True crime enthusiasts - the Scott Peterson case (and a hobby of mine)

Do you think Scott Peterson is guilty?

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The water in that area is cold, I’m sure the decomposition is much slower than that of warmer water. And the FETUS had mostly separated from her body, wasn’t it tangled in the clothing? So her body was pretty badly decomposed if the fetus was freed from her womb.
 
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Lindberg said:
Are you questioning Mark Geragos's competence as a defense attorney or something else? He certainly wasn't some green public defender without resources.
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He certainly has a solid reputation no doubt. I'm curious why he didn't hammer the assertion that the body had been floating in the bay for four months. I certainly would have. In the end, I don't think it would have mattered. Maybe he knew that. He probably did. Scott Peterson was convicted well before he ever set foot in that courtroom.
MooneyDriver78 said:
The water in that area is cold, I’m sure the decomposition is much slower than that of warmer water. And the FETUS had mostly separated from her body, wasn’t it tangled in the clothing? So her body was pretty badly decomposed if the fetus was freed from her womb.
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It's cold yes but not that cold. They say bad decomp after four months. I expect zero flesh after a week.

I mean convince me otherwise. There is a reason I posted this topic here on POA. Maybe I am wrong. I'm hearing reasons why I might be. I'm looking for that.
 
Sac Arrow said:
I'm curious why he didn't hammer the assertion that the body had been floating in the bay for four months. I certainly would have. In the end, I don't think it would have mattered.
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Have you read the trial transcripts? I haven't, so I don't know what he hammered or why, but I'm confident he had a better idea of the prosecution's weaknesses than I do.
Sac Arrow said:
I mean convince me otherwise.
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How? Already several of your premises have been shown false and it hasn't changed your conclusion.
 
Sac Arrow said:
He certainly has a solid reputation no doubt. I'm curious why he didn't hammer the assertion that the body had been floating in the bay for four months. I certainly would have. In the end, I don't think it would have mattered. Maybe he knew that. He probably did. Scott Peterson was convicted well before he ever set foot in that courtroom.

It's cold yes but not that cold. They say bad decomp after four months. I expect zero flesh after a week.

I mean convince me otherwise. There is a reason I posted this topic here on POA. Maybe I am wrong. I'm hearing reasons why I might be. I'm looking for that.
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The body wasn’t floating, he had home made 5 anchors, 4 were missing, obvious conclusion is they were used to hold down the body which was most likely wrapped in blankets, rugs and/or plastic because he didn’t carry her body around in the open. This would prevent the body being eaten, combined with the cold salt water.
A quick check shows it takes 3-12 months to end up with skeletal remains, and 2-3 months before any significant soft tissue decomposition occurs.
And this can be severely reduced if the body was wrapped.
I’m sure the prosecution would love that defense to try to challenge this . Imagine describing the grisly nature of decomposing bodies, I doubt that would help their defense.
 
Oh, just so you’re aware, you can’t make up own facts which you seem to be doing and ignoring others.
I hope you’re not on my jury, I have jury duty in a few weeks and I wonder if we’ll have TV CSI sleuths in the jury pool.
I remember CSI LV they said you’re protected from lightning in a vehicle because of the rubber tires insulated the car from the ground!? Yeah, lightning can travel 1000’ from the clouds to the car, but can’t jump the 6” from the chassis to the ground.
 
Here’s a medical paper describing human body decomposition in various water conditions. It’s written by, I think, a medical examiner. He mentions how being tied down or weighted down can affect things.

WARNING: I stopped reading when I realized there were photos.

Decomposition Changes in Bodies Recovered from Water - PMC

Recovering bodies from water is a common task for any medical examiner or coroner office. Unfortunately, there will be a significant postmortem interval before many of these remains are found. A thorough scene investigation must be undertaken to ...
pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
 
Matthew said:
Here’s a medical paper describing human body decomposition in various water conditions. It’s written by, I think, a medical examiner. He mentions how being tied down or weighted down can affect things.

WARNING: I stopped reading when I realized there were photos.

Decomposition Changes in Bodies Recovered from Water - PMC

Recovering bodies from water is a common task for any medical examiner or coroner office. Unfortunately, there will be a significant postmortem interval before many of these remains are found. A thorough scene investigation must be undertaken to ...
pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
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I didn’t start reading when I realized it was a paper about human body decomposition
 
Sac Arrow said:
…decomp after four months. I expect zero flesh after a week.

I mean convince me otherwise. There is a reason I posted this topic here on POA. Maybe I am wrong. I'm hearing reasons why I might be. I'm looking for that.
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Go buy a pig carcass, weight it and dispose of it in the same place at the same alleged time and see what happens after four months.
 
Racerx said:
Much like the Steven Avery Teresa Halbach case, shows like this aren't exactly on a fact finding mission. We get one very biased side with no rebuttal.
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This is a great point. Like a lot of us stuck at home during COVID, I watched the Making a Murderer show and Tiger King. I'll admit, I believed a lot of it at first. They share facts, not if they don't support their version of events. If they don't like you, at best they make you look inept, at worst they make you look like a criminal.

The police in the Steven Avery case made a lot of mistakes. Some of them most likely tampered with evidence. There was a history of this department botching investigations, including the first arrest of Steven for the rape he didn't commit. However... the abundance of the evidence shows he committed the murder. There's a good reason he's still in prison.

A documentary usually has one goal. Make as much money and get as many views as possible.
 
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tomex939 said:
The thing about the body being intact for 4 months in the bay always sounded off to me too. But the prosecution had to explain that somehow. The jury probably just skipped past the science part because the whole 'guy cheated on his pregnant wife' thing was too much. Once you hate him, the logic stops mattering. That's the sad reality of these big trials.
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What actual report said the body was "intact" after four months? Her body was missing limbs, missing internal organs, missing a fetus, etc., etc. What exactly do you mean by "intact?"
 
Lindberg said:
Already several of your premises have been shown false and it hasn't changed your conclusion.
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AI summary of political conspiracy theories:

"A "self-sealing conspiracy" refers to a belief system or theory that is designed to be immune to disproof, where evidence against the theory is reinterpreted as proof of its validity, effectively "sealing" it against rational challenge by using circular reasoning and defense mechanisms like claiming evidence is planted or the theory is too vast for outsiders to grasp. This self-insulating quality makes conspiracy theories incredibly resilient, turning logical refutations into confirmation for believers, who often rely on pre-existing biases or psychological needs (control, belonging) rather than objective facts."
 
tomex939 said:
The thing about the body being intact for 4 months in the bay always sounded off to me too.
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If I told you the body wasn't intact for 4 months, would it change your position on whether the jury applied logic to the facts and didn't skip the science part?
 
I know if I’m in the pool for even 20 minutes I look like a shriveled white prune, I can’t imagine hanging out in the deep end for four months
 
eman1200 said:
I know if I’m in the pool for even 20 minutes I look like a shriveled white prune, I can’t imagine hanging out in the deep end for four months
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But if you go swimming in a garbage bag what happens
 
Semantics, without context of the actual details, a “torso” could range from a fully fleshed dismembered body or a 99% skeletonized pelvis, spine, and some attached ribs. Either and everything in between could be correctly identified as a human torso
 
It’s been a long time since I was up on all the details of this case.
Peterson had the motive, the opportunity, and all sorts of ludicrous holes in his alibi.
He didn’t have to prove his innocence, but he and his lawyer tried to do so, and failed miserably.

Laci disappeared 12/24. Scott Peterson drove 90 miles each way to “fish” at Berkeley marina that same day. Christmas Eve. In a boat he’d purchased that month, *after* starting his relationship with Amber Frey. Anchors missing as mentioned above
Yet we’re to believe a stranger killed lacy, drove 90 miles to dump the body in the same place where Scott Peterson was fishing? And left no traces of forced entry, a struggle, etc?

peterson was arrested in SD county, w/$10k in cash, with his brother ‘s ID, camping gear, after having bleached his hair
He claimed that Lacy was unperturbed by his relationship with his gf, amber frey- despite Laci’s pregnancy. Does that seem likely?

No one piece of the circumstantial evidence proves he did it. In aggregate? Absolutely.
 
Lowflynjack said:
This is a great point. Like a lot of us stuck at home during COVID, I watched the Making a Murderer show and Tiger King. I'll admit, I believed a lot of it at first. They share facts, not if they don't support their version of events. If they don't like you, at best they make you look inept, at worst they make you look like a criminal.

The police in the Steven Avery case made a lot of mistakes. Some of them most likely tampered with evidence. There was a history of this department botching investigations, including the first arrest of Steven for the rape he didn't commit. However... the abundance of the evidence shows he committed the murder. There's a good reason he's still in prison.

A documentary usually has one goal. Make as much money and get as many views as possible.
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But also, the documentary can introduce things as factual when in fact it was entirely made up. And the audience is none the wiser because we weren't privy to what or how evidence was presented.

Like and subscribe.
 
Racerx said:
But if you go swimming in a garbage bag what happens
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They had swim in garbage bags during my last ditching course. Surprising how much it can help you preserve body heat. Unfortunately, Laci was well past that point.
 
There was a documentary about another case involving a guy named Michael Peterson who was convicted of murdering his wife. The documentary was very convincing from his side of the story, that her death was some type of terrible accident. However the TV show Forensic Files also had a episode dedicated to the same case, taken mostly from the side of the prosecution. Both were equally convincing. Which was true, who am I to say?

en.wikipedia.org

Michael Peterson trial - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
I have jury duty in a few weeks and I wonder if we’ll have TV CSI sleuths in the jury pool.
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I was on a jury a few years ago and one of the items on the questionnaire was if you were a fan of true crime shows, if so, which ones.

Being on the jury made me even more skeptical than I was before about paid expert witnesses, especially psychologists.
 
Ed Haywood said:
AI summary of political conspiracy theories:

"A "self-sealing conspiracy" refers to a belief system or theory that is designed to be immune to disproof, where evidence against the theory is reinterpreted as proof of its validity, effectively "sealing" it against rational challenge by using circular reasoning and defense mechanisms like claiming evidence is planted or the theory is too vast for outsiders to grasp. This self-insulating quality makes conspiracy theories incredibly resilient, turning logical refutations into confirmation for believers, who often rely on pre-existing biases or psychological needs (control, belonging) rather than objective facts."
Click to expand...

You’ve just described HIMS….
 
MooneyDriver78 said:
Oh, just so you’re aware, you can’t make up own facts which you seem to be doing and ignoring others.
I hope you’re not on my jury, I have jury duty in a few weeks and I wonder if we’ll have TV CSI sleuths in the jury pool.
I remember CSI LV they said you’re protected from lightning in a vehicle because of the rubber tires insulated the car from the ground!? Yeah, lightning can travel 1000’ from the clouds to the car, but can’t jump the 6” from the chassis to the ground.
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I heard that you're protected from lightning in a car, but that was in the days when cars were made of metal, which I assumed would provide some degree of Faraday-cage protection. :dunno:
 
Palmpilot said:
I heard that you're protected from lightning in a car, but that was in the days when cars were made of metal, which I assumed would provide some degree of Faraday-cage protection. :dunno:
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Are cars made of something else now?
 
Lowflynjack said:
The police in the Steven Avery case made a lot of mistakes. Some of them most likely tampered with evidence. There was a history of this department botching investigations, including the first arrest of Steven for the rape he didn't commit. However... the abundance of the evidence shows he committed the murder. There's a good reason he's still in prison.
Click to expand...
Brendan Dassey is still in prison too. Just because our justice system fails sometimes and we don't like to believe it, doesn't mean it doesn't fail.

Frankly, even if Avery committed the murder, the fact that law enforcement absolutely had a motive to frame him, combined with the evidence tampering, should mean there is a "reasonable doubt" as to whether he did it.
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Brendan Dassey is still in prison too. Just because our justice system fails sometimes and we don't like to believe it, doesn't mean it doesn't fail.

Frankly, even if Avery committed the murder, the fact that law enforcement absolutely had a motive to frame him, combined with the evidence tampering, should mean there is a "reasonable doubt" as to whether he did it.
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I think I saw that Dassey has exhausted all appeal options, so he’s in for the duration until he’s eligible for parole.

I think Avery might still have an option or two left if an appeals court can be persuaded to hear his case.
 
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