Vortex Gen.

[dogman]

I am thinking of putting Micro VG's on my 172. Just wondering if any of you have experience with them.

I have been doing a lot of off field landing in the 172. It sure is a blast to land off field in a friends bean field.Have been working on my Short and soft work, I do not see any reason for a STOL kit for the $$$ but the MVJ's might be worth the money.
Just looking for little more control close to stall. They also claim to give better control for IMC approach flying??

Thank you for reading

Dogman

 

[tonycondon]

just be careful when the beans start to get bushy. and by be careful i mean "don't land there"

 

[CJones]

One of the AirTractors that I used to work with had VGs on it and the other didn't. We had two pilots and both of them each had time in both of the planes. One pilot claimed the plane with VGs did better when heavily loaded on a hot day. The other claimed they didn't make any difference at all.

The pilot that said he liked the VGs said it helped in slow near-stall turns and helped get off the ground a little better when loaded. The pilot that didn't like them was a grumpy old guy, so maybe he said he didn't like them just because the 'young' guy said he DID like them.

 

[CJones]

just be careful when the beans start to get bushy. and by be careful i mean "don't land there"

Tony, you will be glad to know that I have noticed a lot more 'field rollers' hooked up to tractors this spring. After planting beans, the farmers take the large roller and roll over the field. It's weird - for YEARS all Ag people have talked about reducing compaction in the fields, and now they are using large rollers to pack things down. Go figure.

 

[gismo]

One of the AirTractors that I used to work with had VGs on it and the other didn't. We had two pilots and both of them each had time in both of the planes. One pilot claimed the plane with VGs did better when heavily loaded on a hot day. The other claimed they didn't make any difference at all.

The pilot that said he liked the VGs said it helped in slow near-stall turns and helped get off the ground a little better when loaded. The pilot that didn't like them was a grumpy old guy, so maybe he said he didn't like them just because the 'young' guy said he DID like them.

I have VG's on my Baron and the most pronounced effect is the improved control feel at low speed. The reduction in stall speed if any is almost inconsequential (The IAS is lower at the stall but it appears that most of that reduction is the result of the cosine error of the Pitot at the higher AoA allowed by the VGs). The other benefit for me is the significant reduction in Vmc but that shouldn't be a factor on a 172.

 

[Trapper John]

I am thinking of putting Micro VG's on my 172. Just wondering if any of you have experience with them.

I have been doing a lot of off field landing in the 172. It sure is a blast to land off field in a friends bean field.Have been working on my Short and soft work, I do not see any reason for a STOL kit for the $$$ but the MVJ's might be worth the money.
Just looking for little more control close to stall. They also claim to give better control for IMC approach flying??

Thank you for reading

Dogman

I guess value is in the eyes of the beholder, but $1,450 plus labor and paint to reduce stall speed maybe 3 kt?

http://www.microaero.com/CS_PDF/Cessna/172-CS.pdf

The thing I never seem to see with light aircraft mods are any kind of independent test results - maybe I'm just a skeptic...


Trapper John

 

[dogman]

Yep I stay out of the crops this time of this year!! NOTHING MORE ANGRY THAN A FARMER AND DAMAGED CROPS. Now it is fresh cut hay fields, mine and others.

I guess the better aileron and rudder control at slow speeds may be worth it. $1450 would be one of the cheapest improvements I have done to this plane.

I may try them. I will paint and install myself with the guidence of my A/P -
IA. I will let you know If it was worth it. Probably be a good afternoon Dog days of summer project.

Thanks for the responses.

Jon

 

[TangoWhiskey]

The thing I never seem to see with light aircraft mods are any kind of independent test results - maybe I'm just a skeptic...

NASA says they work well. And every other report I've read indicates the same.

http://ims.ivv.nasa.gov/centers/langley/news/factsheets/Micro-VG_prt.htm

The wind tunnel tests showed that Micro VGs dramatically enhanced performance on aircraft resulting in a 10% increase in lift, 50% decrease in drag, and a 100% increase in lift-to-drag ratio. These positive aerodynamic effects should also lead to improved landing performance and reduced approach noise.

 

[gismo]

Yep I stay out of the crops this time of this year!! NOTHING MORE ANGRY THAN A FARMER AND DAMAGED CROPS. Now it is fresh cut hay fields, mine and others.

I guess the better aileron and rudder control at slow speeds may be worth it. $1450 would be one of the cheapest improvements I have done to this plane.

I may try them. I will paint and install myself with the guidence of my A/P -
IA. I will let you know If it was worth it. Probably be a good afternoon Dog days of summer project.

Thanks for the responses.

Jon

Did I mention that VG's make cleaning bugs off the leading edges and washing the airplane a bit more difficult and/or pain inducing?

 

[Trapper John]

NASA says they work well. And every other report I've read indicates the same.

http://ims.ivv.nasa.gov/centers/langley/news/factsheets/Micro-VG_prt.htm

Although in the case you quote, the VGs are on flaps on an airliner wing, and they retract with the flaps - not really an applet-to-apples comparison with what we're talking about here.

Again, call me skeptical, but if the VGs are really the bee's knees, why doesn't Cessna factory install them on the 172/182/206? I can think of two possible answers, either they don't really do that much, or perhaps Cessna has a case of "not invented here".


Trapper John

 

[d.grimm]

Check out the thread on www.BackCountryPilot.org. Seems like Horton Stol kit is the berries on a Cessna.
Dave

 

[wsuffa]

I have VGs on my Commander. It's one of the investments that I consider "well worth it".

As Lance notes, it improves low-speed handling, with a slight increase in stall speed (bailed me out down low one day on a go-round, but that's another story). On the Commander, it improved rudder control. I've noticed little or no difference in climb as a result of the VGs (my plane is more temperature-limited in a long climb than anything else).

I would do the VGs again, without question.

That said, the Cessna is likely to be different. I flew a Cessna for a while that had the Horton STOL kit and was relatively pleased with the performance.

 

[wabower]

FWIW, all the wings on the original light Cessna fleet (except some 177's IIRC) are essentially the same. The 180 guys who routinely fly into places I wouldn't go on a ATV have pretty much concluded the added stuff isn't all that wonderful, and that Cessna did a pretty dang good job of getting it right when they built the airplane. YMMV.

PS: Ditto no published results other than marketing claims. AYPK, the STC holders are only required to prove the addition of their products does not significantly detract from from published performance.

I am thinking of putting Micro VG's on my 172. Just wondering if any of you have experience with them.

I have been doing a lot of off field landing in the 172. It sure is a blast to land off field in a friends bean field.Have been working on my Short and soft work, I do not see any reason for a STOL kit for the $$$ but the MVJ's might be worth the money.
Just looking for little more control close to stall. They also claim to give better control for IMC approach flying??

Thank you for reading

Dogman

 

[cessna182b]

I am thinking of putting Micro VG's on my 172. Just wondering if any of you have experience with them.

I have been doing a lot of off field landing in the 172. It sure is a blast to land off field in a friends bean field.Have been working on my Short and soft work, I do not see any reason for a STOL kit for the $$$ but the MVJ's might be worth the money.
Just looking for little more control close to stall. They also claim to give better control for IMC approach flying??

Thank you for reading

Dogman

I ran into a guy with VGs on a Cessna 150 at the gas pumps recently. I asked him what he thought of them, and he said that they didn't do much for that plane - and were not worth the money. YMMV...

Dave

 

[Fultsp1]

As an A&P, I bought the VG kit and added them to my baron. It made a huge difference. Could not ask for a better investment, especially since I live in a fly-in community where are strip is 2,800 feet of grass.