SkyVector now shows stadium TFRs!

[MachFly]

Not sure when they started doing that, but for anyone who doesn't yet know...now you do.

 

[acrophile]

That's very helpful! I wish the FAA would do its job by showing them, too.

 

[Scott@KTYR]

If you want to see some TFR's look at Texas today!!!

 

[Clark1961]

That's very helpful! I wish the FAA would do its job by showing them, too.

The task of compiling schedules and publishing relevant TFRs is too tough for any government employee or team of employees or even a government contractor. It would take millions of dollars and years to accomplish such a Herculean task. See how many years it took for Skyvector to do it?

(tongue firmly in cheek for the humor impaired)

 

[RV10flyer]

I see them on FF occasionally. I entered all stadiums under user waypoints and turn that on to check my route of flight if flying below 3000' AGL and also at my destination.

 

[EdFred]

How many MLB stadiums are not in or very very near a B/C/D surface area that you have to even worry about it? Especially since the TFR "goes away" if you are squawking and talking.

 

[ChrisK]

I see them on FF occasionally. I entered all stadiums under user waypoints and turn that on to check my route of flight if flying below 3000' AGL and also at my destination.

Hey - that's a pretty good idea! In fact, I stole this idea and used:

https://www.aopa.org/Flight-Planning/Tfrs/Stadiums-and-Speedways.aspx

and followed the instructions at

http://www.foreflight.com/support/user-waypoints

to import the waypoints in the attached file into Foreflight.

(Updated with Kentucky Speedway and Memphis Motorsports Park with data from EdFred below)

 

[EdFred]

Hey - that's a pretty good idea! In fact, I stole this idea and used:

https://www.aopa.org/Flight-Planning/Tfrs/Stadiums-and-Speedways.aspx

and followed the instructions at

http://www.foreflight.com/support/user-waypoints

to import the waypoints in the attached file into Foreflight. Note - I'm missing the Kentucky Speedway and the Memphis Motorsports Park because AOPA has them as "uncharted". If someone wants to contribute the lat/long for these, I will update this post.

Memphis: 35°16′58″N 89°56′51″W

Kentucky: 38.70964°N 84.91624°W

15 seconds on Wikipedia.

 

[flightwriter]

I find it mildly humorous that they include teams playing and game time in the description.

 

[RV10flyer]

Hey - that's a pretty good idea! In fact, I stole this idea and used:

https://www.aopa.org/Flight-Planning/Tfrs/Stadiums-and-Speedways.aspx

and followed the instructions at

http://www.foreflight.com/support/user-waypoints

to import the waypoints in the attached file into Foreflight. Note - I'm missing the Kentucky Speedway and the Memphis Motorsports Park because AOPA has them as "uncharted". If someone wants to contribute the lat/long for these, I will update this post.

That is where I got all of my info. Sure wish I was as computer savvy as you to do it that way! It would have saved 100 hrs of manual entries.

 

[ChrisK]

Memphis: 35°16′58″N 89°56′51″W

Kentucky: 38.70964°N 84.91624°W

15 seconds on Wikipedia.

Be nice. I didn't realize they were uncharted until I had finished =P

 

[ChrisK]

That is where I got all of my info. Sure wish I was as computer savvy as you to do it that way! It would have saved 100 hrs of manual entries.

=( It would take me forever to type all of those in!

 

[Mike I]

How many MLB stadiums are not in or very very near a B/C/D surface area that you have to even worry about it? Especially since the TFR "goes away" if you are squawking and talking.

The TFR does not "go away" if you're squawking and talking when VFR. Even in Class B/C/D, it remains the pilot's responsibility to stay out of a TFR. In Class B, it's on the pilot to decline any clearance that would take him/her into an active TFR (sporting or otherwise), without specific authorization to enter the TFR. Being given a heading in Class B that takes one through a TFR (even with a squawk) is not authorization. The only instance, as I understand it, where specific authorization is not required is when IFR and squawking/talking. There are plenty of stadiums near airports, and air carriers fly right through the TFR on approach during a game while a TFR is active, but as I understand it that clearance comes from being on an IFR plan.

THE RESTRICTIONS DO NOT APPLY TO THOSE AIRCRAFT AUTHORIZED BY AND IN CONTACT WITH ATC FOR OPERATIONAL OR SAFETY OF FLIGHT PURPOSES, DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE, LAW ENFORCEMENT, AND AIR AMBULANCE FLIGHT OPERATIONS.

99% of the time, at least in Class B in my experience, ATC will keep the pilot posted about TFR start times and not permit routing that would cause the pilot to violate it.

Happy to be corrected if my info's incorrect.

 

[EdFred]

Our interpretations of "IN CONTACT WITH ATC FOR OPERATIONAL OR SAFETY OF FLIGHT PURPOSES" vary then, because I don't see it stating IFR only.

 

[Mike I]

Our interpretations of "OPERATIONAL OR SAFETY OF FLIGHT PURPOSES" vary then.

If ATC's given me a vector that will take me into an active TFR, sporting or otherwise, I'm going to want verbal confirmation I'm cleared to enter the TFR so it's on tape. No way I'm making the assumption that because I've been given a vector, I'm good to go.

I interpret "OPERATIONAL...PURPOSES" to mean in conjunction with the sporting event related to the TFR, such as broadcast blimps, etc. The "SAFETY OF FLIGHT" I interpret as a VFR pilot needing to get through the TFR to remain VFR or out of icing, or for some other reason unable to climb/turn away from the TFR, for example.

 

[MAKG1]

How many MLB stadiums are not in or very very near a B/C/D surface area that you have to even worry about it? Especially since the TFR "goes away" if you are squawking and talking.

That doesn't necessarily help.

If there is a game at Stanford -- which is inside Class D -- I still get yelled at by Tower if I get anywhere near it. Never busted it, but it still makes Tower nervous if I enter on the left 45 for 31 or anywhere south it. They like straight-ins, downwind entries, and bayside entries (right 45 or right base) when there is a game on.

I've heard other pilots argue with them trying to get left base entries. "Remain over 3000" will put you in Class B (or at least very, very close), and it's much too close to the SFO ILS to get a clearance. Commonly used transitions take airliners over the field at 4000 very frequently.

 

[EdFred]

If ATC's given me a vector that will take me into an active TFR, sporting or otherwise, I'm going to want verbal confirmation I'm cleared to enter the TFR so it's on tape. No way I'm making the assumption that because I've been given a vector, I'm good to go.

I interpret "OPERATIONAL...PURPOSES" to mean in conjunction with the sporting event related to the TFR, such as broadcast blimps, etc. The "SAFETY OF FLIGHT" I interpret as a VFR pilot needing to get through the TFR to remain VFR or out of icing, or for some other reason unable to climb/turn away from the TFR, for example.

Operational is just that, operational purposes. Look at the difference in wording between the stadium TFR and the presidential TFR.

 

[EdFred]

That doesn't necessarily help.

If there is a game at Stanford -- which is inside Class D -- I still get yelled at by Tower if I get anywhere near it. Never busted it, but it still makes Tower nervous if I enter on the left 45 for 31 or anywhere south it. They like straight-ins, downwind entries, and bayside entries (right 45 or right base) when there is a game on.

I've heard other pilots argue with them trying to get left base entries. "Remain over 3000" will put you in Class B (or at least very, very close), and it's much too close to the SFO ILS to get a clearance. Commonly used transitions take airliners over the field at 4000 very frequently.

Sounds like the tower folks there could use some re-education on stadium TFRs as well. The controllers at other fields near D-I games clear VFR traffic into the stadium TFRs for take offs and landings.

 

[timwinters]

Everything I've always read (granted none of it "official") stated that flight following doesn't protect you but that being under positive control in class B or C does, VFR or IFR.

 

[DesertNomad]

I find it mildly humorous that they include teams playing and game time in the description.

I am waiting for them to show the live scores.

 

[LifeInverted]

That's a bizarre amount of detail, I wonder if they even update you on bullpen changes

 

[frcabot]

How many MLB stadiums are not in or very very near a B/C/D surface area that you have to even worry about it? Especially since the TFR "goes away" if you are squawking and talking.

This is so incredibly false. FDC NOTAM 9/5151 states that you have to be in communication with AND AUTHORIZED BY ATC to enter a stadium TFR. Just because you're in contact with ATC doesn't mean you're authorized by them, and the FAA has violated airmen for exactly the interpretation you are advocating.

 

[frcabot]

http://www.regulations.gov/#!docketDetail;D=FAA-2013-0784

Post comments if you want to get this stupid stadium TFR thing revoked.

 

[FredFenster]

I am waiting for them to show the live scores.

Isn't that what the ADF is for? :wink2:

 

[acrophile]

FDC NOTAM 9/5151 states that you have to be in communication with AND AUTHORIZED BY ATC to enter a stadium TFR. Just because you're in contact with ATC doesn't mean you're authorized by them, and the FAA has violated airmen for exactly the interpretation you are advocating.

Can you cite a source for that information, please? Where can I find a documentd example of such a violation?

 

[acrophile]

I interpret "OPERATIONAL...PURPOSES" to mean in conjunction with the sporting event related to the TFR, such as broadcast blimps, etc..

But the TFR wording is "in contact with ATC for operational...purposes". So it's the contact, not the flight, that has to be for "operational purposes". If I'm flying with a clearance in Class B, then I'm in contact with ATC for operational purposes.

 

[NoHeat]

I am waiting for them to show the live scores.

Now that would be sweet!

 

[JeffDG]

Can you cite a source for that information, please? Where can I find a documentd example of such a violation?

http://tfr.faa.gov/save_pages/detail_9_5151.html

FDC 9/5151 FDC PART 1 OF 2 .. SPECIAL NOTICE .. SPORTING EVENTS. EFFECTIVE IMMEDIATELY UNTIL FURTHER NOTICE. THIS NOTICE REPLACES FDC NOTAM 3/1862 DUE TO THE WAIVER WEBSITE CHANGE AND LANGUAGE CLARIFICATION. THIS NOTICE MODIFIES FLIGHT RESTRICTIONS PREVIOUSLY ISSUED IN FDC NOTAM 3/1862 TO COMPLY WITH STATUTORY MANDATES DETAILED IN SECTION 352 OF PUBLIC LAW 108-7 AND AS AMENDED BY SECTION 521 OF PUBLIC LAW 108-199. PURSUANT TO 49 USC 40103(B), THE FEDERAL AVIATION ADMINISTRATION (FAA) CLASSIFIES THE AIRSPACE DEFINED IN THIS NOTAM AS 'NATIONAL DEFENSE AIRSPACE'. ANY PERSON WHO KNOWINGLY OR WILLFULLY VIOLATES THE RULES CONCERNING OPERATIONS IN THIS AIRSPACE MAY BE SUBJECT TO CERTAIN CRIMINAL PENALTIES UNDER 49 USC 46307. PILOTS WHO DO NOT ADHERE TO THE FOLLOWING PROCEDURES MAY BE INTERCEPTED, DETAINED AND INTERVIEWED BY LAW ENFORCEMENT/SECURITY PERSONNEL. PURSUANT TO 14 CFR SECTION 99.7, SPECIAL SECURITY INSTRUCTIONS, COMMENCING ONE HOUR BEFORE THE SCHEDULED TIME OF THE EVENT UNTIL ONE HOUR AFTER THE END OF THE EVENT. ALL AIRCRAFT AND PARACHUTE OPERATIONS ARE PROHIBITED WITHIN A 3 NMR UP TO AND INCLUDING 3000 FT AGL OF ANY STADIUM HAVING A SEATING CAPACITY OF 30,000 OR MORE PEOPLE WHERE EITHER A REGULAR OR POST SEASON MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL, NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE, OR NCAA DIVISION ONE FOOTBALL GAME IS OCCURRING. THIS NOTAM ALSO APPLIES TO NASCAR SPRINT CUP, INDY CAT, END PART 1 OF 2 FDC 9/5151 FDC PART 2 OF 2 .. SPECIAL NOTICE .. SPORTING EVENTS. EFFECTIVE AND CHAMP SERIES RACES EXCLUDING QUALIFYING AND PRE-RACE EVENTS. FLIGHTS CONDUCTED FOR OPERATIONAL PURPOSES OF ANY EVENT, STADIUM OR VENUE AND BROADCAST COVERAGE FOR THE BROADCAST RIGHTS HOLDER ARE AUTHORIZED WITH AN APPROVED WAIVER. THE RESTRICTIONS DO NOT APPLY TO THOSE AIRCRAFT AUTHORIZED BY AND IN CONTACT WITH ATC FOR OPERATIONAL OR SAFETY OF FLIGHT PURPOSES, DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE, LAW ENFORCEMENT, AND AIR AMBULANCE FLIGHT OPERATIONS. ALL PREVIOUSLY ISSUED WAIVERS TO FDC NOTAM 3/1862 REMAIN VALID UNTIL THE SPECIFIED END DATE BUT NOT TO EXCEED 90 DAYS FOLLOWING THE EFFECTIVE DATE OF THIS NOTAM. INFORMATION ABOUT WAIVER APPLICATIONS AND TSA SECURITY AUTHORIZATIONS CAN BE FOUND AT HTTP://WWW.TSA.GOV/WHAT_WE_DO/TSNM/GENERAL_AVIATION/AIRSPACE_WAIVERS.SHTM (CASE SENSITIVE USE LOWER CASE ONLY) OR BY CALLING TSA AT 571-227-2071. INDIVIDUALS MAY SUBMIT A REQUEST FOR A FAA WAIVER AT HTTPS://WAIVER.C3.FAA.GOV. END PART 2 OF 2

 

[JeffDG]

But the TFR wording is "in contact with ATC for operational...purposes". So it's the contact, not the flight, that has to be for "operational purposes". If I'm flying with a clearance in Class B, then I'm in contact with ATC for operational purposes.

The NOTAM says "AUTHORIZED BY AND IN CONTACT"