Updating with old stuff - am I crazy?

kep5niner

Pre-takeoff checklist
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Pete
Gents,

I've got my 310 going into annual, and while it's there I'm having some avionics work done. I'm going with the Trig TT31 for ADS-B compliance. Not the GTX345 / GTN750 / GTN650 barrage I dreamed of, but reality got in the way. Here is my currently installed avionics for the rest of this discussion:

NAVOMATIC 400 2-Axis Autopilot
GPS-400W WAAS IFR-Approach GPS / Moving Map
Bendix King KI-525A Horizontal Situation Indicator
JPI EDM-760 Multi-Channel Engine Monitor/Analyzer
TransCal SSD-120 Digital Altitude Encoder Module
KX-165 NAV/COM Transceiver
KMA-24 Audio Panel & Marker Beacon Receiver
KY-196A COMM Transceiver with 9 Memory Slots
KN-53 Navigation Receiver with flip flop
KN-62A Distance Measuring Equipment (DME) Receiver
KRA-87 Aerial Direction Finding (ADF) Receiver
KI-227 Aerial Direction Finding (ADF) Indicator
KT-76 Mode C 250-Watt Transponder
PS-Engineering PM1000 II Four-Channel intercom Intercom

While they're working on the panel, I'm removing the ADF and DME. Here's picture of the stack:


upload_2019-2-24_8-51-48.png

The existing transponder is located below the co-pilot's yoke. While the Trig TT31 is a slide-in replacement for the KT-76, I'm contemplating moving it.

With just the DME being removed from the center stack, that doesn't leave enough room to get the Trig in there.

Option 1: The ADF being removed is below the pilot's yoke, which I could make work for the Trig 31.

Option 2: Removing the KY196A and the KN53, and replacing it with a used KX165. Reselling the KY196A and the KN53 will about be a wash with the purchase of the used KX165. That would leave me with room to put the Trig in the center stack.

What are the thoughts on this plan? The second KX165 would give me the redundant NAV and COM. Am I crazy? This will get me a few more years until I bite the bullet and throw $50k at the panel to get it into the 21st century. Thanks for the responses.
 

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I think you’ll be unhappy with the trig. Without the push button interface it’s a pain to punch in a squawk code. You’d be much happier with an Avidyne AXP340 (trig TT31 with a user friendly interface), a Stratus ES or a used GTX330ES. The Avidyne is a drop in for the main connector on the KT76, and it has a separate connector for the GPS input from the 400W. You would need to replace the tray, but if you’re moving it anyway, that’s a non-issue.
 
Out of curiosity, why do you feel it necessary to have 2 Nav radios AND a WAAS GPS? I’d keep the KY and can the KN and DME and ADF. That would leave very little wiring to change and make room for the transponder at the bottom of the stack.
 
Out of curiosity, why do you feel it necessary to have 2 Nav radios AND a WAAS GPS? I’d keep the KY and can the KN and DME and ADF. That would leave very little wiring to change and make room for the transponder at the bottom of the stack.
Two navs make it easy to pinpoint your position with near-GPS accuracy, should that unit fail. I always liked doing exactly that (but I've flown with two VORs tuned in, the GPS and Loran [RIP] going, and a paper chart ... on VFR flights.)
 
Two navs make it easy to pinpoint your position with near-GPS accuracy, should that unit fail. I always liked doing exactly that (but I've flown with two VORs tuned in, the GPS and Loran [RIP] going, and a paper chart ... on VFR flights.)

Should GPS fail I would rather have one nav and a dme than two navs.
 
Two navs make it easy to pinpoint your position with near-GPS accuracy, should that unit fail. I always liked doing exactly that (but I've flown with two VORs tuned in, the GPS and Loran [RIP] going, and a paper chart ... on VFR flights.)

Bingo.
 
I'd do a GNC255 before I put in a KX165 at this point. Costs a bit more, but it's a modern digital radio that will have a LONG service life. You put in a used KX165 now, it could bite the dust next week (or the screen could quit).
 
I'd look for two SL-30's. You'll have space for the TXP and DME below them.
 
you could move your KN53 to one of the empty slots created by the kt76 or adf removal as it's probably the least used item in your stack. You've got a nice, functional panel.
 
you could move your KN53 to one of the empty slots created by the kt76 or adf removal as it's probably the least used item in your stack. You've got a nice, functional panel.

I do like that idea - could be the most cost-effective at this time. I like the looks of the Avidyne APX340 as well. Not sure if the shop I’ll have it at works with Avidyne. Great input guys, I do appreciate it!
 
I do like that idea - could be the most cost-effective at this time. I like the looks of the Avidyne APX340 as well. Not sure if the shop I’ll have it at works with Avidyne. Great input guys, I do appreciate it!

You can also look at KT-74, it’s also a slide-in replacement for your existing transponder. Based on the same Trig but much better looking and with friendly interface.

I have had one in my Bonanza, feeding off my 430W, for a few years now and it’s been working great.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
I do like that idea - could be the most cost-effective at this time. I like the looks of the Avidyne APX340 as well. Not sure if the shop I’ll have it at works with Avidyne. Great input guys, I do appreciate it!

Is that a GNS 400 or 400W on the top of your stack? If it's not a W, you'll have fewer options since you need a WAAS GPS input to the ADS-B. The Avidyne AXP340 does not have one as far as I can tell from their site.

Are you looking to *eventually* get ADS-B in and out? If so, you may want to consider just going for a GTX 345 or NGT-9000 right away, rather than buy something now only to ditch it in a few years. If you think you'll go with Garmin on your next upgrade, get the GTX, if you think you will avoid Garmin, go for the NGT. Or, if you really want to stay cheap this time, and you only fly within the ConUS and below 18,000, get a UAvionix Skybeacon or a Garmin GDL82 - They're 978/UAT only but are cheap.

Finally, if you want dual band (978 and 1090) and you don't have WAAS, Garmin is running a nice deal on the GTX 335 with built-in WAAS right now.

Space-wise, you may want to just upgrade one of your radios to whatever you want your #2 to be next time too. Probably the most modern one out there right now is the Garmin GNC255.

I concur with those who say to watch out for the old King gear, as you may spend $$ getting it installed and have it crap out next week. If you do go to another KX, make sure to have someone overhaul it. We kept one of ours, and the component guy at our shop replaced all the electrolytic capacitors, did some work on the flip-flop buttons, etc. so it should last us a while. He did say that basically ALL of the KX series radios he sees have some of their caps leaking now, which eventually eats through the traces on the boards and makes them worthless.

EDIT: I see you have WAAS. In that case, the AXP340 will work... I would still offer the caveat that if you're planning on Garmin hardware for your next upgrade, I would suggest going right for the GTX345 now... But having the WAAS already will save you an AMU there too.
 
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