Talk me out of a c170

Steamflyer said:
If you find one that has been truly rebuilt (aside from structural issues) with things like new cables, hardware, pulleys, engine, paint, etc., it’s probably not for sale. Very few “turnkey” 70+ year old aircraft out there. Also depends on your standard. But needing to “rebuild” an old airplane is not at all uncommon!
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Rule of thumb, based on what I've seen: Spend half of your airplane money on buying the airplane. You might need the other half to get past that first annual.
 
Who’s flying the orange and polished? That was rebuilt in my buddy’s shop. I did a bunch of work on it. It’s a great example of a 170.
 
All those pictures are great and I love the fly dog, but that orange and polished one is beyond cool! I would love to have it except I don’t have the mental stability to maintain a polished plane.
 
Dan Thomas said:
Rule of thumb, based on what I've seen: Spend half of your airplane money on buying the airplane. You might need the other half to get past that first annual.
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I guess that’s the safe play, but it just doesn’t have to be like that. Find a good plane and due diligence in the prebuy stage.
 
MBDiagMan said:
I guess that’s the safe play, but it just doesn’t have to be like that. Find a good plane and due diligence in the prebuy stage.
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I am a Canadian AME. That's equivalent to a US A&P-IA. I have done prebuys, and most buyers wanted to pay for just a couple of hours. Might as well not do it at all. To find the defects that are dangerous and expensive, that airplane needs to be really opened up. Interior and everything right out. Every inspection cover opened. THAT'S when the real show-stoppers appear.

And the logs need examining. On every prebuy I found outstanding ADs. Don't fall for the ad that says "all ADs complied with." That's probably untrue.
 
Dan Thomas said:
I am a Canadian AME. That's equivalent to a US A&P-IA. I have done prebuys, and most buyers wanted to pay for just a couple of hours. Might as well not do it at all. To find the defects that are dangerous and expensive, that airplane needs to be really opened up. Interior and everything right out. Every inspection cover opened. THAT'S when the real show-stoppers appear.

And the logs need examining. On every prebuy I found outstanding ADs. Don't fall for the ad that says "all ADs complied with." That's probably untrue.
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Well said, and if people follow this advice, they have a high probability of ending up with a good plane. I bought my 140 from an IA about 100 miles from home. He seemed trustworthy and sincere, but I still had him fly it to my guy who took it apart as you describe and went over it thoroughly. It was the best money I could have spent. There have been a few minor things over the years, but nothing major or unexpected and significant.

Your advice applies to ANY type plane. The fact that the OP is looking at a 170 is not much different than anything else.

For years I have bought used cars based on the top three most important criteria:

1. condition
2. Condition
3. CONDITION

In the most basic sense of the matter, planes are no different.
 
Dan Thomas said:
Get a really good and thorough prebuy. 73 years is a lot of time for metal to crack and corrode. Plenty of time for shortcut maintenance. Plenty of time for a previous owner to have deferred a lot of defects. And there are plenty of SBs on those old airframes. For instance, those gear legs have a tendency to corrode on their bottom surfaces, and any pitting there raises the risk of cracking and failure immensely. And guess how many gear legs are available. New or used.

BTDT with a 170 like that. Too many shortcuts, too many "owner-maintained" things that had to be fixed or replaced because they were so dangerous.
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Witht those flamethrower comment I better dump mine quick! All those SB's I better look into,
Rgbeard said:
for those more knowledgable than me - what engine does a 170 of this age use?

If the answer is the 6-cyl 300, that's kinda another thing, no?
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Or a Continental C 145, a lot now have Lycoming 180HP
 
I have a 1954Cessna 170B, it is not that much different from a 172, not all that fast but very easy to maintain, few Ad"s and very few SB"s

Get over to the Cessna 170.org website and become a member, you will learn a lot from very experienced members of that group.
 
Pilawt said:
Love those original panels! C-170A, 1966 photo:

View attachment 114862
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yeah, it’s neat, but I really wouldn’t want to fly behind it very much. Flying with a six pack and a little more up to date avionics is more enjoyable and worthwhile for me. This is only my opinion. It’s a matter of taste. The panel really is classic and really neat though.
 
MBDiagMan said:
yeah, it’s neat, but I really wouldn’t want to fly behind it very much. Flying with a six pack and a little more up to date avionics is more enjoyable and worthwhile for me. This is only my opinion. It’s a matter of taste. The panel really is classic and really neat though.
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You can keep the piano keys and have updated avionics. I really like the capability of my 170A. It would be nice to have the radio and GPS in a center stack, but this works really well.


IMG_2315.jpg
 
Doug States said:
You can keep the piano keys and have updated avionics. I really like the capability of my 170A. It would be nice to have the radio and GPS in a center stack, but this works really well.


View attachment 114921
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This is fantastic!

The 170 panel seems like a good candidate for a GI-275 deployment. No room for a flat panel, but the multiple talents of the 275 could allow you to mimic that with 3 or 4 gauges.
 
strangebird said:
Witht those flamethrower comment I better dump mine quick! All those SB's I better look into,
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If the ignition switch has been replaced in the last 45 years, and it likely has, it is most likely an ACS switch. Mechanics faithfully keep doing the Bendix switch AD test every year and never get under the panel to confirm that it's a Bendix. There's an entirely different AD on the ACS switch. I've lost count of the times I've found log entries showing the Bendix AD was done for 30 or more years, yet a quick look under there finds that ACS switch.

There are United Instruments altimeters out there with outstanding ADs on them. There are Bendix mags with ADs outstanding. There are seat belts and shoulder harnesses with outstanding ADs.

See, the mechanic can do a computerized search on the airframe, engine and propeller, Easy. And they do that. But those searches don't get many of the appliance ADs, and they don't go looking for them either. There are dozens of possibilities there. Appliances cover everything from mags to vacuum pumps to alternators to switches to brakes and wheels and belts and harnesses and instruments and radios and carburetors and fuel pumps and much more. It can take hours to make sure that none are applicable on anything in the airplane being checked. The governments take AD compliance very seriously. An outstanding AD makes that airplane legally unairworthy. Period.

It's easy for owners to scoff. Once they become mechanics the scoffing stops.
 
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I like Steam Gauges but in a six pack. My 140 panel is the way I like it. Many folks wouldn’t like it and that’s fine. I like the 170 panel earlier in the thread. It’s gorgeous. I just prefer flying behind mine. There are all different pilots who like all different panels and this is a great thing.
 
Ed Haywood said:
I love seeing vintage aircraft kept flying. Just as long as you understand it is a labor of love, not a cheaper way to fly.
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Although I agree with this statement and went into my 140 with this approach many years ago, it has turned out to be inexpensive aviation. This was due to a thorough prebuy leading to me buying an excellent example.
 
Beautiful!


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That looks like an (enormous) empty canvas. What are your plans?
 
Once it was Polish but now it is Swedish? :p
 
2-Bit Speed said:
Once it was Polish but now it is Swedish? :p
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Actually it became more Polish thanks to the diligence of the owner who bought it about 20 years ago. He has better elbows than I do! And put back the gorgeous wheel pants. The original tips alas were never placed back and are now lost to history. C170 Polished Again.jpg
 
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