The face of General Aviation

Bob Bement

Bob Bement

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Bob Bement
I have mixed emotions if Harrison Ford is the face for/of General aviation. On the good side he is a popular celebrity figure. He is also a down to earth kind of a guy. I know he served as head of the "young eagles" as well.

The thing that makes me have mixed emotions, is most people think that pilots are a bunch of rich people with very expensive toys. I wonder if that isn't very far from the truth. I know that if I didn't have a free hangar, a friend that comes to my hangar to do my annuals, and other things to make it possible to keep going. I would not be able to keep a 182 flying on my own. I might be all wet on this but this is my feelings on it.
 
I wonder if there is a way that AOPA and Ford could try to get the point across to the general public that we're not all rich.

Maybe something to parallel it to normal life? I mean there are plenty of people without airplanes who have bank accounts that look like social security numbers. Maybe 'yes, there are some filthy steenking rich pilots, most are probably average and too many of us fight with the wild dogs at the dumpster out back of fast food joints for dinner that week.' Then take a camera on a tour of a generic quiet little town GA airport and talk to real pilots and aircraft owners.
Seriously, for starters if we were all as rich as everyone thinks we are, we would all have far nicer looking hangars than your average half rusted very leaky uninsulated T hangar that are common across the continent...and that goes triple for the planes at tiedowns exposed to the weather. I don't want to know how many hangars would get condemed if building inspectors descended enforce at GA airports.
 
I think it depends on who you talk to about pilots being "rich".
It is a matter of having the disposable income to spend on what really is an expensive hobby (for a lot of us).
The same group that thinks pilots are rich, would more than likely think the neighbor with the 22ft cuddy cabin in the driveway as being "rich" also.
 
It never ceases to amaze me that so many people are jealous of others who have done well. Harrison Ford has done well in his chosen profession though hard work, dedication, and a little luck. He gives back to the "community" with both his time and money, this should be commended not condemned. It is his money, he has earned it. It is his time, and he only has so much of it. How he spends either one is up to him, and I thank him for being involved in EAA.


"Tho shall not covet thy neighbors ass-etts". There is a reason this is in the "Top 10".
 
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I hear you, Bob, but I think that, on balance, the good that Mr. Ford does by simply providing a reasoned and reasonable message about GA, delivered by someone whose high profile improves the chance it will be listened to, outweighs any negative impact of his remarkable wealth.
 
SCCutler said:
I hear you, Bob, but I think that, on balance, the good that Mr. Ford does by simply providing a reasoned and reasonable message about GA, delivered by someone whose high profile improves the chance it will be listened to, outweighs any negative impact of his remarkable wealth.
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Well put, Skip, that is why I said that I have mixed emotions. I guess we have to have a wealthy guy like him to be listened to.
 
I think AOPA and EAA could use Mr. Ford to get peoples attention, and then have him introduce normal folks.

Imagine Mr. Ford doing little 5 minute interviews on youtube with "regular" pilots. Perhaps on one episode he interviews a guy who does Angel Flights. Another episode he interviews a couple who fly there C182 to the Bahamas or Baja for vacation. Another interview where he is talking with a working class guy who built his own plane (perhaps something inexpensive like a pietenpol, or Sonerai) in his garage. There are hundreds of ideas out there.

The key is that people tune in to see Harrison Ford, but they stay tuned in because the stories are those they can relate to. Owning an airplane is a great way to have REAL adventures. Sure, you won't be Han Solo or Indiana Jones, but then again, neither is Harrison Ford. He is merely someone who PRETENDS to be those people (and he is exceptionally good at it). I think most of society is so used to watching other people pretend to have adventures that they forget they can have their own real adventures.
 
mcjon77 said:
I think AOPA and EAA could use Mr. Ford to get peoples attention, and then have him introduce normal folks.

Imagine Mr. Ford doing little 5 minute interviews on youtube with "regular" pilots. Perhaps on one episode he interviews a guy who does Angel Flights. Another episode he interviews a couple who fly there C182 to the Bahamas or Baja for vacation. Another interview where he is talking with a working class guy who built his own plane (perhaps something inexpensive like a pietenpol, or Sonerai) in his garage. There are hundreds of ideas out there.

The key is that people tune in to see Harrison Ford, but they stay tuned in because the stories are those they can relate to. Owning an airplane is a great way to have REAL adventures. Sure, you won't be Han Solo or Indiana Jones, but then again, neither is Harrison Ford. He is merely someone who PRETENDS to be those people (and he is exceptionally good at it). I think most of society is so used to watching other people pretend to have adventures that they forget they can have their own real adventures.
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Jon, I like your idea to use Ford to show the other side of GA.
 
SteveinMichigan said:
Someone should pass that idea along to the AOPA.
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Done. Sent to Craig Fuller (President) and Chris Dancy (who heads their Public Relations). Gave them a link to this thread, and mcjon77's terrific idea specifically. AOPA, if you stop by this thread, create an account, login, and say "HI!" to the pilots of POA.
 
I think GA can be affordable but you definitely have to pick your hobbies. A regular guy like me can have one spendy hobby and that's it. I know many people who are in my financial realm who spend enough on their lake cabin, snowmobiles, 4-wheelers, and campers to fund a nice used 4 seat airplane and associated expenses.

I'm disappointed that the LSA phenomenon resulted in so many models at or above $100,000. That price tag is definitely out of reach for me and my ilk. If I ever own a plane, it will be a used model.
 
My roommates dad would always give me a hard time about us "millionaire *******" in our fancy planes with our motorcycles ect...
He never cared that the plane I rented was a 1968 model that was trashed and that I didn't spend money on anything else so I could fly that plane when able.

He also smoked two packs a day and drank a 24 pack EVERY day. But didn't like it when I did the math for him on his smoking and drinking and my flying.

He outspendied me :yesnod:
 
mcjon77 said:
I think AOPA and EAA could use Mr. Ford to get peoples attention, and then have him introduce normal folks.

Imagine Mr. Ford doing little 5 minute interviews on youtube with "regular" pilots. Perhaps on one episode he interviews a guy who does Angel Flights. Another episode he interviews a couple who fly there C182 to the Bahamas or Baja for vacation. Another interview where he is talking with a working class guy who built his own plane (perhaps something inexpensive like a pietenpol, or Sonerai) in his garage. There are hundreds of ideas out there.

The key is that people tune in to see Harrison Ford, but they stay tuned in because the stories are those they can relate to. Owning an airplane is a great way to have REAL adventures. Sure, you won't be Han Solo or Indiana Jones, but then again, neither is Harrison Ford. He is merely someone who PRETENDS to be those people (and he is exceptionally good at it). I think most of society is so used to watching other people pretend to have adventures that they forget they can have their own real adventures.
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I cant belive that AOPA didn't think of this allready, its a great idea. The only thing people see out of aviation is the low income of the regonals and big biz jets that the rich use, they never see how the normal guy uses his 40yr old airplane.
 
Before you slam Harrison Ford, look at his actions. He can't help his fame, but he acts like a normal Joe. A normal Joe who owns a helo that he flies on volunteer S&R missions in the Jackson Hole area. By all accounts he is "just plain Harrison" and his volunteer work reflect well on GA.

What is the alternative? The Flying Farmer? Some average joe flying a clapped out Cherokee? Does that speak to the people? I think you need a little star power to get the attention of the masses.
 
flyersfan31 said:
Before you slam Harrison Ford, look at his actions. He can't help his fame, but he acts like a normal Joe. A normal Joe who owns a helo that he flies on volunteer S&R missions in the Jackson Hole area. By all accounts he is "just plain Harrison" and his volunteer work reflect well on GA.

What is the alternative? The Flying Farmer? Some average joe flying a clapped out Cherokee? Does that speak to the people? I think you need a little star power to get the attention of the masses.
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People with name recognition tend to be rich - actors, pro athletes and business moguls. How many famous poor people are there? I think Ford is a good choice, personally.


Trapper John
 
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Well-to-do is anyone who makes half again as much as you do...
Rich is anyone who makes twice what you do...
Rich is the guy with a $2K used econobox, when riding the bus is the best you can do...
Rich is the guy with a $10K used truck when the $2K econobox is the best you can do...
Rich is the guy with a truck and an old airplane...
Rich is relative...
Unfortunately, none of my relatives are...

denny-o
 
Trapper John said:
People with name recognition tend to be rich - actors, pro athletes and business moguls. How many famous poor people are there? I think Ford is a good choice, personally.
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Based on the me me me me attitude and despicable news reports about actors in general including the snobbish handful that have been in a GA plane, Harrison is likely the only one in the entire batch that any sensible pilot would pick out of the lineup to have on our side. IMHO, YMMV.


Rich is the guy with a truck and an old airplane...
Rich is relative...
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Then there's the quiet guy driving the ratty pathetic truck around, living in an old 1920's farmhouse, shopping very conservatively at walmart...with a beautiful plane in the back 40 and a 9 digit bank account because he doesn't blow money of fluff to impress the neighbors with.
 
flyersfan31 said:
Before you slam Harrison Ford, look at his actions. He can't help his fame, but he acts like a normal Joe. A normal Joe who owns a helo that he flies on volunteer S&R missions in the Jackson Hole area. By all accounts he is "just plain Harrison" and his volunteer work reflect well on GA.

What is the alternative? The Flying Farmer? Some average joe flying a clapped out Cherokee? Does that speak to the people? I think you need a little star power to get the attention of the masses.
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I wasn't slamming Harrison Ford. If you took the time to read what I wrote. I said about the same thing as you. I said I HAD MIXED EMOTIONS having people thing I am a Harrison Ford because I fly an airplane. I like the fact that he has several planes, a helicopter, and all of the money it takes to run them. He earned it.
 
If celebs are hired to sell peanut butter why not GA? I know I can't afford as much peanut butter as Harrison Ford but I still eat the stuff.
 
I think general aviation has a lot of faces and reading a little about Harrison Ford it seems as if he has experience with many of them. I don't understand the worry that pilots have about other people thinking they are like Harrison Ford or that they are "rich". Do other people really think that? In any case, would that be an insult?

Ford began flight training in the 1960s at Wild Rose Airport in Wild Rose, Wisconsin, flying in a Piper PA-22 Tri-Pacer, but at $15 an hour he was unable to continue the training. His interest returned in the mid-1990s when he bought a used Gulfstream II and asked one of his pilots, Terry Bender, to give him flying lessons. They started flying a Cessna 182 out of Jackson, Wyoming. He later switched to Teterboro, New Jersey, flying a Cessna 206, the aircraft he soloed in.
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Ford owns various aircraft:

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Previous aircraft:

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrison_Ford
 
Everskyward said:
I think general aviation has a lot of faces and reading a little about Harrison Ford it seems as if he has experience with many of them. I don't understand the worry that pilots have about other people thinking they are like Harrison Ford or that they are "rich". Do other people really think that? In any case, would that be an insult?
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Most people like to think of themselves as middle class, be it a correct assessment or not. Being rich implies snobby, being poor implies inability to support one's self. In my experience, neither is necessarily correct, especially since I've known a number of rich people who can't support themselves and a number of poor people who are snobby.
 
Everskyward said:
I think general aviation has a lot of faces and reading a little about Harrison Ford it seems as if he has experience with many of them. I don't understand the worry that pilots have about other people thinking they are like Harrison Ford or that they are "rich". Do other people really think that? In any case, would that be an insult?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harrison_Ford
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The problem with being viewed as a hobby for 'rich people', is that the public then has no problem voting against it. The majority of voters will vote for anything they see that'll be better for them (even if just a little), while sticking it to the wealthy. We just had a vote in Oregon that did exactly that: the poor taxing the rich because they are rich.

Additionally, if it is viewed as a 'rich man's hobby', younger people won't join in on GA.
 
Keane said:
The problem with being viewed as a hobby for 'rich people', is that the public then has no problem voting against it. The majority of voters will vote for anything they see that'll be better for them (even if just a little), while sticking it to the wealthy. We just had a vote in Oregon that did exactly that: the poor taxing the rich because they are rich.
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I don't think people's attitude toward GA has that much to do with whether or not they are wealthy. For example there are plenty of "rich" people who will vote against an airport because of the noise issue.

Keane said:
Additionally, if it is viewed as a 'rich man's hobby', younger people won't join in on GA.
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But I think this is more of an imagined image problem. I don't think that people stay away from GA because they believe it is populated by rich men. I think that, if anything, people who are interested enough to investigate GA rightly realize that it does take money and they need to make the decision about whether it it worth it for them or not.
 
Everskyward said:
I don't think people's attitude toward GA has that much to do with whether or not they are wealthy. For example there are plenty of "rich" people who will vote against an airport because of the noise issue.

But I think this is more of an imagined image problem. I don't think that people stay away from GA because they believe it is populated by rich men. I think that, if anything, people who are interested enough to investigate GA rightly realize that it does take money and they need to make the decision about whether it it worth it for them or not.
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The recruiting problem ends up being "Flying is only for rich guys, I probably cannot afford it...". When shown the real cost numbers of a license, these people end up coming around. However, someone has to SHOW them these numbers.

After getting my license, I've recruited about 3-4 people to start training, since they now know it isn't as expensive as they once thought.
 
Keane said:
After getting my license, I've recruited about 3-4 people to start training, since they now know it isn't as expensive as they once thought.
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That's great but I wonder how it compares to the number of people who have investigated learning to fly but have been daunted by the price. On the other hand, having plenty of money and exposure to flying does not necessarily make you want to go out and learn yourself. I know many folks like that. They are content to be passengers and aren't really even very curious about the airplane.
 
Bob Bement said:
I wasn't slamming Harrison Ford. If you took the time to read what I wrote. I said about the same thing as you. I said I HAD MIXED EMOTIONS having people thing I am a Harrison Ford because I fly an airplane. I like the fact that he has several planes, a helicopter, and all of the money it takes to run them. He earned it.
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Sorry Bob, I was using the "royal" you referring to those who would criticize Ford. I wasn't referring to you personally.
 
Everskyward said:
That's great but I wonder how it compares to the number of people who have investigated learning to fly but have been daunted by the price. On the other hand, having plenty of money and exposure to flying does not necessarily make you want to go out and learn yourself. I know many folks like that. They are content to be passengers and aren't really even very curious about the airplane.
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Flying isn't for everyone. Most people want to be involved in a motor sport where they can been seen and say "Hey, look at me!" Aviation is for the most part a solitary sport, and frankly, I like my company. :lol:
 
fgcason said:
Then there's the quiet guy driving the ratty pathetic truck around, living in an old 1920's farmhouse, shopping very conservatively at walmart...with a beautiful plane in the back 40 and a 9 digit bank account because he doesn't blow money of fluff to impress the neighbors with.
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+1

Extra letters added here.
 
Another down to earth celebrity pilot that I think would make a good spokes person is Aaron Tippin. You can't get much more "country boy done good" than him. He is an avid airplane collector and spokes person for the Commemorative Air Force.
 
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Dean said:
Another down to earth celebrity pilot that I think would make a good spokes person is Aaron Tippin. You can't get much more "country boy done good" than him. He is an avid airplane collector and spokes person for the Commemorative Air Force.
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Who? :confused:

Not a big country music fan. I think that's a limited market ALTHOUGH why not have a couple celebrities in the campaign? Tippin to get the country folks, Harrison Ford, Worf from Star Trek, I'm sure there's a NASCAR driver who flies. Reach out to a variety of constituencies.
 
flyersfan31 said:
Who? :confused:

Not a big country music fan. I think that's a limited market ALTHOUGH why not have a couple celebrities in the campaign? Tippin to get the country folks, Harrison Ford, Worf from Star Trek, I'm sure there's a NASCAR driver who flies. Reach out to a variety of constituencies.
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Country = NASCAR
 
Geico266 said:
Flying isn't for everyone. Most people want to be involved in a motor sport where they can been seen and say "Hey, look at me!" Aviation is for the most part a solitary sport, and frankly, I like my company. :lol:
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+1

People can relate to car racing because most are behind the wheel every day and are surrounded by cars. I found the same analogy with motorcycle racing. In Europe motorcycle racing is very popular and/because there are many more people riding and commuting on motorbikes. Not so much in the USA.

I just started pursuing my PP-SEL last month. Most people I know and probably including myself always considered piloting to be dangerous and a rich man's hobby. Now I see that this isn't entirely true but maybe others think this way too. Ford is a plain folks kind of person. I think he could help the industry.
 
Leavitt said:
I cant belive that AOPA didn't think of this allready, its a great idea. The only thing people see out of aviation is the low income of the regonals and big biz jets that the rich use, they never see how the normal guy uses his 40yr old airplane.
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I forgot to post that AOPA *did* reply to my forwarding them this thread and the suggestion. Here was their reply (nine days ago), which I thought was balanced.

Dear Mr. Whistman,

It is indeed an interesting concept. Mr. Fuller is away from the office for a few days, so I will be sure to raise the idea with those who maintain the direct relationship with Mr. Ford.

Keep in mind, though, that both Mr. Ford and Mr. Freeman generously donate their time to help the General Aviation Serves America campaign. We try to be mindful of that and not presume too much.

In addition, the GA Serves America campaign already does a version of what you're talking about. The Harrison Ford and Morgan Freeman ads were only two of a series of ads produced. The others tell the stories of typical pilots, such as the doctor who regularly flies to Tangier Island in the Chesapeake Bay to provide medical services to the residents of the isolated island, or the family of John Deere dealers in South Dakota who grew their business by using general aviation.

Again, thanks for the interesting idea. I will make sure the GA Serves America campaign knows about the idea and has an opportunity to discuss it further.

With best regards,

Chris Dancy
Media Relations Director
AOPA
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