STC and manuals go where?

[mikea]

I was digging through the flight manual folder in my plane just now. I noticed that my A&Ps had added 337s and some of the datasheets to the folder which is making it kind of thick.

I have the STC for the Concorde battery on the second page of the whole datasheets, installation guide. I have another one, marked "Owner must keep" for the JPI Engine analyzer. The JPI one is the installation manual.

What I'd like to know is which ones have to stay in the plane, and what can go with the aircraft logs or other paperwork.

My guess: Any supplemental pilot instruction manuals have to go in the POH, which is my case is a 25 page booklet. I'll put those inside or nearby.

Do the STC papers have to go along with the type certificate? I don't think I'm even required to carry the TC. Mine just happens to be in the same folder as the weight and balance and the airworthiness certificate.

If I can I'll move that stack of paper to the same case as the aircraft logs.

YEAHIKNOW, AROW, the Airworthiness certificate, Owners manual, Weight and Balance HAS to remain in the aircraft.

There ain't no T (for Type or STC) in that. There's no requirement for 337s or installation guides...

I'd appreciate any advice.

 

[Henning]

I was digging through the flight manual folder in my plane just now. I noticed that my A&Ps had added 337s and some of the datasheets to the folder which is making it kind of thick.

I have the STC for the Concorde battery on the second page of the whole datasheets, installation guide. I have another one, marked "Owner must keep" for the JPI Engine analyzer. The JPI one is the installation manual.

What I'd like to know is which ones have to stay in the plane, and what can go with the aircraft logs or other paperwork.

My guess: Any supplemental pilot instruction manuals have to go in the POH, which is my case is a 25 page booklet. I'll put those inside or nearby.

Do the STC papers have to go along with the type certificate? I don't think I'm even required to carry the TC. Mine just happens to be in the same folder as the weight and balance and the airworthiness certificate.

If I can I'll move that stack of paper to the same case as the aircraft logs.

YEAHIKNOW, AROW, the Airworthiness certificate, Owners manual, Weight and Balance HAS to remain in the aircraft.

There ain't no T (for Type or STC) in that. There's no requirement for 337s or installation guides...

I'd appreciate any advice.

Depending on the mod, there may be a sheet that comes with the paperwork that is an ammendment sheet for the POH/AFM. Other than that, all the rest of the records I'd stow with the logs, in my case that's generally in a bag or case in the back of the plane.

 

[gismo]

Depending on the mod, there may be a sheet that comes with the paperwork that is an ammendment sheet for the POH/AFM. Other than that, all the rest of the records I'd stow with the logs, in my case that's generally in a bag or case in the back of the plane.

I don't like keeping the logs in the plane. For one thing, if someone steals the plane I'd rather they not get logs with it. And if there's ever an accident where the plane burns I'd rather have the logs available to prove it was airworthy from a maintenance perspective.

I have a couple "project folders" that have bend over tabs to hold 3-hole punched paper. One has all the 337's, equipment lists, and W&B updates. The other has all the STC paperwork. They stay with the logs.

 

[sere]

I keep mine all together at home with the logs too.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

I keep all the stuff a pilot would need to know about in a 1&1/2" three-ring binder in the airplane.

The stuff someone might need to know to work on (instructions for continued airworthiness) or install/remove/repair a component is in a (huge) zippered three-ring binder, sorted chronologically.
There is a section in this binder which is where the STCs and 337s go.
I do carry this one (plus the parts/svc manuals) on long trips in case I need to do repairs far from home.

 

[Henning]

I don't like keeping the logs in the plane. For one thing, if someone steals the plane I'd rather they not get logs with it. And if there's ever an accident where the plane burns I'd rather have the logs available to prove it was airworthy from a maintenance perspective.

I have a couple "project folders" that have bend over tabs to hold 3-hole punched paper. One has all the 337's, equipment lists, and W&B updates. The other has all the STC paperwork. They stay with the logs.

I wish it were so simple. When you travel a good deal, extended travel, with your own airplane, you need to have the logs with you or you'll have to deal with too many delays and expenses shipping them around, and I'd much rather trust those documents myself than to USPS or Fed Ex or UPS or... just too many lost items over the years. I prefer to keep the origionals with me, and send photocopies/scans of them home to keep a secure set of records.

 

[EdFred]

I wish it were so simple. When you travel a good deal, extended travel, with your own airplane, you need to have the logs with you or you'll have to deal with too many delays and expenses shipping them around, and I'd much rather trust those documents myself than to USPS or Fed Ex or UPS or... just too many lost items over the years. I prefer to keep the origionals with me, and send photocopies/scans of them home to keep a secure set of records.

Of course, if you had to ship them via UPS or FedEx, you could just insure them for....oh....double the value of the hit you'd take on the plane if the logs came up missing.

 

[Carol]

I keep all the stuff a pilot would need to know about in a 1&1/2" three-ring binder in the airplane.

The stuff someone might need to know to work on (instructions for continued airworthiness) or install/remove/repair a component is in a (huge) zippered three-ring binder, sorted chronologically.
There is a section in this binder which is where the STCs and 337s go.
I do carry this one (plus the parts/svc manuals) on long trips in case I need to do repairs far from home.

I keep the POH (a bound publication) and a binder with copies of all the 337s, STCs, current W&B in it. Originals are at home in the logs.

I also have the home mechanic's phone numbers (work, home, cell) programmed into my cellphone and permission to call him at any time from anywhere if a mechanic has a question about the airplane. Yes, I have called.

I keep a file-folder-bag with the radio license, customs information, etc. The POH is within arm's reach of the pilot.

 

[Henning]

Of course, if you had to ship them via UPS or FedEx, you could just insure them for....oh....double the value of the hit you'd take on the plane if the logs came up missing.

You could, but then you'd also have to add in the cost of replacing the logs as well, and that can get pretty expensive on some aircraft with lots of ADs, especially the ones where you have to tear down the engine(s).

 

[Stache]

The only documents that are required to be in the aircraft during 91 operation are:

• Airworthiness certificate
• Registration
• Current weight and Balance
• Flight manual if required POH/AFM or for old aircraft specifications

FAA Forms 337’s do not have to be in the aircraft, however if a 337 form has a flight manual supplement imbedded in it then the supplement becomes part of the flight manual and is required to be on board as it is a limitation.


You do not have to carry your maintennace records with you during operation. This includes FAA Form 337's. 337's are part of the type design now just and ammed the T/C.
Stache

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

The only documents that are required to be in the aircraft during 91 operation are

I think I read something about carrying paperwork for an STC/337 for aux tanks if you are near the border? I was told to, and carried mine for that 150 I had.
also the equipment list.

 

[Dave Siciliano]

Seems you're getting great advise. The POH, of course, has to be in the aircraft along with any supplements. As for 337s and other logs, I scan mine and make a copy available to my mechanic. (There is a place on line you can keep them so you can give access when traveling.) My original logs are at home in a fire resistant locker. Losing these can substantially affect the value of your aircraft. When maintenance is performed, I ask for signed stickers which I place in the log. Then scan the new page to update that file.

It's kind of crazy to get an STC for the Concorde battery replacement. I automatically replace my Gill myself every two years. Concorde didn't have an STC for my Bonanza last I checked.


Best,

Dave

 

[Stache]

Just as a recommendation. If you plan to fly south or north of our borders take a copy of any STC or 337 for extended fuel tanks. And make sure your N-number are 12-inches tall of the border Fed's will grill you alive.

Make sure you do not have a Tee fitting in the fuel system such as the ones installed for over weight and over water unless you have a 337 on oboard to cover it.

Stache

 

[gismo]

I wish it were so simple. When you travel a good deal, extended travel, with your own airplane, you need to have the logs with you or you'll have to deal with too many delays and expenses shipping them around.

Why? Are you talking about travel outside the US? I've never had any problem getting maintenance done away from home without the logs. I just have the shop print up a sticker to insert when I get home.

 

[Let'sgoflying!]

Just as a recommendation. If you plan to fly south or north of our borders take a copy of any STC or 337 for extended fuel tanks.

there it is:
91.203
No person may operate an aircraft with a fuel tank installed within the passenger compartment or a baggage compartment unless the installation was accomplished pursuant to part 43 of this chapter, and a copy of FAA Form 337 authorizing that installation is on board the aircraft.

 

[Henning]

Why? Are you talking about travel outside the US? I've never had any problem getting maintenance done away from home without the logs. I just have the shop print up a sticker to insert when I get home.

That's just it, there have been periods in my life that have occupied years where I had no "home". Everything I owned would pack into my plane, and yes many situations take me out of the country. The closest thing to home was my mom and dads, and that's where I'd send copies and store important docs that I didn't need with me.

 

[gismo]

That's just it, there have been periods in my life that have occupied years where I had no "home". Everything I owned would pack into my plane, and yes many situations take me out of the country. The closest thing to home was my mom and dads, and that's where I'd send copies and store important docs that I didn't need with me.

Well then, your logs were "at home" as "home" was wherever you were at the time.

 

[poadeleted20]

Just as a recommendation. If you plan to fly south or north of our borders take a copy of any STC or 337 for extended fuel tanks.

That's not just a recommendation, and it applies south of the northern border and north of the southern border as well as when crossing the border. Reference 14 CFR 91.417(d): "When a fuel tank is installed within the passenger compartment or a baggage compartment pursuant to part 43 of this chapter, a copy of FAA Form 337 shall be kept on board the modified aircraft by the owner or operator." Note that there are no geographic limits to this rule -- it applies for intrastate flight in Kansas as much as for a flight from Bogota, Columbia, to Miami FL.

And make sure your N-number are 12-inches tall of the border Fed's will grill you alive.

If you have an experimental or over-30-y/o plane with 2-inch N-numbers, you don't have to repaint the plane just to see the Argos play the TigerCats -- you can tape on temporary 12-inchers for your cross-border travels. Reference 14 CFR 45.29(h).

Make sure you do not have a Tee fitting in the fuel system such as the ones installed for over weight and over water unless you have a 337 on oboard to cover it.

Good advice both inside the USA and crossing the borders.