Traveling for Business

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David Knowles

Filing Flight Plan
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AirByrd88
I am new to the forums and new to flying.

I would be flying from KVJI to KOKV at least 3 times a week for business. The flight distance is 272 miles. I would be purchasing a plane to use for the commute. I live about 10 minutes from the airport and the business I would be going to would be about 10 minutes from the airport as well. These would be daily flights, leave in the early morning and return in the evening.

I know this may seem like a crazy plan but I am looking for all feedback with regards to aircraft type, maintenance costs, fuel costs, insurance costs, weather issues, etc. What factors do I need to take into account. Is this possible? I would like to hear from individuals that might be already doing something similar for their own businesses or ones who have tried it and realized it was a miserable plan. I look forward to hearing from anyone.

Thank you
 
There is a lot to digest. Many more will follow on comments.
You have to get used to for along time you won’t make the flight due to weather. Flying for work that often will lend itself to a lot of missed flights.
If you want to have a snowballs chance you will have to get your IFR cert and still be prepared to cancel due to weather.
 
You’ll need an airplane with FIKI and an IFR rating to make it most practical. Neither of which are quick and easy to obtain and even then, it’s not always certain.
 
I do that exact mission several times a month upend down California. IMO, you would want a 182 or better...get ready for lots of options on plane recommendations.

There is a LOT that does and can go wrong with general aviation. If your arrival window is mission critical you have to leave tons of buffer time or go commercial. Maintenance issues and weather delays are typical.

Without IFR rating you are likely to have a 50% success rate at best with GA over commercial...and even with IFR at least 25% of my trips I have to hop on Southwest for one reason or another.

If you are flying SOLO (meaning no other should on board, employee, family, or otherwise) and the flying is incidental to the business, you can be 100% reimbursed for all of the direct flight costs from the company per FAA regs. As soon as another person is on board, the pro rata share rules kick in.
 
So it's right up the Shenandoah Valley. I've done that any number of times from HEF or OKV to KROA or KBCB, and I used to regularly fly from Cincinnati (Blue Ash, Lunken, and Hamilton) to KOKV.

You'll want to be IFR rated and a capable plane. There will be enough days with weather that IFR will be needed for mission completion. In the winter, you'll need Known Ice certification - or plan to cancel. There are days where there will be icing conditions and others where there will be just enough of a layer to pick up ice in the climb or descent.

It's not as much of a mountain wave as out west, but there will be days where the winds across the mountains west of the valley are enough that you'll want to be higher. Know what a lenticular cloud looks like. I never had an issue with rotor clouds, but did get enough wind to be uncomfortable under 7000 feet.

OKV has an ILS, but its toward the west. It'll save you time if you have an approach-capable GPS, the GPS approach from the west is good if you've got the ceiling. The airport is far enough west of IAD that ther generally aren't delays but one of the STARS for IAD does run overhead of OKV, so Potomac Approach may bring you down a bit earlier than you migh otherwise expect.

Folks at OKV are nice. If you'll rent a car, see if they have them on-site.... That's been on and off over the years. You should be able to pick up a clearance on the ground at OKV.
 
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Are you able to be flexible about canceling at the last minute, both for the outbound leg and for the return leg? I think the safest option is to start out doing it VFR and having a good Plan B so you can always cancel in the event of weather, mechanical issues, or just not feeling like flying each day. Trying to rush into an instrument rating and FIKI airplane so you can keep the schedule will just make your get-there-itis more ingrained, which will kill you the first day the conditions are beyond your abilities. Walk before you run, and all that.

Despite being instrument rated with over 500 hours, my business travel by plane works the same now as it did when I had just got my private and had under 50 hours of flight time. If I have to be somewhere at a certain time, I leave early enough to preflight, take off, climb to cruising altitude, realize I need to divert, go back home, put the plane away, drive, and still be there on time. In other words, I leave at least an hour earlier to fly than I would to drive. Incidentally, so far I have always been able to complete trips I planned this way in the air. But having a healthy margin for safety keeps me from trapping myself in a deadly situation.

It looks like your planned trip is about 4-1/2 hours by car. It's 2-3 hours in most planes that are a reasonable first one to own. Can you commit to doing your preflight inspection 5-1/2 hours before you have to be at the other end, knowing you will typically get there at least 2 hours early when you are able to safely fly? Can you commit to canceling the trip when things are just not working out, including spending the night at the other end of the trip if you can't safely fly home that particular evening?

If you can commit to safety, then you can (and should!) forge ahead and build your skills and confidence one flight at a time until the day you are ready to upgrade your airplane's abilities to increase the chances of safely making it by air. Do it 50 times VFR in a 172 or Cherokee, then 50 or 100 times IFR in the same plane, then upgrade to a plane that can shed ice and make the trip every day that the plane isn't broken down.
 
Flying yourself for work is a difficult recipe unless you have flexibility in your employment.

I’m IFR rated, have flown since 16 (now 53). My most used IFR long distance airplane was a turbo Mooney with 104 gallons of gas (I burn 11-13 at 165 knots), have stormscope, onboard weather prior to ADSB, flight director/autopilot, speed brakes, moving map, electronic plates on the radio stack, you name it. The only thing the plane didn’t have was known ice certification. It is a long distance, well equipped machine.

I started flying in California with Iune Gloom on the coast, and then Covered the Midwest (Chicago, south to Texas, East to Pennsylvania, Ohio, Tenn, Minn, Wisconsin, etc)...flying into snowed-in fields, poor braking action with the equivalent of black ice, serious turbulence banging my head on the roof of the plane, threading a needle between thunderstorms and lightning, escaped freezing rain, etc...And each of those circumstances happened with prior flight planning and IFR flight plans. This doesn’t include mechanicals. This was before I moved to Boston, which was even more exciting and not in a good way.

Then the day comes where you really really have to be there for work, and driving takes too long. There’s weather out there to bite you. Do you take the chance and try to make it? Or do you apologize and drive? Kobe tried it. His pilot was the guy managing my tiedown in Long Beach so I knew him. And with him boasting 8000 flying hours, look where he is now.

Single engine or even twin without known ice is a bad idea. If some of these postings sound discouraging, it’s because many a folks die in aviation based on poor planning, unexpected things, and get-there-itis. Work expects you to be there, and weather doesn’t check in with your boss before it happens. The kind of flying you’re describing (flying for work, three times a week, in Virginia, decidedly in instrument conditions) is what most of us would call advanced or very advanced flying - instrument conditions, real IFR, needing to depart and arrive at a specific time or schedule, etc.

As a new pilot, most of us experienced pilots (and I only have a few thousand hours, compared to many here who have tens of thousands of hours) would tell you that your plan, while reasonable, well thought out, researched and more is...not a good idea.

Learn to fly! Hey your IFR ticket! But until you’ve had a healthy number of real IFR flying hours, most would say you’re not qualified to do that sort of flying...yet, and the runway requires to get to that point is probably longer than you have in considering the job.
 
PlasticCigar said:
I I’ve had a bad mag check right before takeoff that caused me to abort and if I hadn’t given myself enough time to drive it would have been bad.
Click to expand...

This is the reason to perform an airborne magneto check shortly before you land. That way you can identify and fix a problem before your next flight. Yes, there is the possibility that the mag fails in the last two minutes of flying or during taxi, but you are reducing the probability of discovering a mag failure on departure significantly.
Jon
 
By the way, there will be days where even ground-pounders will have trouble. I went to school in Blacksburg and "home" was Northern Virginia. That meant a lot of time on I-81 driving.

Going back to school one time, right after Thanksgiving, the valley was hit with a snow and ice storm. While I left early enough that I made it through wit roads eithe barely plowed or unplowed, some of my friends ended up being forced to take a room (4 of them, we won't talk about who shared beds with who) at the Howard Johnson in Lexington because the interstate was closed. They got back to Blacksburg 2 days later.


No way I'd be flying in that, not even FIKI.
 
Sound advice from all the posts above. Aircraft-wise, yes, FIKI (known-ice capability), and for me, reasonably fast, such as 150kts or better, to make this viable. Lots of planes could do it, Cirrus, Mooney, on up into twins like a Seneca or Baron. Personally, for greatest dispatch percentage, I'd want a twin, but a single would be OK if you can accept cancellation on really low weather days.
But, the mission you've outlined is A LOT! You said, "at least 3 times a week" I assume this implies round-trip. returning to KVJI each time? And, "early in the morning, to return in evening". That's pretty much a full-time job in itself if you were going to hire a professional pilot for this scenario (very close to the duty profile for my current corporate pilot job.) You have to ask yourself, are you really going to be up to the task, getting up early enough to safely accomplish all pre-flight tasks (weather, briefing, aircraft pre-flight, snow removal at the hangar, etc.), then fly for an hour and a half or more, work at your "real job" all day, then SAFELY reverse the process, weather brief and pre-flight, fly home, in the dark (from October to March, anyway), which is right when the day's weather usually gets worse, etc., etc. Sure, on a clear-blue day in June, no problem, but all winter is an entirely different story. If this was 3 times a month, or even once a week, it'd be a lot more feasible for an owner-pilot to execute on their own.
Just short of outright calling this a bad idea, I'd strongly recommend careful consideration of all the components of this enormous task. And, truly, consider the possibility of hiring a professional pilot to help with this.
 
Aside from the good advice you have gotten above, consider how you will manage the 10 minutes from the airport to wherever you will do business- rental car?

Some companies don't allow business travel via part 91, they logic (or lack thereof) is for another thread.
 
I have a buddy that lives on an airport and works for Boeing. He uses his plane to commute more often than not here in the Washington gloomy weather and his commute is reduced from a couple of hours to about 20 minutes. The difference between what he does and what you are considering is that he can step out of his house and see the same weather that will cover his entire route and can change his plans at the drop of a hat. He has options that you may not.
 
Why 3 times per week instead of staying there for a night or two? Regardless of how you travel that's still a lot of travel time going back-and-forth, plus a lot of traveling expenses. How are you handling the travel now?

Others have covered the equipment well. Depending upon how you are doing the travel now, you could get a plane with deice, but not FIKI, and use your current method when there is known ice.

I'm in Charlotte today and there is overcast to broken clouds, currently broken at 1200'. Not a big deal for me as I'm instrument rated. No ice, no thunderstorms, just clouds, which would cancel or at least delay your trip if VFR only.



Wayne
 
David Knowles said:
I am new to the forums and new to flying.

I would be flying from KVJI to KOKV at least 3 times a week for business. The flight distance is 272 miles. I would be purchasing a plane to use for the commute. I live about 10 minutes from the airport and the business I would be going to would be about 10 minutes from the airport as well. These would be daily flights, leave in the early morning and return in the evening.

I know this may seem like a crazy plan but I am looking for all feedback with regards to aircraft type, maintenance costs, fuel costs, insurance costs, weather issues, etc. What factors do I need to take into account. Is this possible? I would like to hear from individuals that might be already doing something similar for their own businesses or ones who have tried it and realized it was a miserable plan. I look forward to hearing from anyone.

Thank you
Click to expand...

The new to flying part is the issue here. Flying for work is.... work. That means meeting a schedule and flying the winds and weather on those days. Need to have a safety management system that looks ooks at risk, and identifies every flight if the pilot and the plane are a match for the mission. Having an operations manual that sets rules and conditions of when a flight can be completed. Like minimum ceiling, maximum winds, max cross winds, minumum fuel etc. A flight risk assessment tool (FRAT) to identify and mitigate risks. When you are flying that mission you have to operate like a pro-pilot, but don’t need to be paid to be a pro-pilot. You just have to have the training, discipline and mind set. To be honest with yourself though, you need to be instrument rated, instrument proficient, some hours under your belt, and have a plane that can handle the conditions that you plan on flying. I fly for work, and have really enjoyed it. I fly a deiced, pressurized, turbine, so have a very high dispatch rate. Take away deiced, or pressurized, or turbine and you need to be appropriately conservative in your missions. Have a good plan B for now.
 
You are talking about at least 2.0-2.5 hours each way, not including ground transportation time, accounting for preflight and IFR routing and approach maneuvering if necessary, assuming something like a 115-120 kt aircraft. And you won't be making this flight in convective weather or during ice season. An IFR rating is a must to make it practical. I was making a commute from my apartment in the Washington DC area (based at KGAI) to central New York (KVGC) when I was working at NIH, but I only did that once a week at the most. That was about a 2+15 for me with no wind. That would be real grind three times a week. During the winter months, this trip became increasingly impractical due to widespread icing conditions. Headwinds in the northerly trip could stretch the trip out to 3 hours. I would always file IFR to be ready for weather and simplify navigating the DC SFRA. Your particular route will skirt or overfly mountainous terrain which generates interesting weather in spring and fall. You should be realistic about how reliably you will be able to make this trip, even with IFR proficiency and a FIKI-equipped airplane. For someone early in their flying career, this is likely more of a treat than a frequent practical commute.
 
I have flown to work many times. The only questions I would have are:

Do you absolutely have to be there?
If no, then no problem.
If yes, then this plan won't work... unless.

If you do have to be there, are you okay making the 4 hour drive when weather or unexpected maintenance prevents you from flying?
If yes, then no problem.
If no, then this plan won't work.
 
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