Variation on the "lost comm" question

[TangoWhiskey]

We always talk about enroute loss of communications.

Here's a variant: It's a low-ifr day (300-500' ceilings). You're inside the marker on the ILS when approach control tells you to contact tower. You switch over to tower, report inbound on the approach... and... no answer.

What would you do next?

I'm not hunting for a specific legal answer, just curious what you'd REALLY do, what strategy you'd employ. If you continued and broke out above minimums, and the runway was clear, would you continue? What if there was no "light" from the tower? Would you go missed and head back up into the crud?

 

[Dave Krall CFII]

Flip back to APP control and tell them to contact tower for you & relay com because they didn't respond to you.

We always talk about enroute loss of communications.

Here's a variant: It's a low-ifr day (300-500' ceilings). You're inside the marker on the ILS when approach control tells you to contact tower. You switch over to tower, report inbound on the approach... and... no answer.

What would you do next?

I'm not hunting for a specific legal answer, just curious what you'd REALLY do, what strategy you'd employ. If you continued and broke out above minimums, and the runway was clear, would you continue? What if there was no "light" from the tower? Would you go missed and head back up into the crud?

 

[TangoWhiskey]

Flip back to APP control and tell them to contact tower for you & relay com because they didn't respond to you.

That was my first thought, too, Dave. Let's say you flip back, and it really IS a radio problem.... approach doesn't answer. Now what?

 

[Fast n' Furious]

I continue. They know I'm coming. Anything else wouldn't be too cool at this point.

 

[Dave Krall CFII]

I continue. They know I'm coming. Anything else wouldn't be too cool at this point.

I've heard that tower is monitoring APP and like you allude,
what else is better, legalities not withstanding ?

 

[Henning]

That was my first thought, too, Dave. Let's say you flip back, and it really IS a radio problem.... approach doesn't answer. Now what?

Flip 7600 transmit blind and complete the approach. They expect you to land since you are already sequenced in and cleared for the approach. Do what they expect. If you break off with no coms and no EFC, it will cause a mess. If you have to go missed, fly the whole missed and shoot the entire approach proceedure again after one full holding circuit.

 

[MauleSkinner]

When it happened to me Monday night, it was a problem on Tower's end...I called Ground, and they cleared me to land

Fly safe!

David

 

[TangoWhiskey]

When it happened to me Monday night, it was a problem on Tower's end...I called Ground, and they cleared me to land

Fly safe!

David

Wow, Dave! (I promise, I didn't talk to him before I posted the question).

I agree--if the runway was clear, I'd transmit in the blind and land--that's what they expect me to do.

Good answers, everyone.

 

[Richard]

My first inclination was to go missed, take a lap in the hold and make the app. But to continue the app to a landing seems the reasonable thing now that I've read the other responses. Sort it out on the ground.

 

[gismo]

I continue. They know I'm coming. Anything else wouldn't be too cool at this point.

Absolutely. The sooner you are on the ground the less problems you will create. In addition, this even complies with the FAR for lost comm (continue on your last clearance). If I had another pilot along I might have him attempt communication alternatives like squawking 7600, listening on VOR's etc, but my focus would be on a successful approach and landing.

I wouldn't go below the minimus on the approach though, and if that meant going missed I would follow the published procedure or instructions given if they were different than the published ones. From there I would try to re-establish comm and failing that, proceed to a suitable alternate or better yet neaby VMC.

 

[AirBaker]

We always talk about enroute loss of communications.

Here's a variant: It's a low-ifr day (300-500' ceilings). You're inside the marker on the ILS...

Yikes, that can happen fast. Legal or not, I'm thinking I'd continue and land. I don't want to be lost comm up in the soup with a reasonable chance of breaking out with those mins on an ILS.

7600, switch back to APP, all what was said earlier... But I'd fly that plane first and argue my point later.

 

[Bones]

My opinion....Do not go missed unless you have to miss b/c of WX or aircraft on RWY. Review your appch plate...some appchs have lost comm procedures.

If you're by yourself, fly the appch, then 7600 and IDENT, then try another freq, perhaps 121.5 or appch. But I would concentrate on flying the appch. You stated that the WX was LOW....I would not want to be chasing needles inside the marker and flipping freqs and trying to get a hold of someone. Flight Safety teaches..er...pounds it into our head that inside the marker you should be fully configured and if you get full scale deflection...you go missed....you need to be flying and watching needles and doing memory items...and looking for the ground.

Go take a look, continue, fly the plane and miss only for WX and aircraft on RWY...of course it all depends on where you are going to and what the WX is doing...many many variables. Fly the plane, fly the plane, fly the plane.

Oh BTW...TWR does know you are coming b/c Appch has called them on the shout line and told them you are coming over...and like someone said...calling GRND is also a great try.

 

[poadeleted20]

My opinion....Do not go missed unless you have to miss b/c of WX or aircraft on RWY.

If you are truly comm-out (not just tower's radios failed but yours remaining good) and there's a plane on the runway, I'd circle to another runway or even land on the parallel taxiway or an empty parking ramp rather than go back up into the goo without the ability to communicate with the ground -- 91.3(b) applies.

 

[Bones]

Yes...I was considering the planes I'm flying...kinda tricky to just clean up a bit and start a circle to another rwy in a 750. It could be done but I don't think I'd like to try it at circling mins. let alone below circling mins. He said low IFR so I was assuming 200 1/2 or less. But sure if you have time and vis and space circle.

 

[Bones]

91.3 b is fine but at that point if I have a load of folks I would consider an emergency if I had to go around.

 

[SCCutler]

If you are truly comm-out (not just tower's radios failed but yours remaining good) and there's a plane on the runway, I'd circle to another runway or even land on the parallel taxiway or an empty parking ramp rather than go back up into the goo without the ability to communicate with the ground -- 91.3(b) applies.

In addition (perhaps implied but never noted above), if you have a complete comm failure, there is a very high likelihood that you'll be losing your NAV capability almost immediately.

Finish the approach, land, savor the moment and your exceptional judgment and airmanship.

 

[waldo]

Good questions like this never cease to amaze me. Keep 'em comming