Waiver Release Form

My lawyer told me that in today's litigious society and liberal nanny state courts, a waiver isn't worth the price of the paper it's printed on.
 
If someone smells money, they will sue, especially when some lawyer talks them into it. And that waiver isn't going to stop them, nor is it going to protect you. I'd rather not even take the chance, so I don't give rides to people I don't know and completely trust. Even then, I'm probably still taking a chance.
 
Shepherd said:
My lawyer told me that in today's litigious society and liberal nanny state courts, a waiver isn't worth the price of the paper it's printed on.
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Blame the judges in your state.
 
Imagine handing friend about to take a ride with you a waiver to sign. How fast will that person get out of the plane again? I'd say faster than the ink dries.
 
In most states these "waivers" aren't worth the paper they're printed on.
 
paflyer said:
I'd sure like a cite. That's very interesting.
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Here's one holding that a wrongful death claim is barred by an executed release:

"In light of the language set forth in the release and indemnity agreement here, we find that the release Larry executed barred Anita's wrongful death claims for negligence against USAC. While this court is sympathetic to the Smiths' plight which has flowed from these tragic circumstances, we must conclude that the trial court erred in denying USAC's motion for summary judgment as to Anita's wrongful death claim for USAC's alleged negligent conduct." United States Auto Club v. Smith, 717 N.E.2d 919, 924, (Ind. Ct. App. 1999)(Pre-race waiver of liability barred wrongful death claim.)

I haven't found one specific to the loss of consortium. There are cases saying that a post-injury release signed by the injured spouse does not bar the loss of the wife, but there is a clear distinction to be made once the loss has occurred. Pre-injury, the claim is inchoate (or "incomplete"), whereas once the loss occurs, the claim has vested in the non-injured spouse. But for a pre-loss waiver executed by the injured, spouse, I see no reason why our court's would not enforce it, just as they find that the exclusivity of workers comp is a bar to a loss of consortium claim, just like it is a bar to the injured spouse's claim.
 
Your niece, being a new lawyer, should do some research as to the extent such a waiver would actually protect you.
You can't waive gross negligence, and a person can not waive someone else's (surviving relative for example) right to sue.
 
paflyer said:
BigBadLou said:
I wonder whether giving a waiver to the passengers and asking all their family members to sign would fix the glitch?
Serious question.
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I guess if you have to go though all that, do you really want that person on your plane? And there's no guarantee that you're going to get all possible litigants to agree.
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Agreed.
Yes, it would be harder, yes, it is not bulletproof.
Do I want that person on my plane? A friend who loves flying? Sure. But I cannot predict how greedy his wife or other relatives might be.

Which is why my cubicle walls are covered with pictures of rescue pups I've flown instead of humans. Cuz people are prime a-holes, dogs are awesome. *shrug*
 
flyingron said:
Your niece, being a new lawyer, should do some research as to the extent such a waiver would actually protect you.
You can't waive gross negligence, and a person can not waive someone else's (surviving relative for example) right to sue.
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No you can't waive other's rights, but what I am to understand is that with the exception of "negligence" by having one you can limit them or get the whole thing dismissed with a properly worded waiver... She did say there has been cases in CA where having the waiver has protected the defendants..
 
Ventucky Red said:
I also sail high performance catamarans.... she said I should have one for this too as this and flying is considered "risky behavior."
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So is inviting someone to your home, if they trip on the stairs and injure themselves. :(

You might also jeopardize the ability to enforce a waiver if you do not inform whomever you invite, or anyone who asks to go flying in your plane, if you do not tell them up front at that time that signing a waiver is a condition. Handing it to them just before they get in the airplane after they have arrived at the airport expecting to go flying, and without prior knowledge, can potentially compromise it.

Finding ways to invalidate waivers is blood sport for lawyers. Often the same ones that recommend you have them in the first place.
 
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Sundancer said:
I have an umbrella policy for everything else - we have a small measure of liability insurance for passengers in our club plane; it's not much; then again, I rarely, rarely, take a pax along, and that's usually a CFI or family.
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Umbrella is no protection for aviation events, probably all of them have aviation exclusions.
 
Basically, the waiver just makes people think twice before suing, may filter out a few people who are not really serious about suing, or may stop a lawsuit because an honest person (they do exist) realizes he did agree to not sue.

But it's not going to stop all lawsuits.
 
paflyer said:
Umbrella is no protection for aviation events, probably all of them have aviation exclusions.
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My umbrella policy specifically covers aviation events, as long as it is personal flying as opposed to some business venture. That is with a large insurer on a policy through my employer, so it might be different than yours.
 
aggie06 said:
My umbrella policy specifically covers aviation events, as long as it is personal flying as opposed to some business venture. That is with a large insurer on a policy through my employer, so it might be different than yours.
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May be, never heard of an umbrella that covers aviation of any kind. Who's the carrier?
 
paflyer said:
Umbrella is no protection for aviation events, probably all of them have aviation exclusions.
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Hence the "everything else" comment, and the explanation about our club liability insurance, and not hauling pax. . .
 
paflyer said:
May be, never heard of an umbrella that covers aviation of any kind. Who's the carrier?
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It's one of the big insurance companies (top 10). It is written similar to a group term life policy in that it covers all employees of a certain level, and that would include something like 4000 people.
 
All ready for that internship at a big firm. She'll stop saying silly stuff like that after six months of making another lawyer lots of money as they shovel piles of paper and reality her direction.
 
Clip4 said:
Really?

http://www.prindlelaw.com/A&P/WAIVERS - STATE BY STATE.PDF
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Consider the source--a law firm trying to convince you that these things are of value and you need one so they can sell it to you. In the sorts of cases cited:

A) The waiver largely didn't stop people from suing
and
B) The plaintiff lost because they failed to establish clear negligence on behalf of the defendant--not because the plaintiff had signed a 'waiver.'

The law has an element of considering that "$&@!-happens" and thus if you participate in a dangerous activity (e.g. skiing) and get hurt it's not automatically the fault of the person providing that service (e.g. the ski resort). However where actual clear negligence takes place then all bets are off.

E.g. You're just a bad skier and fell getting off the chairlift and hurt your wrist, vs the ski lift injured people after a malfunction and records show a required inspection that likely would have caught the fault didn't take place.
 
aggie06 said:
It's one of the big insurance companies (top 10). It is written similar to a group term life policy in that it covers all employees of a certain level, and that would include something like 4000 people.
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Then it's probably a group coverage. Individual umbrellas don't cover aviation (why the hell is everyone so afraid of self-flown airplanes?)
 
Ventucky Red said:
I actually brought this up... that is a waiver is only a piece of paper... She said that you can put a in clause stating "I waive any and all claims that I, my estate, heirs, executors, etc... may have now or in the future...
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get it written up, show it to the first timers, I am pretty sure you wont need it... don't think a whole lot of first timers will sign that and get on a small airplane
 
paflyer said:
Holy cow, did she pass with all "Cs" ? You can't waive the rights of someone else, no matter what your "contract" says.
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I have personally signed waivers that said me or my family / estate will not hold them liable if something hits the fan... I have no idea whether its binding or not, but that's the only way they would let me jump off Stratosphere
 
WannFly said:
I have personally signed waivers that said me or my family / estate will not hold them liable if something hits the fan... I have no idea whether its binding or not, but that's the only way they would let me jump off Stratosphere
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Hey is that the new bird?
 
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