Upgrade time, let's make an amphib?

James331

James331

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James331
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Hey guys, thought I'd get some input on this.

Currently I have a very VFR Stinson 108-1 on wheels, great plane, own her free and clear, low times etc. I bought her when I got my PPL and built hours for my CPL, after which plane I couldn't bring myself to sell her.

Fast forward 6 years, I'm a ATP, I have a good flying job that affords me a very good chunk of time off, living up north by the Canadian boarder.

Currently I have 1500 tailwheel and shy of 4000tt, about 75 floats.

What I think I would like to do is get a older C185 on amphibs, looking at my mission and what I truly enjoy about flying, floats are where it's at, and being able to cruise at 120+ kts vs 90, and still haul my girl and camping supplies, and be able to go IFR, that's all I could ask for.

NEEDS.
Low time airframe: sub 3000
Low time engine: under 800 SMOH
IFR, capable of shooting a ILS and LPV, preferably garmin, steam is cool, but don't want to have it pay for a avionics upgrade

Wants
Would like newer wiplines or glass amphibs
Would like a IO550
Bubble windows or observer doors
Older model 185
Pretty paint and interior are always nice
Tundras or penetration skis would be a sweet bonus

Budget: 175k

I've found some nice 185s, most everything I want but newer models and with 520s, and on Edo amphibs

Also found a perfect 185 on just wheels, everything I want for the most part.... Seen some wiplines 3450s for sale with C206 rigging, wonder how much of a pain it would be to put that together?

Thoughts? Ideas? Comments?


Thanks,
James
 
Why not put the Stinson on floats? I got a ride in a 185 on floats with the 550 kit and a reasonable steam panel and he had $300k in it, it was in excellent condition. However, another consideration is a 182 on floats and get the extra cabin width. Put the 260hp conversion on it and I think you can still stay in budget. I wish the Katmai was already STC'd on floats, but I can't think of why it would fail.
 
Henning said:
Why not put the Stinson on floats? I got a ride in a 185 on floats with the 550 kit and a reasonable steam panel and he had $300k in it, it was in excellent condition. However, another consideration is a 182 on floats and get the extra cabin width. Put the 260hp conversion on it and I think you can still stay in budget. I wish the Katmai was already STC'd on floats, but I can't think of why it would fail.
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As much as I love my Stinson, shes 150hp and it wouldn't enough umph for the water, also you know how avionics upgrades start adding up.

Seems like my price range isn't too far off, here one contender, I'm just not a fan of the little 520 vs a IO550, nor the Edos
 
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James331 said:
As much as I love my Stinson, shes 150hp and it wouldn't enough umph for the water, also you know how avionics upgrades start adding up.

Seems like my price range isn't too far off, here one contender, I'm just not a fan of the little 520 vs a IO550, nor the Edos

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/detail/aircraft/Single+Engine+Piston/1978/Cessna/185F/1763060.html
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I personally wouldn't buy a 185, the narrow cabin for the extra money just doesn't do it for me. I'd rather have a 470 to a 520 or 550 any day, much nicer engine, much lower cost of operation, 260hp is more than plenty for the airframe to make it an excellent performer but 300 is available in a 182 as well I believe. (Would love the CD-330, it would jump off the water.) For a personal float plane I would have a 182 over a 185 any day. The next choice would be a 206.
 
Henning said:
I personally wouldn't buy a 185, the narrow cabin for the extra money just doesn't do it for me. I'd rather have a 470 to a 520 or 550 any day, much nicer engine, much lower cost of operation, 260hp is more than plenty for the airframe to make it an excellent performer but 300 is available in a 182 as well I believe. (Would love the CD-330, it would jump off the water.) For a personal float plane I would have a 182 over a 185 any day. The next choice would be a 206.
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I hear ya, and ideally I'd like a 550 up front. As for the 182/206, I fly a trike for work, but even though it'll rarely be on straight wheels I wouldn't own anything but a taildragger, just a personal thing :)
 
James331 said:
I hear ya, and ideally I'd like a 550 up front. As for the 182/206, I fly a trike for work, but even though it'll rarely be on straight wheels I wouldn't own anything but a taildragger, just a personal thing :)
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You'll never take it off floats, you have the Stinson of a TD. While a 185 may look cool and have all that mystique to it, it's a freaking tiny cabin.
 
Do you need a 185 or want one cause it is the cool n groovy float plane?
 
put me in the stinson camp. Put it on floats and an O-360 up front. Keep it light and simple.
 
ClimbnSink said:
Do you need a 185 or want one cause it is the cool n groovy float plane?
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Well I don't really NEED a 185, don't really need a airplane ether, but that's not the point :D

The reason I wanted to go the 185 route is it checks all the boxes that I need to swallow that type of purchase.

I want a amphib that will cruse 120kts, full IFR, I can load a bunch of stuff up in the back, strap a canoe on the side and go explore the zillion lakes we have around here. Needs to be certified so I could make money with her should I decide one day to, also a 185 is a desired plane and not hard to offload should I ever choose.

The tailwheel thing, well I learned how to fly in a tailwheel and I don't see myself ever owning a trike, just not my thing, some folks like sushi some don't, same with tailwheel.

Also if one day I decide I want to put some skis on, which up here is not out of the realm of possibility, I have that option, and if down the road my mission changes to more cross countries I can put the wheels back on and pick up a nice cruise speed.

To make my Stinson into a super Stinson that would perform out of these small lakes, that's a 470 swap, prop, rudder bungee kit, bigger fuel lines, float attachments, probably a recover job while I'm hacking that deep into her, add a 430, HSI, autopilot etc.

I would be near the price tag of a 185 amphib anyways. Plus getting involved in a project which isn't good for me, I end up going nuts and upgrading every little thing, having it take way longer and cost more.

170s and 180s are nice but they are not ideal candidates for a high performance float plane.

So if anyone has any tips on the 185 front that would be great

Or any good guys / brokers for the sale of my 108 that would rock too
 
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185s are expensive, from what I can gather the most desirable feature in a recreational float plane is being able to afford to wreck the thing.
 
Anyone have any experience on a 520 vs 550?

I've only flown behind a IO550, but understand they basically are the same engine.
 
Art VanDelay said:
Have you checked into insurance yet ?
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Yep, I'd only be insuring full boat for the first 6mo anyways.


Ron, yeah it's a 520 with bigger jugs right


So what's with all the hate for the 185s on here?
 
No hate from me, they are just really expensive toys. For those numbers I'd buy a lakefront cabin and a Searey have change left over.
 
With the real estate market you'd be safer in a 185 :wink2:

Heck if I got a similar 182 on floats with a hopped up engine and Garmin 430W, autopilot etc, it wouldn't be that much cheaper.

Folks on this board spend about the same on diamonds, cirrus, small twins, IMO a 185 IFR amphib is much more plane that I will get much more use out of.

120kts on 12ish a hr, shoot a ILS or LPV coupled, enough load for anything or anyone I want to bring, land on airports or lakes and rivers, heck to be that's a deal.
 
Well I gotta agree with that, way more fun then the diamond, cirrus, etc stuff.
 
Ignoring the IO-550 part, what about a Maule? Sure, its an IO-540, but seems to fit exactly what you want.
 
A Maule is great, I've toured the factory when I lived in GA, sweet planes, and great folks.

Only reasons I don't buy Maule for less,
I want more real-estate
I'd like to not have Fabric on my next plane. Though I haven't had any issues with my Stinson, and fabric is easy to repair amongst other things.
I'd rather have a metal plane this time, also the 185 is a little faster with better load carrying, climb rate (3 blade 300hp) and cowl flaps for cooling management. Also the 185 seems to be a better IFR platform.

Having the option to be able work the plane is important to me, the 185 is just a better work plane compared to even a M7.
 
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James331 said:
With the real estate market you'd be safer in a 185 :wink2:

Heck if I got a similar 182 on floats with a hopped up engine and Garmin 430W, autopilot etc, it wouldn't be that much cheaper.

Folks on this board spend about the same on diamonds, cirrus, small twins, IMO a 185 IFR amphib is much more plane that I will get much more use out of.

120kts on 12ish a hr, shoot a ILS or LPV coupled, enough load for anything or anyone I want to bring, land on airports or lakes and rivers, heck to be that's a deal.
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But you would have a much more comfortable cabin. A 185 cabin never grew from the original 18x dimensions so you have a 172 width cabin. I don't hate the 185, I just don't think it's a very practical plane from a use perspective. For what you want the plane for, the 182 makes more sense to start with because of the cabin.
 
Will a 182 match the payload and performance and speed (if back on wheels) of a 300hp 185?

If I pull the seats out of the back of a 185 I have a mini pickup, I don't recall the 182 having the same space in the back, width yeah, I always thought the 182 felt like a wider 172 size wise.
 
If you are going big bore Cessna on floats why not a 206? Yeah it is a trike on wheels, don't put it on wheels. Problem solved. I really have no idea but guessing the 185/206 purchase/operation split is close. When close go bigger.
 
ClimbnSink said:
If you are going big bore Cessna on floats why not a 206? Yeah it is a trike on wheels, don't put it on wheels. Problem solved. I really have no idea but guessing the 185/206 purchase/operation split is close. When close go bigger.
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The 206 would be my choice as well. For what a seaplane does, you can't have enough volume, and a 206 beats a 185 by what has to be double.
 
That's a better comparison, the 206, especially the U206 is a better person hauler for sure, but it won't get in and out, or work the back country like a 185, less options for gear choices outside of the floats.

I've got a metric ton of U206 time, IO550 with extensions, great plane no doubt, but its in a slightly different arena as the 185.

Besides I really don't want a trike, for work they are cool, but for "me time" with me, my girl and stuff in the back, or one extra friend the 185 should prove a monster, besides I'd like a taildragger, and the performance is better in the 185 anyways.


So any other draw backs going with a IO520 vs IO550?
 
James331 said:
That's a better comparison, the 206, especially the U206 is a better person hauler for sure, but it won't get in and out, or work the back country like a 185, less options for gear choices outside of the floats.

I've got a metric ton of U206 time, IO550 with extensions, great plane no doubt, but its in a slightly different arena as the 185.

Besides I really don't want a trike, for work they are cool, but for "me time" with me, my girl and stuff in the back, or one extra friend the 185 should prove a monster, besides I'd like a taildragger, and the performance is better in the 185 anyways.


So any other draw backs going with a IO520 vs IO550?
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Well then a 185 for you it is. How about a Helio Courier though? Talk about serious performance and style points.
 
Henning said:
Well then a 185 for you it is. How about a Helio Courier though? Talk about serious performance and style points.
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Indeed, that's something that would be AWSOME.

Just try finding a amphib with a nice avionics stack, support might also be a issue, but I'd totally entertain that. Probably by the time I found one with a 430 HSI, stec, amphibs I'd be retirement age :D Wonder how much mx those slatted wings and geared engine would use though.

Always wanted to fly a helio.
 
You need this:

656bffdc1aafcfc23f81fa0ad2c5a599.jpg
 
Whiskey Tango Foxtrot
 

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