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Brendon

Pre-Flight
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Jun 24, 2017
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brendon7358
Hello,

First here is some background. I am 23, married, currently in the Air Force and live in North Carolina. I joined to eventually crossover to officer and become a pilot but have since decided to just go the civilian route using my GI bill along the way if possible. I got my PPL last year and currently have just over 52 hours.

My plan is once I get out of the military (between March and June of 2021), I will move down to Jacksonville, FL where my parents live. I don't plan on staying with them but I will if I have to. Once there my plan is to go to ATP flight school with PPL credit (costs about $70k), so between now and then I need to build about 35 more hours. At my local flight school a C172 is $150 wet and a 150 is $130 wet so that will cost me about $5000 so in the end $75,000+ minus however much I can save with the GI bill. I would need to take out a loan for ATP of about $70k.

The reason I want to go with ATP is it's quick, only 6 months. I'm already behind the curve from the military so I want to try to catch up as quick as possible.

Alternate plan: Would it be reasonable (I know its a gamble) to just buy a 172 or Cherokee 140/180 or even a 150. I would need to finance it, as I could only put down about $5k right now but a $20k or so loan pales in comparison to $70k. Then maybe take out a personal loan of I'm not sure how much and do all the training with my own airplane wherever I can? I don't know if it would actually save me much in the long run but at least I would own the airplane in the end.

Main problem with plan #2 is I think it would take longer, not look as good on a resume, and I might not be able to come up with the cash for flight training.

I really don't know how student loans for flight training works, or how the GI bill will help with flight training, from what I looked up online I think it only covers $14,000 a year which would be not nearly enough unless maybe I owned my own airplane.

Could you give me some advice? The only advice I'm not willing to hear is to just become an officer and be an air force pilot, my reasoning for that is below:
  • My vision is corrected to 20/20 but not corrected I don't think it would be good enough (20/400)
  • It would take WAY longer 4 years for bachelors + 2 years for OTS and flight training (minimum) + a service commitment of probably 6 years so 12 years total vs doing it civilian I can get similar hours and bachelors degree in about 8-10 years I believe
  • Always a chance I could fail flight training or get in trouble later in my career and not be able to fly, and therefore just wasting my time until I can separate
Thanks!
 
Let’s start with GI Bill. GI Bill will only pay for the flight hours provided in the course syllabus. As a fictional example, the Part 141s instrument course is 35 hours of flight time and 35 hours of ground training (the ground school + pre and post). If you require 40 hours of flight time to meet standards, GI Bill will not cover the 5 hours. Your annual GI Bill cap for flight training is close, I don’t know that actual value in 2020. Your GI Bill must be used at a 141 school. 141 school will not use a plane you own plane unless it is on lease back to the school. Many US military aero clubs are 141 schools and accept GI Bill. You will get excellent training there. All ATPs will be crap training.

If you go to an accelerated school, you will lose a lot of GI Bill benefit as there is no look back. For $14k, you should be able to knock out the IR and commercial in 10 months unaccelerated depending on WX and have uncle sugar pay for most the training, which is what I would recommend.

Once approved for GI Bill, the school will track the hours and bill uncle sugar until you exceed course hours or annual GI bill limits and then make you get your wallet out.
 
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I assume you want to go to regionals/airlines. That means getting to 1500 hrs ASAP. If thats the case I would try to buy something cheap and fly my ass off. Buy a mini max, C150, Champ, etc...anything with an N number.
While in the AF try to get done or at least far along on the instrument minimums (XC and hood time). This way you can maximize your GI bill at a 141...not ATP...and get your IR, COM and CFI ASAP.

Good luck...
 
If you enroll in a public school pilot degree program, there is no annual cap for Post 9/11 GI Bill funding. I am doing that right now. There is always the chance Congress will screw with this. Also, you likely won’t get to 1250/1500 that way without instructing afterwards or something else.
 
RingLaserGyroSandwich said:
If you enroll in a public school pilot degree program, there is no annual cap for Post 9/11 GI Bill funding. I am doing that right now. There is always the chance Congress will screw with this. Also, you likely won’t get to 1250/1500 that way without instructing afterwards or something else.
Click to expand...
This^.

What would you do if you took out a $30k (much more realistic) loan, bought a plane, and found out the engine needed an overhaul after you got it home?
 
RingLaserGyroSandwich said:
If you enroll in a public school pilot degree program, there is no annual cap for Post 9/11 GI Bill funding. I am doing that right now. There is always the chance Congress will screw with this. Also, you likely won’t get to 1250/1500 that way without instructing afterwards or something else.
Click to expand...

Do you mean like a normal college? Issue with that is it would take 4 years for something I could do in 6 months and I don't have that kind of time.

As for what if I got a plane and found out it needed overhaul that's what a pre purchase inspection is for. I would be looking for a plane with between 750-1600 time since overhaul that has been flown somewhat regularly, preferably by someone who did the same thing I would like to do. But I understand buying a plane is a gamble, and most likely not a plan I would go through with it.
 
RingLaserGyroSandwich said:
Yes.My program is a 2 years associates... not a 4 year bachelors. The problem you are describing is much smaller in that case.
Click to expand...

I will have to look into this, I don't think I would be able to do it while still in the military though, and it would waste some of my post 9/11 if I did.
 
I don’t know the ins & outs of G.I. Bill funding, but I would try to progress as much as possible while still in the military. I also wouldn’t rush into buying your own plane, expenses will eat away at funds. There used to be great flying clubs on bases in the military, possibly less common now.

Near bases there should be some flying clubs. Even if nothing else but adding hours(quality) and experience would be a benefit. You could take some instrument lessons, even if you don’t have the time & resources to go to completion now.

You civilian track sounds viable.
 
My understanding is that you will need a Second Class medical BEFORE you start using the Post 9/11 GIBill, not sure about any other GI Bills. The VA will pay for flight training that will be used for a vocation, and a 2nd class is needed at least.

You might consider transferring to the Air National Guard. It doesn't really fit with the plan you described, but some states offer tuition assistance for flight training to Guard members. In Michigan, it was $6,000 per year.
 
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