Tablesaw safety device - very impressive

Absolutely Amazing !

With such a device, I might reconsider carpentry as a hobby...

:D
 
first time ive seen some gutsy enough to actually put their finger in one. seen several of the hot dog demos
 
Very Impressive!! find a solution to a problem and make lots of money! I can see a company like Black & Decker buying the rights to this.
 
I note that he put his hand in water to begin with. One has to wonder exactly how 'conductive' you have to be for it to work...
 
wbarnhill said:
I note that he put his hand in water to begin with. One has to wonder exactly how 'conductive' you have to be for it to work...
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I doubt he wished to take any chances. Either way, once you break the skin it'll be plenty wet!
 
As someone who has known close contact with a blade, I like this product. I'd certainly rather have it make a small tear in my skin rather than shred right on through. I'll have to see if this unit can be retrofit onto my saw.
 
I wish this guy all the success in the world.

But I have to wonder if this could lead to operator complacency, leading to more injuries on saws not equipped with this device.
 
My friend's dad has one of these. It's pretty amazing. He says you have to be careful cutting wood with any moisture in it, that will trigger it too. He has never "tested" his but he has had two go by themselves. Pretty awesome.
 
EppyGA said:
Seems that the dude is a lawyer also and tried to get his device made mandatory on saws. Nice way to get your gizmo sold. :rolleyes:
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I think the claims in the lawsuits are along the lines of "You are the saw manufacturer, you knew there was a safety device out there, you chose not to install it, now my client has lost a finger."

I've seen the hot-dog video a number of times in the past. I knew you had to replace the brake-cartridge (something like $60-$70) after each trip, but didn't know that you also had to replace the blade, too. Apparently it stops the blade so quickly that the teeth, especially carbide teeth, can be damaged.
 
Matthew said:
I think the claims in the lawsuits are along the lines of "You are the saw manufacturer, you knew there was a safety device out there, you chose not to install it, now my client has lost a finger."

I've seen the hot-dog video a number of times in the past. I knew you had to replace the brake-cartridge (something like $60-$70) after each trip, but didn't know that you also had to replace the blade, too. Apparently it stops the blade so quickly that the teeth, especially carbide teeth, can be damaged.
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How long until some bozo trips the saw stop, and since he's in a hurry, creatively bypasses the expended saw stop and then whacks a finger off?
 
Trapper John said:
How long until some bozo trips the saw stop, and since he's in a hurry, creatively bypasses the expended saw stop and then whacks a finger off?
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I'm sure it's happened already (the bypass, at least). First time it slows up production it'll be bypassed.
I used to work in a shop that had the old clear plastic blade guard on the table saw... very annoying to use (and actually increased risk of binding and kickback, IMHO), so it was only installed when the inspector or somebody was expected.
There's really no replacement for plain ol' good sense: don't stand right behind the piece, never try to back it up, use an outfeed table or experienced catcher, have a kerf wedge handy, use a push stick when necessary, and never rip anything "freehand" without a fence or sled.
 
Trapper John said:
I wish this guy all the success in the world.

But I have to wonder if this could lead to operator complacency, leading to more injuries on saws not equipped with this device.
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Yeah the next thing you know they will comeout with Airplanes that have parachutes and pilots will think they won't have to be as through and precise when flying:D
 
I know an aerobatic pilot that once was a top-notch cardio-thoracic surgeon that is now a hospital director due to a table saw accident. I have to admit that when I originally saw that on the Time Warp episode, it skeeved me out to watch him put his own finger in there - nothing's that perfect.
 
Talk about irony...

I received this link yesterday and posted it this morning.

A few minutes ago, I got a call from my brother. My elderly father, who was a cabinetmaker most of his life until he took a full-time job with the union right before he retired, just cut off his thumb and part of one finger using a table saw in his basement. He lives in Upstate New York, but they're airlifting him (I think; could be an ambulance trip, though) to Westchester Medical Center. So I guess they think there's a chance they can reattach the fingers.

I'm gonna be heading up there in a bit.

-Rich
 
Well I'm here and he isn't. I guess they're taking him by ground. This hospital is huge. They're supposed to be experts at this sort of thing.

-Rich
 
Thanks. Waiting for surgeon now. Resident says chances for thumb are good, for the index finger not so much. At least it's his non-dominant hand.

-Rich
 
Well, he lost the index finger, as they predicted. It wasn't just that the time between the amputation and the surgery was too long (more than nine hours). The wound itself was such that it just didn't lend itself to reattachment.

As for the thumb, they reattached it for the time being, but they say it may still have to be removed. Time will tell. It wasn't fully amputated and he did have distal feeling, but I think they're concerned about the bone.

Anyway, I'm home now. Once I knew Dad came through surgery okay, I decided to come home and get a few hours sleep. The hospital's only about 40 minutes away, and two of my brothers are there now, as well as my mother and my youngest brother's girlfriend. Another brother will arrive tomorrow morning, so I guess I'll relieve him tomorrow afternoon.

My mother, stubborn as always, insists on staying at the hospital until Dad's discharged. I could put her up, as could my brother in Connecticut (who actually lives even closer to the hospital than I do), but she'll have no part of it.

I was very impressed with Westchester County Medical Center, by the way. They really seem to have their act together. Appears to be a top-notch place. The ER nurse, who identified herself only as Lisa, was phenomenal in every way; and the surgeon, Dr. Richard Magill, is apparently one of the very best in his specialty.

I'm still a bit freaked that I started this thread about tablesaw safety on the very day that dad had the accident. Especially because he managed to keep all his fingers for 50 years as a cabinetmaker, which is a pretty major accomplishment in that business.

Again, thanks again to all who expressed your well-wishes.

-Rich
 
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So sorry for your dad and your family.

I have noticed that many of the tablesaw accidents are in precisely that group, older guys tinkering at home. While there are the occasional workmans comp cases, the companies these days seem to be quite concerned about using safeties, pushers etc.

Weird coincidence about your post and the accident, but that's all it is.

Westchester is a good hospital, lots of excellent specialty services.
 
Glad to hear that the surgery went as well as can be expected. Will certainly be thinking about you and your family as your Dad heals. Hope you keep us up to date.
 
Sorry things are the way they are for your father, Rich. Will keep all of you in my thoughts and prayers.
 
hey just sue the saw manufacturer for not providing a retrofit Saw Stop! Medical Bills vanish.

Seriously, hope he ends up OK.
 
Thanks again for all the well-wishes, everyone. I passed them on to Dad.

I got a better explanation of his situation today. They didn't bother trying to re-attach the index finger because the repair would have had to be to two knuckles, and apparently there's a pretty low success rate for that type of repair.

As for the thumb, the surgeon did all the soft tissue repairs but he's not sure they'll take. If they do, Dad will be scheduled for a bone graft to make the thumb functional. If not, then they'll have to remove it. I'm pretty optimistic because he did have sensation.

Dad's actually on his way home now. He's in pain, of course, but in good spirits, all things considered. He's pretty much an existentialist. He's survived cancer and a heart attack, among other things, and tends to take an "it is what it is" approach to life.

They kept him in the hospital until they found a painkiller that worked for him without crashing his BP like the morphine did last night while I was there. They finally settled on Percocet and sent him home.

My youngest brother is driving Dad and Mom back upstate. I was going to do it, but I think my brother needs to. I'll probably go tomorrow afternoon.

Again, thanks to everyone for your expressions of concern and well-wishes.

-Rich
 
belated, but hope the recovery goes well...
 
Our prayers for your dad will continue, Rich - long past this thread's end.
 
RJM62 said:
Thanks again for all the well-wishes, everyone. I passed them on to Dad.

I got a better explanation of his situation today. They didn't bother trying to re-attach the index finger because the repair would have had to be to two knuckles, and apparently there's a pretty low success rate for that type of repair.

As for the thumb, the surgeon did all the soft tissue repairs but he's not sure they'll take. If they do, Dad will be scheduled for a bone graft to make the thumb functional. If not, then they'll have to remove it. I'm pretty optimistic because he did have sensation.

Dad's actually on his way home now. He's in pain, of course, but in good spirits, all things considered. He's pretty much an existentialist. He's survived cancer and a heart attack, among other things, and tends to take an "it is what it is" approach to life.

They kept him in the hospital until they found a painkiller that worked for him without crashing his BP like the morphine did last night while I was there. They finally settled on Percocet and sent him home.

My youngest brother is driving Dad and Mom back upstate. I was going to do it, but I think my brother needs to. I'll probably go tomorrow afternoon.

Again, thanks to everyone for your expressions of concern and well-wishes.

-Rich
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Ok. Just hang in there. If he can survive cancer, he can handle purd-near anything.
 
Thanks. He's feeling quite a bit bet better today. He's a tough old coot.
 
RJM62 said:
Thanks. He's feeling quite a bit bet better today. He's a tough old coot.
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Did he finish the piece he was working on yet ?

(I remember a table-saw accident that hit our ER twice in one weekend. After taking a piece of his thumb and being unable to complete what he had set out to do, he decided that he should use the downtime to put up a deerstand.)
 
weilke said:
Did he finish the piece he was working on yet ?

(I remember a table-saw accident that hit our ER twice in one weekend. After taking a piece of his thumb and being unable to complete what he had set out to do, he decided that he should use the downtime to put up a deerstand.)
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No, he's actually behaving himself. The project he was working on was essentially finished, actually. It's hard to explain, but I think I know exactly what he was doing. I've done it myself, actually.

Basically, my understanding is that he was user the tablesaw instead of a router to create a gap between the the base of a cabinet and the floor. The base sits on the floor only where the vertical supports are attached. In between, there's a gap of about half an inch or so between the base and the floor. This is in case the floor is not exactly even. It insures that the vertical supports are bearing the load. It's basically a big notch.

The preferred way to do this is with a router, which he does have. But it can also be done on a tablesaw. You crosscut the ends of the notch with the piece held vertically, and then set the rip fence to the height of the piece less the depth of the notch, raise the blade, and lower the piece onto the blade. Then you push it back and forth until it reaches the ends of the notch.

This isn't the safest way to do it, but production cabinetmakers do it all the time. I even did it myself as a youngster when I worked with dad from time to time.

The problem in this case was that the blade hit a knot or a bullet, and threw the piece backwards. He was holding the wood in front with his left hand, so when the piece shot back, the resistance disappeared, and he basically pulled his thumb and finger through the blade.

The surgeon told him don't even try to lift a piece of paper with his thumb. The paramedics did a good job positioning it to maintain some sort of blood supply, and it was still partially attached, so there's a decent chance that the soft tissues will heal. Then they can do a bone graft on the distal part of the thumb. But there's a lot of fancy stitching in there, and the doc doesn't want him pulling the stitches out.

He's also lucky to live in a community where people truly care about each other. It's a very rural area -- not quite the end of the world, but you can see it from there -- yet the ambulance was there within five minutes. The house has been full of people, all volunteering to help do everything from pick up his morning paper (the nearest store is, I think, 15 miles away, and he refuses to read the news on the Internet), to chores around the property.

Nonetheless, my dad is a man who worked with his hands all his life, so I'm sure there's more sadness than he lets on. Being a cabinetmaker is a big part of who he is, and frankly, I fully expect that he'll eventually get back on that saw, one way or the other. But he's not an idiot. He knows enough to give that thumb every possible chance to heal.

As for me, On Monday I'm going to check into whether it's possible to retrofit a tablesaw with that stop device. I doubt it; it looks like it's pretty much integrated into the design. But it's worth looking in to.

-Rich
 
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Good luck to your dad, and yes, he is very lucky to have gone so long without losing a digit... it can happen, even when you're not doing anything really stupid (and he wasn't).
 
RJM62 said:
As for me, On Monday I'm going to check into whether it's possible to retrofit a tablesaw with that stop device. I doubt it; it looks like it's pretty much integrated into the design. But it's worth looking in to.
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When I last looked at SawStop products, they sold a cabinetmaker's saw and a contractor's saw -- and no retrofit kits. So yes, worth looking into, but I think you may be stuck with buying a new tool.

Chris
 
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