Taking The Plunge

DutchessFlier

DutchessFlier

Line Up and Wait
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DutchessFlier
So, yesterday I did it...
Walked into the flight school and signed up for the Instrument Rating.
:yikes:
Just looking for some wisdom and advice as I begin this program..your help is always appreciated

BTW one of the big motivations here is that during every flight I have taken so far, since getting my ticket, I have had to do at least one evasive maneuver for an unidentified aircraft approaching from within 1 to 2 miles from my plane, suddenly showing up on flight following, in the airspace. Getting tired of hearing 'target xx miles at xx o'clock, traveling xx heading, unidentified type, etc... I have never yet flown, except for work in the pattern or practice area, without flight following.

I guess NY area airspace will do it to ya everytime!!!:eek:

Thanks for your help!
 
You will not regret it; after you're done, you'll wonder how you ever flew without it.

Have fun!
 
Many folks think the instrument rating is the hardest pilot rating to get. But it will definitely increase the utility of your flying. The physical side isn't that hard once you get used to trusting the instruments, but the amount of stuff you need to know to plan and execute a safe flight, and the multitasking you'll do will be quite intense.

Stick with it, and be sure and ask for help!
 
Advice and wisdom? Dunno 'bout that but here are my takes after finishing the IA in June of this year.

Learn to fly with precision. Don't fly 4020', fly 4000' trimmed hands off. Maybe you do this already but it was something I had to learn. My VFR flying skills are along the lines of "let's go that-a-way and 'bout so high".:)

Remember that even the most complicated approach is merely constructed of the basic flying components of airspeed, altitude, and heading. Go ahead and spend a lot of time figuring out how to read all the details on a plate and then remember the flying fundamentals.

Once the flying is automatic (more-or-less), the three most important things are: Where do you need to be, what do you need to be doing now, and what do you need to be doing next. Ok, that is adapted from Machado so he gets some credit in this. He limits it to the two most important things of now and next.

Remember that ATC will forget you just when you need them the most.

Weather. Not a lot of time was spent on weather by either my CFII or during the oral. I think that is an oversight. From a practical point of view dealing with current and forecast weather is the real problem with IMC flight. Of course out here in the west a lot of the IMC isn't flyable because of embedded thunderstorms or potential icing conditions. Developing my weather tactics and strategy seems to be the most challenging part of IMC flying. I've learned that talking to a briefer is good but there is absolutely no substitute for building a good mental picture of the expected weather and having a plan for dealing with it. XM weather is nice but ya gotta have the information background to use it in flight. Calling flightwatch for a pirep and an update is a good thing.
 
Clark1961 said:
Learn to fly with precision. Don't fly 4020', fly 4000' trimmed hands off. Maybe you do this already but it was something I had to learn. My VFR flying skills are along the lines of "let's go that-a-way and 'bout so high".:)
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Agreed. Although engineers are known to be precise, I found my flying became even more so with the instrument rating.
 
By coincidence, I did the same thing yesterday. It's many years overdue for me, I've been studying for the knowledge test on and off since '05 but one thing or another (first insurance issues, then airplane availability, medical issues and money) has kept me from getting really serious until now. I've scrubbed more flights than I can count, been grounded for weeks by perpetual stratocu off of our lovely lakes. The final straw was a 200 foot altitude excursion yesterday while talking to FSS about a lost flight plan. I started to look for my flight plan template in case I needed it, tensed up and pulled on the yoke a little bit, and presto! Hey, now stop that, the plane is trimmed for straight and level! I've been trying hard to fly right on the numbers so a flub like that really put me in my place.

Good luck with the training! I wonder which of us will finish first? (Well who cares, it's not a race!)
 
SCCutler said:
You will not regret it; after you're done, you'll wonder how you ever flew without it.

Have fun!
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Well said, the only down side is you do forget what its like to look outside the window for a bit but that comes back,
 
DutchessFlier said:
BTW one of the big motivations here is that during every flight I have taken so far, since getting my ticket, I have had to do at least one evasive maneuver for an unidentified aircraft approaching from within 1 to 2 miles from my plane, suddenly showing up on flight following, in the airspace. Getting tired of hearing 'target xx miles at xx o'clock, traveling xx heading, unidentified type, etc...
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Full disclosure: Getting your instrument rating and flying IFR will not change this one bit. :no: You are still 100% responsible for see and avoid when you're not in a cloud.

One very common misconception among newer pilots is that ATC separates IFR from VFR traffic. This is NOT the case - ATC separates IFR traffic from IFR traffic, period. Anything else - Flight following, pointing out VFR's to IFR's, etc is "workload permitting."

Clark1961 said:
Learn to fly with precision. Don't fly 4020', fly 4000' trimmed hands off. Maybe you do this already but it was something I had to learn.
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+1000. I didn't really get that at first, but once I developed a "zero tolerance" policy, I got a lot more accurate.

However, don't be in a hurry to correct things. You'll need to be patient and observe *trends* rather than *states*. If you're a dot right on the localizer... WAIT. See if you're going away from or toward the course. If you're already going toward the course and you make a "correction" because you're not ON the course, you'll end up blowing right through it.
 
I would say try to cram as many lessons into a short period of time as possible (that you are comfortable with). Agree on the lesson plan with you instructor ahead of time to measure progress and stick to it. I realize that might be hard to get some good IR WX in NY during the winter..!

Good luck!
 
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DutchessFlier said:
So, yesterday I did it...
Walked into the flight school and signed up for the Instrument Rating.
:yikes:
Just looking for some wisdom and advice as I begin this program..your help is always appreciated
Click to expand...

Random tips:

Don't forget to go flying for fun. When I did my IR all of my flying time was training under the hood, and by the time I finished I was pretty sick of the inside of a plane (well, a few times I nearly got sick in the plane -- you may have to learn how to calm your tummy down again without outside visual references). I almost forgot how beautiful it was to fly around and look outside.

Make sure you fully understand every bit of notation on the approach plates before flying your first approach. (Aka, do ground school first, flying later) I wasted too much time (and money) being confused about what the various symbols meant as I flew.

Get a _comfortable_ hood or set of foggles. My hood pinched my temples a bit, and by the end of a flight I would have a splitting headache. Eventually I bought a hood which was just a loop of wire with a cloth ring and two curtains on the side. Really stupid looking, but it was comfortable and it worked for me.

Get your instructor to take you out for lessons in as many actual IMC days as you can get, day and night. You want your first experiences to be with an instructor, plus those will be your coolest and most memorable lessons. The coolest approach I have done so far was just breaking out at minimums on the KMRY ILS at night...

Be confident the plane you are flying works well. I flew a few lessons in an older 172 which was sort of wonky. I was not happy to discover that the HSI compass card was getting jammed while flying in IMC at night. At least this gave me practice (whether I needed it or not) in navigating by compass... (After that experience I switched planes.)

Chris
 
Enjoy it. I considered the rating a lot of fun. The training, oral, and checkride was rather easy. The written mostly just annoyed me.
 
As always you all are great!!! You know I will keep you all posted and ask alot of questions and share my experiences here.
Liz: you are right..it's not a race but sure is awesome that we signed up on the same day...when we both are done, lets meet halfway...you pick the place!
Multi: My instructor said precisely the same thing about IFR-VFR when we talked about the traffic in the airspace. BTW I signed on with my instructor who did the private with me. He kicked my ass on many occasions, held me to a very high standard in all phases of the training...helped me become a very very precise, and aware pilot...especially when it came to holding altitudes and headings, even during my PP maneuvers, and thinking ahead one or two steps in the plane.
Chris: I have the great fortune to be doing this in my plane (71D) which I have flown since April..I know how she flies, the quirks and the touch pretty well...which should help. Haven't yet solved the foggles thing over my glasses...and my instructor insists on doing most of the flying in IMC...if we can avoid the icing issues this fall and winter!
 
Another good tip is to get the written out of the way as soon as possible. It will be an anchor until you're done. But once you clear this minor obstacle you'll have a great feeling of accomplishment and progress.
 
Have fun with it. Try to make sure when you do practice runs that you actually fly somewhere. Doesn't have to be that far, but only doing the approaches available your home drone and the next airport over may give you a lot of practice with stuff that you're going to use the most (at least in theory - I haven't done the ILS27 into Williamsport for real very much), but it doesn't help you for the practical scenario of taking a trip to someplace you've never been and then shooting an approach that you've never shot before. You want the approach plates to continue to be new and different through your training, rather than just memorizing a few plates that you can do in your sleep.

The rating itself is not difficult, nor is instrument flying once you get used to it. It is the most useful rating that you'll ever get. Sure, my multi is great, but if I was restricted to VFR only I'd be prohibited from putting the plane to its greatest uses.

Get as much actual as you can during training, and use the rating as much as you can once you get it. This is going to be difficult for you on the training bit since we're coming up on winter, and I doubt the 172s you're training in have FIKI. ;)

Seriously, though, getting actual is very important. I'm at the point where I'm just as comfortable flying in IMC as I am in VMC. You want to get there. The first few times you go into actual after training for real your heart rate will increase some, then it will become natural. The natural is what you want. That keeps your mind sharp so you can focus on the important tasks at hand.

Train both with and without the autopilot, but mostly without. Know how to use it and its full capabilities. Then, when you're starting to fly for real, use it as appropriate, but make sure you can handle flying without it. In my Aztec, the autopilot is still down (hopefully going to get fixed before long here) and so I've been doing a lot of single pilot IFR without an autopilot. It's been a good workout and good for me to do, now it's pretty much just natural, but I'll be happy when I'll have it to use, especially on these long trips that I do frequently. Hand flying 11 hours in a day gets old fast.

Have fun with it! Since you're close by, maybe you can tag along on one of the trips I make. It'd be some good experience for you.
 
Dutchess: It's a deal. Though halfway between us is probably, what, somewhere in Ontario? Maybe somewhere in NE PA. Also, I hope your CFII meets your insurance's OPW, or that your policy allows flight training. Our policy in the Cardinal made any kind of flight training very difficult unless the II met the OPW. My instructor of choice didn't. :(

Ted, as far as getting as much actual as possible, right that's probably not going to work out too well in either NY or MI in the winter, but isn't night with foggles the next best thing? As far as I'm concerned, in much of MI night is nearly IMC by itself. I've been looking forward to the early darkness for that reason. That, plus the club planes will be more available. :yesnod:
 
Next best thing, sure, but there's something about knowing that you can take the foggles off and be back to normal (whatever that is) that makes training with foggles different from reality. Once you're in a cloud for real, you've gotta keep the plane upright until you're out of it.

Obviously it will be difficult to get actual for the next few months for IFR training, that was just a general statement.
 
Pick an instructor that has actually flown IFR in the system, not one who has never been on an IFR trip besides the dual given under the hood for the rating. The more experience he/she has, the better prepared you will be after the checkride.
 
Clark1961 said:
Advice and wisdom? Learn to fly with precision. Don't fly 4020', fly 4000' trimmed hands off. ".:)


I would modify this recommendation a bit. True, don't fly at 4020' But flying at 4020 while decending at 10 ft/min is ok. In other words if it getting better you don't need to fix it right away. Just remember to stop the descent at 4000' when you get there, but then you won't miss it by much by while descending at only 10ft/min.


Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
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Flying with a hood AT NIGHT is as close as I've come to actual. But even then, you don't get the weird sounds and feel that you get in IMC.
 
Folks, IMC in winter does not automatically equal icing, and the opposite is true as well. In fact, I'm pretty sure that the month I have the most actual in is December. I've had three inadvertent icing encounters - November, March, and August. Learn the icing products well, and don't be afraid to go into actual in the winter provided there is no icing forecast and you have outs if you encounter it. :yes:
 
I will be the first one to say I hated it and didn't finish. I had no problem with the flying or approaches, but it made me sick. I could only do about 45 minutes to an hour of fly before I would get a headache from hell and have to stop. My instructor told me that it is not that uncommon for this to happen and that if I flew with another pilot in IMC, I might get use to it. But I fly for fun and not as a means of transportation, so it wasn't that important to me. Its not motion sickness either, I can do Acro flying all day long with no issues. If I was guessing, I would say it was nerves.

So good luck and have fun.
 
18Right said:
Another good tip is to get the written out of the way as soon as possible. It will be an anchor until you're done. But once you clear this minor obstacle you'll have a great feeling of accomplishment and progress.
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Yup! I waited until the last two weeks before my checkride!:mad2:
Went to a Aviation Seminars http://www.aviationseminars.com/ weekend course and knocked it out.

What amazed me more was the amount of worthless info. on the IFR written. I can only conclude it's a "right of passage" toward the rating...
 
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DutchessFlier said:
So, yesterday I did it...
Walked into the flight school and signed up for the Instrument Rating.
:yikes:
Just looking for some wisdom and advice as I begin this program..your help is always appreciated

[snip]

Thanks for your help!
Click to expand...

Don't let the CFII start you off with approaches. You didn't start your Private Pilot learning landings (i hope). Learn HOW to push the plane around on instruments. THEN, learn WHERE to push the plane around.
 
Your instructor should have a syllabus. Pretty much every syllabus I've ever seen concentrates on the basics (instrument cross-check is first, then instrument interpretation, then basic attitude instrument flying) and THEN once you know how to make the airplane do what you want, you go through stages focusing on the departure, enroute, and approach phases.

Now, for my first instrument flight, we went up in actual and did what was essentially the IMC equivalent of an "intro flight". It was a good demo of "yes, this stuff really works and you CAN fly in the clouds".
 
i will only add one thing, something i've told all my students over the years. even if you don't finish the rating, get the training and stay current on the gages. because if you need it once,and don't have it, you will only need it once! GOOD FOR YOU!!
cfiiguy
 
Crash7, TIM: Yes, we are following the syllabus outlined in the Jepp series in the 141 program. I decided to go with this since I can use alot of time in the Frasca for my sim work. The syllabus is structured and from what I see, we do the basics first and don't get to approach work, etc. until phase 2. But we will go into IMC if possible, as much as we can.
 
You'll like the Jepp syllabus - it's what I used, and if you fly frequently you'll have no problem getting competent in the time programmed.
 
Well...I promised I would be on here alot with questions and such. Since the WX sucks so bad today, I decided to open the textbook and start reading...gonna fly 2x this week and its all gonna be attitude work under the hood, the usual: turns maneuvers, climbs, airspeed and pitch/power control. The text details 2 theories, which I am sure you all know in detail: Control and Performance Concepts and Primary/Support Concepts.
Am I correct to think that they are not exclusive and should be used together? Alot of what I am reading seems logical and builds on what I have already been doing VFR (ie cross checking, scan technique, trends and inputs)..and when I was under the hood for my PPL.
 
It's important to know both. I tend to fly control/performance, BUT when in a partial panel situation, primary/supporting is useful, as it doesn't rely on gyro instruments for most situations.
 
TMetzinger said:
It's important to know both. I tend to fly control/performance, BUT when in a partial panel situation, primary/supporting is useful, as it doesn't rely on gyro instruments for most situations.
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Sounds to me like you're thinking too hard! :yikes:

I like the control-performance way of thinking, but you have to learn primary-secondary so that you can answer the written questions that go like "If your attitude indicator is inoperative, it's Tuesday, and there are two outs and a runner on third, what instrument is primary for stupidity?"

However, in the airplane, look at the instrument that tells you what you need to know and then cross-check with other instruments that tell you whether that instrument is working properly. Don't over-think it, there's plenty of thinking to be done already!
 
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