The need for speed?

For most people and most applications, 3 hours seems to be about the limit for how long they want to be in the plane. Even pilots often don't want to be in there longer. I'm just a road (sky?) warrior who's likes long days in the seat.

The IV-P is a great plane for speed. Its safety record shows some of the trade-offs that have been made for that speed.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
For most people and most applications, 3 hours seems to be about the limit for how long they want to be in the plane. Even pilots often don't want to be in there longer. I'm just a road (sky?) warrior who's likes long days in the seat.

The IV-P is a great plane for speed. Its safety record shows some of the trade-offs that have been made for that speed.
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I'm not at all claustrophobic, but the idea of being confined in a tight cockpit for six or more hours while bouncing along thorough the North Atlantic weather makes seat 22F in whomever's 767 sound downright appealing. But then again, this is stratobee's dream, not mine. I have a dream too, but it's much more modest.
 
FormerHangie said:
I'm not at all claustrophobic, but the idea of being confined in a tight cockpit for six or more hours while bouncing along thorough the North Atlantic weather makes seat 22F in whomever's 767 sound downright appealing. But then again, this is stratobee's dream, not mine. I have a dream too, but it's much more modest.
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I think most people agree with you. I have no issues with the long wilderness or over water flights, but it does require appropriate planning and an understanding of what to expect. Since you have very few outs, your primary option is to keep going. Then what do you do for ice, storms, etc.? Pretty much deviate left/right or change altitude.

GA in general is an adventure. Most people are not adventurous. The airline industry is built on how to make something a non-adventure.
 
Well, I sit here booking my airline flights: LAX to Slovenia is in it's quickest form a 19hr30min ride with Lufthansa and a stop in Munich. It's a 7hr layover in MUC. Fine - I'll just work on the computer and have industrial amounts of coffee. Going back is a different kettle of fish, tho. Have not been able to find anything faster than 28hrs going back, most of it well over 33hrs. All of them have a 20-22hr layover in MUC. Which means a hotel and the rigmarole of all that.

All of a sudden I could have beat the airlines just going in a bog standard 200kts aircraft in time - take your pick. Obviously not in cost, but let's ignore that just for now..:wink2:
 
stratobee said:
Well, I sit here booking my airline flights: LAX to Slovenia is in it's quickest form a 19hr30min ride with Lufthansa and a stop in Munich. It's a 7hr layover in MUC. Fine - I'll just work on the computer and have industrial amounts of coffee. Going back is a different kettle of fish, tho. Have not been able to find anything faster than 28hrs going back, most of it well over 33hrs. All of them have a 20-22hr layover in MUC. Which means a hotel and the rigmarole of all that.

All of a sudden I could have beat the airlines just going in a bog standard 200kts aircraft in time - take your pick. Obviously not in cost, but let's ignore that just for now..:wink2:
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Price first class tickets? Your Aerostar may even be competitive in price then.:lol:;)
 
stratobee said:
Well, I sit here booking my airline flights: LAX to Slovenia is in it's quickest form a 19hr30min ride with Lufthansa and a stop in Munich. It's a 7hr layover in MUC. Fine - I'll just work on the computer and have industrial amounts of coffee. Going back is a different kettle of fish, tho. Have not been able to find anything faster than 28hrs going back, most of it well over 33hrs. All of them have a 20-22hr layover in MUC. Which means a hotel and the rigmarole of all that.
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I do not miss the joys of working internationally...
 
stratobee said:
Well, I sit here booking my airline flights: LAX to Slovenia is in it's quickest form a 19hr30min ride with Lufthansa and a stop in Munich. It's a 7hr layover in MUC. Fine - I'll just work on the computer and have industrial amounts of coffee. Going back is a different kettle of fish, tho. Have not been able to find anything faster than 28hrs going back, most of it well over 33hrs. All of them have a 20-22hr layover in MUC. Which means a hotel and the rigmarole of all that.

All of a sudden I could have beat the airlines just going in a bog standard 200kts aircraft in time - take your pick. Obviously not in cost, but let's ignore that just for now..:wink2:
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Hmmm, try Kayak.com? I don't know your dates, but I'm finding 13:45 there and 15 return. BTW, First Class is $19,695.:D
 
It's Kayak I'm looking at Henning, but unfortunately I have specific dates I need to be there and come back to, so it's a little locked in. Which gives me less options.

Clark - yes, one sounds like such a tool when one complains about something that many people never get to experience - the wonders of travel and seeing new cultures - but after you've done it professionally for decades it gets very old and tedious. Still, beats working at McDonalds, there's no denying that..:rolleyes::yes:
 
stratobee said:
It's Kayak I'm looking at Henning, but unfortunately I have specific dates I need to be there and come back to, so it's a little locked in. Which gives me less options.

Clark - yes, one sounds like such a tool when one complains about something that many people never get to experience - the wonders of travel and seeing new cultures - but after you've done it professionally for decades it gets very old and tedious. Still, beats working at McDonalds, there's no denying that..:rolleyes::yes:
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I have found strange issues with Kayak before. Try searching your dates first class, and then going to those airlines directly to book the flights, because those flights I mentioned above did not show under Economy settings.
 
Sounds like you need to get working on outfitting the Aerostar with extra tanks. That's going to be your best bet, really.
 
LAX to LJU is what, 5300 nm, if you take the Great Circle route that takes you up over Greenland. That's a whole lot of cold, dark, wet, and wilderness to cover in a piston single. Howsabout we break that up into legs: LAX to Bangor, ME, then on to Shannon, then to LJU.. Longest leg there is 2400 NM, total distance of 5700nm. Given the right equipment (your 300 knot single) and the right weather, that sounds like an awesome adventure. Add a few more stops and do it in your Aerostar, once. Having to do it repeatedly, especially in the winter and on a time certain schedule, sounds more like masochism, at least to me, YMMV.

Have you read much of Peter Garrison's Melmoth?
 
My plan was always to take the old Aerostar to Europe one day and go visit mom. Maybe even next summer if I can get the panel done (mode S and 8.33khz spaced radios is needed in Europe) and my d**m IR ticket done in time :)confused:). Be an awesome summer adventure. But just like you FormerHangie, this is not something I'd like to attempt on a regular basis. No, the reason for this thread was more of a "would it be possible?"-kinda thing. A daydream.

I hope one day there will be an electric little aircraft that I can fly 400kts in for the cost of brewing a coffee/hour. That would be neat. And then we'd see the true birth of aviation….:thumbsup:

Have not read much more than the odd stuff in Flying from Garrison.
 
stratobee said:
My plan was always to take the old Aerostar to Europe one day and go visit mom. Maybe even next summer if I can get the panel done (mode S and 8.33khz spaced radios is needed in Europe) and my d**m IR ticket done in time :)confused:). Be an awesome summer adventure. But just like you FormerHangie, this is not something I'd like to attempt on a regular basis. No, the reason for this thread was more of a "would it be possible?"-kinda thing. A daydream.

I hope one day there will be an electric little aircraft that I can fly 400kts in for the cost of brewing a coffee/hour. That would be neat. And then we'd see the true birth of aviation….:thumbsup:

Have not read much more than the odd stuff in Flying from Garrison.
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You want a right seater for that trip, let me know, I have some cousins in Germany to visit as well.
 
Keep that in mind, Henning!
 
Altitude is one of the keys to doing long trips safely and reliably, simply because you get above so much weather. RVSM gets in the way there. I've wondered if it would be possible to make RVSM cheaper, but there's not a ton of demand I suppose. The TBM has it, is it as expensive on one of those as on a jet?

We know PT-6s can do FL410 - look at the Piaggio. Pistons have typically topped out at FL300 at the absolute highest, and really drop off above 20k, but I've also not seen ones that are really designed for the higher altitudes. You'd probably have traffic issues up there. Even at 300-350, you'll be as slow as a Slowtation.

As far as radios, the 530/430 can do the Euro spacing, and can flop back and forth between them.
 
Garrison's web site is here:

http://www.melmoth2.com/

His experiences with Melmoth I are particularly interesting to anyone contemplating long distance travel in a light single. They can be found from the "Topics" link on the main page.
 
I think he makes a rather compelling argument for having a twin that has reasonable OEI performance.
 
Skylane81E said:
A trip to Europe is one of my eventual goals as well.
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Yes, me too. Just ONE trip though. To do it continuously does not make a lot of sense cost wise, it is far cheaper and quicker to just buy a business class ticket, and eat, drink and lie flat in the back.
 
stratobee said:
It certainly is possible to get almost insane amounts of economy out of the right tool. 100mpg, LA to Oshkosh non stop on 30 gals. That's a fuel cost of about $150 bucks. You couldn't find an airline ticket for double that amount!

http://www.aopa.org/News-and-Video/All-News/2008/December/30/One-hundred-miles-per-gallon?WT.mc_id=090102epilot&WT.mc_sect=gan
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For anyone contemplating using a Vari-eze for long distance, all weather flights I would caution that they are not very comfy after > 4 hours, and they absolutely do not like rain or ice. I can tell you from first hand that they get twitchy in rain of any kind, and from what I've heard, even the smallest amount of ice will make flying impossible. However, people have put tanks in the small detents in the inside strakes, and even in the pax seat and done some pretty long flights with them.

This particular plane is highly modified, but the Vari-eze in general is an excellent platform for efficiency. I regularly got 40-50MPG(stat) by pulling the power back to ~30% up high.
 
I can't believe that people would put down a deposit for something like this. Zero hard info other than a sexy rendering.


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Icon has been in 'business' for years. Taken thousands of deposits.
 
It's far from low cost and seems more like a toy to me than a real aircraft. Kinda like those small experimental helicopters but much more expensive.


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