Third Class Medical Reform

[Half Fast]

Remember,,,, FSDO usually gives you an appointment to bring the log in.
no need to carry.

But it could be requested at a ramp check.

But since a pilot is already carrying charts, a tablet, a headset, a coffee cup, and who knows what else, I can't believe a logbook is a big price to pay for a one time only medical.

 

[Half Fast]

Carrying logbooks is a big deal to me. I frequently fly different airplanes the same day, sometimes owned by someone else. Having to remember to move logbooks from plane to plane would be a pain. I like being able to carry only needed documents in my wallet.

So do you carry charts, an AFD, and a flight computer in your wallet?

But if a logbook is a big deal to you, just continue with the same old 3rd class medical, same as before.

 

[azure]

But it could be requested at a ramp check.

But since a pilot is already carrying charts, a tablet, a headset, a coffee cup, and who knows what else, I can't believe a logbook is a big price to pay for a one time only medical.

It can be requested now at a ramp check, but since you're not required to carry it, they're supposed to give you an opportunity to present it later. No way can they come after you for not carrying your logbook, and I'd be surprised if that changed.

Another possibility is that the rule will end up saying that you have to carry the signed checklist with you when flying but that it needn't be kept with the logbook.

This is another of those details that will have to be ironed out in the NPRM process.

 

[FastEddieB]

Well, before we start the celebration let's see the effect, how many out of proficiency old pilots will burn smoking holes.

I predict it will be similar to the carnage we've seen over the last decade or so from incapacitated Sport Pilots.


Note: for those forum members who might be sarcasm impaired, the above was meant to be sarcastic.

 

[Half Fast]

I predict it will be similar to the carnage we've seen over the last decade or so from incapacitated Sport Pilots.

Oh, the humanity!

 

[MauleSkinner]

Note: for those forum members who might be sarcasm impaired....

Oh, the humanity!

 

[Tom-D]

Oh, the humanity!

Careful some old gezzer here might take exception to that.

 

[bflynn]

what's the difference between carrying your head set or flight bag and adding the log to the stuff already there.
???

My headset and flight bag are easily replaceable.

BTW, if anyone was wondering, the president did actually sign this yesterday (Friday). I haven't see it anywhere here but it's entirely possible I missed it.

Jan 11, 2017 is the magic 180 day date.

 

[Tom-D]

But it could be requested at a ramp check.

But since a pilot is already carrying charts, a tablet, a headset, a coffee cup, and who knows what else, I can't believe a logbook is a big price to pay for a one time only medical.

many pilots loose the stuff they carry.
They can ask for it, but if you are not carrying it, when they want to see it bd enough, they will set upon appointment for you to bring it into FSDO.

 

[arnoha]

I see nothing that indicates we need to carry the logbook. There are endorsements in there for many of the planes we fly to make it legal, and we don't have to carry for that.

My issue with carrying my logbook is that I don't want it lost. Don't care much about the bulk. That thing is precious to me, and I prefer it nicely tucked away in my home. Granted, I now use both a paper logbook and myflightbook (and really use myflightbook for all the actual counting), but I still find that I like having the pen-and-ink record around.

 

[hankrausch]

As I understand it the bill has been signed & now the FAA has 180 days- 1 year to implement. My question is: if your current medical expires in the interim prior to FAA implementation, is one required to get a standard 3rd class medical, until it is implemented?

Thanks in advance.

 

[azure]

As I understand it the bill has been signed & now the FAA has 180 days- 1 year to implement. My question is: if your current medical expires in the interim prior to FAA implementation, is one required to get a standard 3rd class medical, until it is implemented?

Thanks in advance.

Yes - if you want to fly in the interim. (Except LSA, of course.)

Or you could let it lapse, not fly, and wait for the new rules.

 

[hankrausch]

Thanks!

 

[RalphInCA]

As do Sport pilots. Is that really a big deal?

Heck, by the time this becomes reality, Foreflight will probably have it folded into the electronic logbook somehow.

No, not a big deal. I do it today anyway. But some pilots don't like to because of the risk of the logbook being destroyed in a crash.

 

[hindsight2020]

If the part 23 bait and switch is any indication, it'll get implemented two years late, and it won't even contain the provisions being touted on here as benefits LOL

 

[Silvaire]

Lol. We wanted medical reform, we got it, and we're still not happy.

I wouldn't say I'm not happy but it was a simple act of eliminating the need for a third class medical and in the end, when they got done fiddling with it, it's fourteen pages long.

 

[Palmpilot]

what's the difference between carrying your head set or flight bag and adding the log to the stuff already there.
???

Losing your log book is a much bigger deal than losing your headset or flight bag.

I once left my log book in a rental plane at Paine Field. I didn't discover this until I got to Portland. That's why I only carry my logbook if I'm going to be flying with an instructor who will need to sign it.

 

[Palmpilot]

Since proving we are "medically legal" has now become a logbook entry, looks like we now have to carry our logbooks on every flight.

Agree with a post above that says this thing has been touched by so many people that it has become a cluster frick. Just like ObamaCare. A good idea ruined by politics.

The proof that you are legal to fly a complex or high performance airplane is a logbook endorsement. That doesn't require you to carry the logbook that has the endorsement (which may or may not be your current logbook) with you, so I would think that whether you will be required to carry your logbook in order to take advantage of PBOR2 will depend on how the statute is worded.

Of course, the FAA could adopt a regulation requiring you to carry it.

 

[Palmpilot]

As do Sport pilots...

I can't find a requirement for sport pilots to carry their logbooks. Can you provide a cite?

 

[Half Fast]

I can't find a requirement for sport pilots to carry their logbooks. Can you provide a cite?

FAR 61.51 (i) (3)
A sport pilot must carry his or her logbook or other evidence of required authorized instructor endorsements on all flights.

The endorsements for Vh above 87 knots, for use of towered airports, etc., are logbook entries. I suppose a photocopy of the endorsements might be satisfactory as "other evidence" but I'm not certain. I think most just carry their logbooks.

 

[Palmpilot]

FAR 61.51 (i) (3)
A sport pilot must carry his or her logbook or other evidence of required authorized instructor endorsements on all flights.

The endorsements for Vh above 87 knots, for use of towered airports, etc., are logbook entries. I suppose a photocopy of the endorsements might be satisfactory as "other evidence" but I'm not certain. I think most just carry their logbooks.

Thanks. I only searched Subpart J, so I didn't find that one.

By the way, I assume it doesn't apply to pilots like myself who have a higher type of pilot certificate but are flying under sport pilot rules, and in any case pilots in that group aren't required to have the endorsements that apply to sport pilots.

 

[Half Fast]

I think that's correct. Your private ticket indicates you know how to work with a tower, for example, whereas a sport ticket by itself does not.

 

[FastEddieB]

By the way, I assume it doesn't apply to pilots like myself who have a higher type of pilot certificate but are flying under sport pilot rules, and in any case pilots in that group aren't required to have the endorsements that apply to sport pilots.

That's correct, because you are still a Private Pilot, Commercial Pilot or ATP.

You are simply choosing to accept Sport Pilot limitations for the time being.

 

[N3368K]

So do you carry charts, an AFD, and a flight computer in your wallet?

But if a logbook is a big deal to you, just continue with the same old 3rd class medical, same as before.

Yep. My iPhone on my hip or in my pocket.

 

[steingar]

You have to carry your medical right now. What's the difference if you carry a signed checklist? Its just another piece of paper.

 

[AggieMike88]

Since proving we are "medically legal" has now become a logbook entry, looks like we now have to carry our logbooks on every flight.

See the MyFlightBook thread. @EricBe has already said it's an easy thing to do to add the ability to log and record the doctor's visit and online test. Likely also have the ability to attach a photo or PDF of any documents. So that would negate the need of carrying the paper book as your post implies. (Yes, I keep the originals in the paper books, but that remains at safe at home unless I am recording a CFI's endorsement)

 

[Ravioli]

Clueless as usual, I'll ask. What's the aversion to having your logbook with you? Is it too damn heavy?

 

[azure]

No, but for many of us, it would be very difficult (perhaps impossible) to replace and reconstruct all of the entries, endorsements, signoffs, etc. in it.

 

[RalphInCA]

Clueless as usual, I'll ask. What's the aversion to having your logbook with you? Is it too damn heavy?

If you crash it can be destroyed. Plus the more places you carry it, the greater the likelihood of it getting lost.

 

[Sundancer]

Geez, once this takes effect, just put in your logbook, leave the logbook at home.

Or, fold it up and stick it in your wallet, and still leave the logbook at home.

If you get a ramp check, and it's home on your logbook, they'll probably ask you to email a copy or bring it by. Or, I doubt they'll carp if you carry it on you and present it, even if it's not stapled in your logbook.

I imagine most of us will stick it wherever we carry our current medical - maybe scan and reduce it, trim off the edges.

 

[AnyMouseMedical]

No, you made it by 153 weeks.

(using the 2 year over 40 assumption...) Blues are qualifiers, reds are disqualifiers.

Sec 2307.A:

(a) In general.—Not later than 180 days after the date of enactment of this Act, the Administrator of the Federal Aviation Administration shall issue or revise regulations to ensure that an individual may operate as pilot in command of a covered aircraft if—

(1) the individual possesses a valid driver's license issued by a State, territory, or possession of the United States and complies with all medical requirements or restrictions associated with that license;

(2) the individual holds a medical certificate issued by the Federal Aviation Administration on the date of enactment of this Act, held such a certificate at any point during the 10-year period preceding such date of enactment, or obtains such a certificate after such date of enactment;

(3) the most recent medical certificate issued by the Federal Aviation Administration to the individual—
(A) indicates whether the certificate is first, second, or third class;
(B) may include authorization for special issuance;
(C) may be expired;
(D) cannot have been revoked or suspended; and
(E) cannot have been withdrawn;

(4) the most recent application for airman medical certification submitted to the Federal Aviation Administration by the individual cannot have been completed and denied;​

Sorry for the AnyMouse, but this stuff is kind of personal.

Question(s): Let's say a middle aged woman held a valid 3rd class medical with a medical date of 1/2007, and in 12/2009 was diagnosed with a highly treatable cancer. She never told the FAA anything, and (of course) never acted as PIC after 12/2009. By 5/2010 she had been declared 'cancer free.' She never applied for another medical after that time.

Was her medical 'revoked or suspended' according to this new law? Is she lucky enough to self-certify on-line, or does she need to seek a new medical and/or special issuance?

 

[RotorDude]

Sorry for the AnyMouse, but this stuff is kind of personal.

Question(s): Let's say a middle aged woman held a valid 3rd class medical with a medical date of 1/2007, and in 12/2009 was diagnosed with a highly treatable cancer. She never told the FAA anything, and (of course) never acted as PIC after 12/2009. By 5/2010 she had been declared 'cancer free.' She never applied for another medical after that time.

Was her medical 'revoked or suspended' according to this new law? Is she lucky enough to self-certify on-line, or does she need to seek a new medical and/or special issuance?

IANAL etc., but IMO there has never been a suspension or revocation from the FAA's perspective in this case, so no new 3rd class medical is required according to PBOR.

 

[Jeffythequick]

Sorry for the AnyMouse, but this stuff is kind of personal.

Question(s): Let's say a middle aged woman held a valid 3rd class medical with a medical date of 1/2007, and in 12/2009 was diagnosed with a highly treatable cancer. She never told the FAA anything, and (of course) never acted as PIC after 12/2009. By 5/2010 she had been declared 'cancer free.' She never applied for another medical after that time.

Was her medical 'revoked or suspended' according to this new law? Is she lucky enough to self-certify on-line, or does she need to seek a new medical and/or special issuance?

IANAL etc., but IMO there has never been a suspension or revocation from the FAA's perspective in this case, so no new 3rd class medical is required according to PBOR.

I'm with RotorDude. There are tons of people with CPAPs that were waiting for this.

It's a shame that I went for my 3rd Class medical, but in a way, good. I've found out that my heart is good (which relieved my wife, b/c her first husband died at 32 of a heart attack), and that I'm healthy, besides being a T1 Diabetic (she really knows how to pick 'em doesn't she?).