Two planes down in Fla

frfly172

frfly172

Touchdown! Greaser!
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ron keating
Two plane crashes last night in fla. A 182 near Daytona,and a liberty xl2 at Merritt island. The liberty suffered an engine failure according to witnesses. Two people aboard both aircraft ,all fatal.
 
A story I read about the Daytona crash indicated engine failure after takeoff and a turn back attempt.
 
frfly172 said:
Two plane crashes last night in fla. A 182 near Daytona,and a liberty xl2 at Merritt island. The liberty suffered an engine failure according to witnesses. Two people aboard both aircraft ,all fatal.
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One of my technician's significant other is a Daytona cop. She was late because he was called to the scene and he had the car till early morning. I'll probably be talking to him later. But I also read that they had engine trouble after take off (~9:30pm) and tried to turn around to go back. You'd thing the instructor would have known better. Of course, he was there and I wasn't.
edit: The flight school "Phoenix Aviation" has a pretty good reputation. I don't think we can blame them.
 
The "urge" to turn back is always very strong, almost to the point of being an instinctive reaction. It is easily ten times more so at night when you can't discern where suitable spots might be. Think about it.
 
Accident site being on the Clyde Morris Blvd would suggest 07L/R was in use. Plenty of roads and spots for an emergency landing in that way from KDAB, most of them well lit during night. Sad :(
 
A very sad series of events. This hits a bit close to home for me because I live and fly in Central Florida and have flown into and out of KDAB before.
 
Cant think what might have happened with a brand new 172, anyone have any ideas?
 
Ryanb said:
Cant think what might have happened with a brand new 172, anyone have any ideas?
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I, unfortunately, have quite a bit of time in Daytona. Phoenix East might have meant well, but trained some of the worst pilots I've ever seen. All of them foreigners. It's the typical young, inexperienced CFI school who is just there to build time to get into the regionals.

I'm almost certain poor operating procedures lead to the engine failure.

There is nowhere to land straight ahead when departing to the east. Nowhere. Well, maybe the graveyard just off the departure end, but that's bad form.

It sucks, but with the volume of GA traffic, it's bound to happen.
 
Ryanb said:
What type of procedures would have lead to that new engine failing?
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New engines have been known to fail. Poor operating procedures could simply mean overlooking the signs of an impending failure.
 
Cpt_Kirk said:
I, unfortunately, have quite a bit of time in Daytona. Phoenix East might have meant well, but trained some of the worst pilots I've ever seen. All of them foreigners. It's the typical young, inexperienced CFI school who is just there to build time to get into the regionals.

I'm almost certain poor operating procedures lead to the engine failure.

There is nowhere to land straight ahead when departing to the east. Nowhere. Well, maybe the graveyard just off the departure end, but that's bad form.

It sucks, but with the volume of GA traffic, it's bound to happen.
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Understand something, while you obviously dislike "foreigners" you are trying to stereotype all of them into one group (worst pilots) which is not always the case. I currently work with a young man who by your definition is a foreigner and he attended Phoenix East. He's probably one of the most articulate and professional pilots I have the pleasure to fly with and is very dedicated.

Also, as a trained Aircraft Accident Investigator I don't speculate to the cause of an accident until I see facts. You have no way of knowing at this point if it was "poor operating procedures" that precluded this accident.
 
RotorAndWing said:
Understand something, while you obviously dislike "foreigners" you are trying to stereotype all of them into one group (worst pilots) which is not always the case. I currently work with a young man who by your definition is a foreigner and he attended Phoenix East. He's probably one of the most articulate and professional pilots I have the pleasure to fly with and is very dedicated.

Also, as a trained Aircraft Accident Investigator I don't speculate to the cause of an accident until I see facts. You have no way of knowing at this point if it was "poor operating procedures" that precluded this accident.
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I don't dislike foreigners. I dislike PE in DAB.

You don't speculate until you see facts because that's your job.
 
When I taught at Burnside Ott in the late 70's/early 80's, a large number of the students were foreign, many from the Middle East.

Most did a fine job.

As they struggled with sometimes rapid-fire tower instructions, I would often ponder how well I would have done if I had had to learn a new language concomitant with learning to fly.

More power to them.
 
I saw a picture of the instructor in the paper this morning and I realized that I have seen her almost every month at the FAA Safety "Wings" meeting. She was one of the regulars and she participated by asking and answering questions. Even though I never spoke to her I could tell that she was very safety conscious. Very sad.
 
RotorAndWing said:
Also, as a trained Aircraft Accident Investigator I don't speculate to the cause of an accident until I see facts. You have no way of knowing at this point if it was "poor operating procedures" that precluded this accident.
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How do you train to be an Aircraft Accident Investigator? It sounds interesting.
 
bluee said:
How do you train to be an Aircraft Accident Investigator? It sounds interesting.
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Generally speaking, you get hired by the FAA, NTSB or an insurance company and they send you to school, although the NTSB will occasionally open up some of their courses to the public. You can also take accident investigation courses through some of the aviation colleges like Embry-Riddle
 
bluee said:
How do you train to be an Aircraft Accident Investigator? It sounds interesting.
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Fearless Tower said:
Generally speaking, you get hired by the FAA, NTSB or an insurance company and they send you to school, although the NTSB will occasionally open up some of their courses to the public. You can also take accident investigation courses through some of the aviation colleges like Embry-Riddle
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Correct. The courses I attended at the TSI were only open to the FAA, NTSB and military.
 
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