup o' joe.
 
I know nothing about it but the Dogde caliber is supposed to get like 35 mpg.
 
AdamZ said:
I know nothing about it but the Dogde caliber is supposed to get like 35 mpg.
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I rented one of those, even new it was crap and had a louder road noise level than my old Chevy 4x4 with Monster Mudders.
 
Greg:

I come from a long line of cheap car buyers, and I respect your approach. I may never own a new car again.

The $5,000.00 threshold is significantly limiting, especially in the current marketplace for gas-sippers. You may find, however, that careful selection can save you enough on one car to more than make up for a modest difference in gas mileage. Example: you can get stellar mileage from a Prius, but you might have to drive it 300,000 miles to recover the extra purchase cost. Also, hybrids are great city cars, but essentially lose their advantage in mostly-highway use.

For pure efficiency, Henning's right- you cannot beat the VW diesels, and I can vouch for them being excellent road cars. CJane has a Jetta (1 generation back), very nice ride and drive, plenty of room for driver and passenger (back seat, with the likes of you in front, would be tight!).

Most important thing to remember- at the price point you are targeting, all stereotypes of what car is best (i.e., the ubiquitous "you can't lose with a Toyota or a Honda," etc.) are useless. You are looking for a car which can meet your needs, and has been cared-for well. At that price, you are much more likely to find a car with decent life left in it if you focus primarily on domestics.

Do they use salt on the roads where you are? You might need to look in the south, and use a jumpseat to get there.

I have a dealer I use for used-car selection- he is not a stocking dealer, but rather, he gets your specifications, and attends dealer auctions (where most cars change hands between dealers) and buys the cars with a fixed-percentage commission. Works very well if you know what you want.

The suggestion above of a late-90s or newer GM with the 3.8L drivetrain is good advice; they are well-engineered, amazingly efficient and usually cheap to buy. Mileage is better than you'd ever expect, with 30 mpg readily achievable if you drive smoothly and have gas which has not been tainted with ethanol (with ethanol, deduct 20%). Shucks, my Cadillac Deville (2001, 4.6 L V8) gets a solid 27 mpg if I just set the cruise on 78 or so and keep my foot off of the gas. 22 mpg with government-foisted ethanol-contaminated pseudo-gasoline.

Let me shop for some good exemplars...

---

Edit: I agree with Henning's assessment of the Caliber (although it would not fit in the $5k limit anyway); something about the way the CVT works makes it feel as if it's never happy.
 
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SCCutler said:
I come from a long line of cheap car buyers, and I respect your approach. I may never own a new car again.
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I've ridden in Spike's car and will attest that, despite being an attorney, he's telling the truth here. What was that Spike, a Mark III? :p
 
Greg -
I've been in the car business my whole career (25 years). When you settle on a make/model send me a PM and I will get with some of the buyers I know to see what the going auction rate is. If interested I can always get them to make a purchase on your behalf.
 
Why sacrifice comfort and luxury for a tinny little car. Go for a CORVETTE! My '93 gets almost 30 highway. It has comfortable seats which are great on a long drive (I've done 700 miles in a day). Great gas mileage, BOSE sound system, beats most other cars on the road (I got to 120 a couple of times), and enough room to pack for a week (who needs more than a change of skivvies and socks???).
Or you could go with the featured car at the international auto show in Detroit. A MAYBACH Landaulet would certainly get you there in style and comfort. Of course, it works better if you have a driver. It just might be a little out of your price range though.
 
silver-eagle said:
Or you could go with the featured car at the international auto show in Detroit. A MAYBACH Landaulet would certainly get you there in style and comfort. Of course, it works better if you have a driver. It just might be a little out of your price range though.
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Eeeesh, that's ugly, who did the styling? Lame....
 
Hre ya go.... Mercedes 300D. The old ones can be run on straight veg oil without too much trouble, and they are built like a tank.

http://tinyurl.com/3xdcnx

Buddy had 300k miles on his. The engine, and car were in good shape, but he needed new seats as they had worn totally out by that time.

Pete
 
vontresc said:
Hre ya go.... Mercedes 300D. The old ones can be run on straight veg oil without too much trouble, and they are built like a tank.

http://tinyurl.com/3xdcnx

Buddy had 300k miles on his. The engine, and car were in good shape, but he needed new seats as they had worn totally out by that time.

Pete
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Pete, for all the reasons you state above the price on the old MB's are increasing daily. They will in fact run on straight veg oil and last forever.
If you can find one, snatch it!
 
I'll add my two cents... I just finished looking for a car. I wanted 4 doors (as the convertable is a pain with Cassie) with good cargo room. I can borrow a truck but I don't want to have to borrow it just to pick up a few 2x4's. Something with good gas mileage but still a little zip. I MUST have a stick (I've missed driving one) and a sunroof after comming out of a convertable. I ended up with a Pontiac Vibe. The 'listed' gas milage is 34 but in my first fill up it was just over 25 mpg I'm sure it will get a little better as I remember how to drive a stick. I find it comfortable and Shane didn't ahve a problem either and his a big tall guy. Mine was a 2003 with 44K on it and I got it for $10K. I did see some for around $5K but they were all around 100K to 150K miles. And just remember it is a Toyota afterall. (built in the same plant on the same line as the Matrix)

Missa
 
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Anything Mazda, Nissan, or Toyota. My parents and I have owned nothing but those three makes (Lexis and Infinity count) for a long time. They're roomy, comfortable for someone my size, and get some great mileage. They may be a little more expensive up front, but mx costs will be quite low. I had a '91 Nissan Stanza until I got my current '04 Mazda 6. My fiance and I just got her an '01 Toyota Camery. I'd recommend them all.
 
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