WARNING: Sony/BMG Music CDs - DO NOT BUY

woodstock said:
I would love love love LOVE to see the artists involved file suit against Sony.
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I'd love to see a mega bucks monster corporation get hacked into and loose whopping piles of money due to the sony virus then sue sony to smithereens for it. Kind of sick I know, but if you intend to defeat and violate my security without my knowledge, I'm just going to sit back and laugh when someone takes you down. Fair's fair.

Pilawt said:
Who would *trust* a "removal tool" from Sony? Takes more faith than I have to believe there wouldn't be another form of spyware buried in it. Kinda like buying a do-it-yourself explosive de-fusing kit from Al-Qaeda.
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My thoughts exactly. Now excuse me while I go get a sponge and towel to clean the pop off my monitor.:rofl: :rofl:

Do all the security related CD's pop open a window or such telling you something is amiss or do they just start playing like any other CD? I'm just trying to verify for someone I know that has a bunch of recent CD's though I don't know the titles.


Too little, too late, only admits a problem after being caught by someone else by chance. Really bad move torquing off your customer base. Trust is GONE and so am I.

<---- Sony, banned, all products, UFN. But I repeat myself.
 
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Sony has issued an apology and is promising an easier uninstall.

http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/

They should release the video footage of the teary-eyed CEO of this fiasco.

Those four letters will never again appear on a sales reciept issued to me.
 
I won't ban Sony from my list completely. I will ban Sony BMG, but Sony is a huge company and they do make some good stuff. It seems to me that Sony BMG has been the arrogant sub-division in this case.

But I will look at every alternative to Sony from here on out and this incident will weigh against Sony in my future purchasing decisions nonetheless.
 
Greebo said:
I won't ban Sony from my list completely. I will ban Sony BMG, but Sony is a huge company and they do make some good stuff. It seems to me that Sony BMG has been the arrogant sub-division in this case.

But I will look at every alternative to Sony from here on out and this incident will weigh against Sony in my future purchasing decisions nonetheless.
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Perhaps a letter writing campain to Sony would help them see your POV. Its too late to fix the damage, but I'd like to know that they know. I'm working on a letter now.
 
Not a bad idea. Having read their "apology", I find it somewhat lacking. They don't really seem to take much of a concilliatory tone.
 
Greebo said:
I won't ban Sony from my list completely. I will ban Sony BMG, but Sony is a huge company and they do make some good stuff. It seems to me that Sony BMG has been the arrogant sub-division in this case.

But I will look at every alternative to Sony from here on out and this incident will weigh against Sony in my future purchasing decisions nonetheless.
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I've had bad experiences with other things from Sony. I just have surrendered when I wanted the Sony product for other reasons.

If you ever visit a Sony repair center, you'll see the poster on the wall telling you that repairs for any product are at a flat rate of whatever a new one costs x 80%. As in $175 for 19" television.

This kind of arrogance also carries across their product line. Your digital camera, cell phone, PDA, MP3 player use SD cards for storage. Any Sony product uses Sony memory stick. Whassa problem? Why aren't those other things Sony products, anyway?

Sony sold millions of Walkman players after they invented the mini portable music business. Then they bought a music supplier. Can't make anything that handles non-DRM music, can we? Ours is just that works with ATRAC format (which we invented to have DRM and is only used on Sony players) is as good as the i-whatever thing. We can't imagine why nobody buys 'em.

Take a look at the FAQ on the Sony/BMG link above. http://cp.sonybmg.com/xcp/english/faq.html

"We support all compatible music players." Guess which one is missing? Why would we support the one that everybody is carrying now, thanks to the forward looking decision on what we make above?

"Will the CD software create .mp3 files?" No! Not never. Why would you want a format that your computer(s) and cell phone(s) and PDA and Home and car and portable CD Player and DVD player can play? Our format keeps you from copying it. Isn't that great?

BTW, one of the reasons I don't (as yet) own an iPod is that the Apple .AAC format which you get from the iTunes Music store is also closed and only plays on iPods and in ITunes . But at least iPods play and sync with .mp3 files.

"Real Story of the Rogue Rootkit"
http://www.wired.com/news/privacy/0,1848,69601,00.html

First4Internet had actually talked to Symantec and maybe others to make sure the crap wouldn't be messed with.

http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20051113164717817

Just in case you weren't convinced that Norton Anti-virus was worthless.
 
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From today's Boston Globe:
"Sony BMG Music Entertainment has acknowledged a new security problem affecting nearly 6 million of its CDs, and a Princeton University computer expert said yesterday that a patch the company designed to fix the problem may only make things worse."

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Link to full article (free registration required)

-- Pilawt
 
mikea said:
Worser and worser:

USA Today called this Sony thing a virus, which it isn't, but that's not exactly favorable publicity for Sony. Even an undersecretary of the DHS scolded the RIAA, "You own the content but you do not own the computer."
....SNIP...
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How can you say it isn't a virus? It installs on your machine without your permission or knowlege, it disables components of your system, you can't get rid of it. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it's a duck!
 
silver-eagle said:
How can you say it isn't a virus? It installs on your machine without your permission or knowlege, it disables components of your system, you can't get rid of it. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it's a duck!
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A virus attempts to "infect" all computers it can access. For instance, if you have several pc's on a network a virus on one would attack the rest. This is more like a trojan horse, something unwanted that installs when using something wanted.

Either way it should be illegal.
 
lancefisher said:
A virus attempts to "infect" all computers it can access. For instance, if you have several pc's on a network a virus on one would attack the rest. This is more like a trojan horse, something unwanted that installs when using something wanted.

Either way it should be illegal.
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I'm gonna have to disagree with your definition of a virus.

Dictionary.com: A computer program that is designed to replicate itself by copying itself into the other programs stored in a computer. It may be benign or have a negative effect, such as causing a program to operate incorrectly or corrupting a computer's memory.

It copies itself from the Music CD, and causes programs and hardware to operate incorrectly. Sony is a virus distributer.
 
SkyHog said:
I'm gonna have to disagree with your definition of a virus.

Dictionary.com: A computer program that is designed to replicate itself by copying itself into the other programs stored in a computer. It may be benign or have a negative effect, such as causing a program to operate incorrectly or corrupting a computer's memory.

It copies itself from the Music CD, and causes programs and hardware to operate incorrectly. Sony is a virus distributer.
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No, it really isn't. It doesn't install itself - your computer auto-plays the CD, and the autoplay program is the installer. Turning off autoplay on your CD player would stop the install of this program.

Like lance said, a virus REPLICATES - on its own - no intervention required. This is installed with the implicit permission of the computer owner. (Implicit because you put the cd in the drive and the drive's autoplay function is enabled.) What it SHOULD do is require *EXPLICIT* permission - but it should be illegal in the first place for how badly it corrupts the system's intended behavior.

But it isn't a virus - its a trojan, and it makes the computer vulnerable to viruses.
 
Greebo said:
No, it really isn't. It doesn't install itself - your computer auto-plays the CD, and the autoplay program is the installer. Turning off autoplay on your CD player would stop the install of this program.

Like lance said, a virus REPLICATES - on its own - no intervention required. This is installed with the implicit permission of the computer owner. (Implicit because you put the cd in the drive and the drive's autoplay function is enabled.) What it SHOULD do is require *EXPLICIT* permission - but it should be illegal in the first place for how badly it corrupts the system's intended behavior.

But it isn't a virus - its a trojan, and it makes the computer vulnerable to viruses.
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so then if I were to stick a virus inside a calculator program, and distribute it as a really neat calculator program, its not a virus? The calculator program is what intalled it, it didn't install itself.

If thats the case, then there are no virii.
 
SkyHog said:
so then if I were to stick a virus inside a calculator program, and distribute it as a really neat calculator program, its not a virus? The calculator program is what intalled it, it didn't install itself.

If thats the case, then there are no virii.
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I think we can all agree that Sony's copy protection is evil no matter how we lablel it, but a virus would attempt tt replicate and this doesn't.

Your example contains both. The calc comes with a trojan that installs a virus, assuming that the TH payload can replicate.

There are many ways that viruses can use to infect a system. A Trojan is one but they can be used for other purposes (like Sony's).
 
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lancefisher said:
I think we can all agree that Sony's copy protection is evil no matter how we lablel it, but a virus would attempt tt replicate and this doesn't.

Your example contains both. The calc comes with a trojan that installs a virus, assuming that the TH payload can replicate.

There are many ways that viruses can use to infect a system. A Trojan is one but they can be used for other purposes (like Sony's).
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OK. I was always under the impression that a trojan was a virus.
 
SkyHog said:
OK. I was always under the impression that a trojan was a virus.
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A trojan is a trojan horse just like in mythology. It lets the sneaky troops in to open the impenetrable locked gate from the inside without the enemy knowing they've been had. At that point, the troops (viruses) can come in easily through the open gate without resistance and start wacking the locals while they sleep quietly in their beds.

One just opens the gate so the other can move in and do it's thing. Just because it's not open active hostilities doesn't change the fact that it's despicable behavior.

From what I've gathered on the subject so far: Sony's little present is just the sneaky troops unlocking your computers security gate from the inside under the guise of being your friend in such a way that any despicable scum who wants to wander through your computer for whatever seedy intentions can do so.


The All Seeing All Knowing Supreme Being Dictator Judge guarding this computer has officially made his ruling : Guilty as charged off with their heads.
 
Virii, true virii, are programs which contain built in logic to replicate themselves. Crude virii use simple exploits such as scripting vulnerabilities in older versions of microsoft outlook to redistribute themselves. Subtler variations actually modify the executable code contained in program files, inserting themselves inside the file so as to be brought to life the next time the file is executed.

There are, unsurprisingly, very few really dangerous viruses out there, because generally computers are programmed well enough to protect themselves from untrusted sources. Thats one reason why the Sony program is so dangerous. Not only did it masquerade as a safe source (a music CD), it opened vulnerabilities which made it much easier for deliberate malware to take advantage of, while masquing itself from detection.
 
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