The Lakes is back!!!

[ebetancourt]

Waco classic just announced that they are bringing it back into full production, with a few mods, including an aluminum spar.

If they build it as well as the Wacos it will be a fantastic airplane for the price.

"The new Airplane is the Great Lakes Model 2T-1A-1/2, a fully aerobatic 180 horsepower aircraft targeted at pilots and flight schools looking for a highly capable aerobatic aircraft with docile handling attributes. The aircraft was most recently produced in the 1980, and is type certificated in the aerobatic category."

 

[steingar]

The best way to make a small fortune in aviation is to start with a larger one.

 

[PittsDriver]

Companies that are one trick ponies are always in danger of letting their need to add more tricks outweigh the case for the one they know how to add. About the only niche in aerobatics that I could see getting any serious traction would be an LSA rated to +6/-4 or better with inverted systems. I don't think they'll get a Great Lakes into that category so I have to agree, this looks like a way to blow some dough on a mediocre airplane.

"a highly capable aerobatic aircraft with docile handling attributes" is a Decathlon.

 

[steingar]

People who invest in aviation are the biggest suckers in the world.

— David G. Neeleman, after raising a record $128 million to start New Air (the then working name for what became JetBlue Airways), quoted in Business Week, 3 May 1999.

 

[whifferdill]

Very interesting. However, I think anyone willing to plunk down (I'd bet ~$300K) for an open-cockpit biplane with a FLAT Lycoming is going to be someone with a particularly strong fondness for the airplane. If Waco Classic has made this determination, and their economics make sense, more power to them. But the Waco YMF type they already make has, IMHO, a much stronger nostalgic connection to this "golden era of flight" stuff. I mean nobody says "real airplanes have four wings and a flat engine."

As far as aerobatics go, this airplane performs no better than a 150 hp Citabria 7KCAB. Not a whole lot of folks actually like competition-style (negative G) acro. For the ones who do, most will pretty quickly want something with more performance than a Great Lakes...unless they are limited to LSA which the Lakes will be too heavy for.

Anyone who's seriously into acro and could afford this airplane could probably also afford a higher-performing dedicated acro mount. The Lakes would probably be just for fun flying, the occasional loop or roll, and its "fully aerobatic" capabilities (inverted systems) would probably not be utilized much.

I fly a Pitts and a Clipped Cub. When I first got into the Cub I thought it would be cool to be able to do some loops and rolls in it. But I found that simply doing "whifferdill" loops and rolls doesn't interest me a whole lot (I have the Pitts for serious acro), and now I rarely do any in the Cub. I still enjoy flying it, but for completely different reasons.

That being said, I'd LOVE to see more Lakes' at contests.

 

[Ken Ibold]

As far as aerobatics go, this airplane performs no better than a 150 hp Citabria 7KCAB. Not a whole lot of folks actually like competition-style (negative G) acro. For the ones who do, most will pretty quickly want something with more performance than a Great Lakes...unless they are limited to LSA which the Lakes will be too heavy for.

Anyone who's seriously into acro and could afford this airplane could probably also afford a higher-performing dedicated acro mount. The Lakes would probably be just for fun flying, the occasional loop or roll, and its "fully aerobatic" capabilities (inverted systems) would probably not be utilized much.

So true, but remember that most people use only the loosest "analysis" to justify plunking down the money for something that speaks to them on some level. When I bought my 7GCAA, I was looking for a fun flier that could do occasional acrobatics, and it pretty much did what I wanted it to do. I traded it for a Pitts not because I wanted something higher performance, but because I wanted something that wasn't so dorky looking. I, for one, would be interested in this airplane as a cool, recent vintage biplane that was fun to fly, particularly if the enclosed cockpit option they have extends over both holes. I like fun. I like biplanes. I like airplanes that are younger than my kids.

The price is a deal-killer for me many times over, but not everyone has such constraints.

 

[whifferdill]

I traded it for a Pitts not because I wanted something higher performance, but because I wanted something that wasn't so dorky looking.

I have to admit that I've wanted a Pitts since I was 4 years old only because it's the world's coolest-looking airplane. I only became interested in its aerobatic capability later in life.

I, for one, would be interested in this airplane as a cool, recent vintage biplane that was fun to fly...

Me too! ...If someone gave me one. But for $240K, I could get a nice Stearman AND a nice Pitts, which is exactly what I'd do with that money before buying the Lakes.

 

[Ken Ibold]

I have to admit that I've wanted a Pitts since I was 4 years old only because it's the world's coolest-looking airplane. I only became interested in its aerobatic capability later in life.



Me too! ...If someone gave me one. But for $240K, I could get a nice Stearman AND a nice Pitts, which is exactly what I'd do with that money before buying the Lakes.

We are on the exact same page on this.

 

[ebetancourt]

Interesting comments.

My take on it is that it is half the price of a new YMF, and I would love, once in my life, to buy a new airplane with everything I want on it. I have no interest in serious aerobatics, and I love cross country in the Waco. Might enjoy it in a Lakes.

I am glad this wasn't available in the spring when I decided to buy my Waco, it would have been tough to ignore a new airplane for not much more than a used one. Now that I have flown the Waco, I wouldn't give it up for anything else flying.

Ernie

PS, Peter and his team have figured out how to run a business on low volume. I suspect they thought this out and will make money on it.

 

[Inverted]

We have 2 Lakes at our school, they are a bunch of fun. But I would never spend 250k for a new one.