Series 3 TiVo: Resistance is futile. You will buy.

[mikea]

I had to buy a new washing machine last night. Thanks to my sociopath former neighbor I got to pay for $129 service call for what a thought was the replacement of a shredded drive belt only to have the guy tell me it needed a new $200 transmission. They would give me half of the charge back toward a new one.

I made the mistake of wandering in to the home theater area to look at the Series 3 TiVo. The picture is of course, amazing in HD. I remembered that I have to buy by the end of 2006 to be able to transfer my lifetime service for $199.

So today I decided to visit the Tivo community forums to see what the best deal is. I went with this one at Weaknees, so I got it for $679 and I have $50 coupon on the way.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/printthread.php?t=327297&p=4586715

The sad thing is I don't have cable or an HDTV. I do have a 1920x1200 LCD monitor that has component inputs that I'll use for a while.

I also don't have cable so no dual CableCARDS. I'm going to just use an antenna for a while. I don't relish dealing with Comcast*. I'll get cable in the new house sometime next year.

* There's a 42 page thread on the Tivo forums about the various "successes" dealing Comcast. http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=316310

 

[Dave Siciliano]

Mike:

Thanks for your thoughts. I had Tivo and dropped it. Really liked it but if something wasn't working, they wouldn't help. One had to call the box manufacturer--in my case Humax. It was crazy: you call Humax and hold, and hold. I finally gave up.

Any recommendations? I'd love to have it, but need a reasonable response when it doesn't work.

I have Dish Network and may get something through them.

Thanks,

Dave

 

[mikea]

Mike:

Thanks for your thoughts. I had Tivo and dropped it. Really liked it but if something wasn't working, they wouldn't help. One had to call the box manufacturer--in my case Humax. It was crazy: you call Humax and hold, and hold. I finally gave up.

Any recommendations? I'd love to have it, but need a reasonable response when it doesn't work.

I have Dish Network and may get something through them.

The Dish PVR is crap. You're better off with no PVR than that one. The non-TiVo DirecTV one is actually worse.

The difference is the features and the great User Interface. Anybody can get a TiVo cooking with all kinds of capability right away. The also-ran DVRs don't and in some cases can't, compete.

Your problem is with Humax. I dunno why the dealer wouldn't replace it under warranty.

Try getting a new Series 2 TiVo for free with subscription and you get $20 for some pizza: http://www.tivo.com/0.11.papajohns.asp

It will work with your Dish receiver - only the TiVo guide will be better than the Dish one.

The current hot setup is the one i just ordered, the Series 3 HD TiVo with HDTV over the air and/or with cable service with 2 CableCARDS. It has 4 tuners and can record 2 from sources at once.

Send me an email and I'll send you a referral card.

 

[SkyHog]

The 2 Cable Card setup is one thing Albuquerque's Comcast is doing right, thank God. We screw everything else up, we talk crap about our customers (or maybe that's just me and my team...), we have long hold times and we screw up billing on accounts almost every time we open the account.

But tell us you have a series 3 TiVo, and you'll get set up properly right away.

 

[mikea]

The 2 Cable Card setup is one thing Albuquerque's Comcast is doing right, thank God. We screw everything else up, we talk crap about our customers (or maybe that's just me and my team...), we have long hold times and we screw up billing on accounts almost every time we open the account.

But tell us you have a series 3 TiVo, and you'll get set up properly right away.

Sorry. bud. After dealing with the stupidity getting Jann set up and having to use the brain-dead 6412, I'm not signing up with Comcast. My patience held out for quite a while with the "sales rep" who would not let me order a HD receiver because, stupid customer, you can't have 5.1 audio unless you have an HD TV, cause you know, they disable the composite and S-Video ports on the HD receivers (NOT!).

I just checked and see that I'd be paying $80 a month for Comcast. I get to pay for VOD even though I won't get it.

I checked and found I can get RCN and guess what? They treat customers like they need customers.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=316405&page=2&pp=30
If they have the same HD lineup they get my money. I can expect that Comcast will buy them out as soon as I sign up.

 

[AdamZ]

Mike was your washing machine manual or automatic?

 

[DeeG]

"Series 3 TiVo: Resistance is futile. You will buy."

I resisted series 1 and 2. In fact, I don't have ANY broadcast television in my home (local, sat or cable).

Resistance is NOT futile! ahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

[fgcason]

In fact, I don't have ANY broadcast television in my home (local, sat or cable).

Resistance is NOT futile! ahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

That's 2 of us.
The only tv I have is in temporary storage and will go directly to semi-permanent storage shortly. Wanna watch tv here? Forgetaboutit. There not one.
The interesting bit is that once you put the tv/stereo/whatever else away, you don't really miss it at all and there's suddenly a lot more available hours in a day for living life. I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that a phone and computer fall into the same category as tv's.

 

[mikea]

Mike was your washing machine manual or automatic?

What's a manual? A wringer?

It's a 10 year old Kitchen Aid top loader which I gather in my research is made by Whirlpool, who now makes about every appliance other then GE - They bought Maytag who bought Amana and were already making Kenmore and Kitchen Aid.

The sociopath used to cram MY washer so full it was audibly straining. He didn't need to care if he broke somebody else's washer. At one point he told me to fix my dryer so he could use it.

 

[mikea]

"Series 3 TiVo: Resistance is futile. You will buy."

I resisted series 1 and 2. In fact, I don't have ANY broadcast television in my home (local, sat or cable).

Resistance is NOT futile! ahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

That was another reason that I hesitate to throw more money at the TV. I have about 400 hours of stuff saved that I only get through at 3-4 hours a week. I have every House since the pilot and I never saw one. I watched it for the first time last week. I'm not sure I like it that much. What's weird is seeing a commercial for "Spanglish" and thinking "Wasn't that like 2 years ago?" and remembering that it was.

This new TiVo has 300 hours capacity. I'm a video pack rat.

 

[SkyHog]

Sorry. bud. ......

Yeah, you misunderstood me. I don't care if you come to Comcast or not. Frankly, I'd rather you didn't, because this company doesn't deserve new customers until it fixes the problems with the current ones.

That wasn't intended as a recruitment tool, simply a 'Hey, we actually do SOMETHING right.'

 

[EdFred]

Mike -

Adam was joking...transmission...manual...automatic. I thought it was funny.

 

[mikea]

Mike -

Adam was joking...transmission...manual...automatic. I thought it was funny.

Doh!!

 

[mikea]

I got my Series 3 TiVo. I have no post-purchase disonnance. I like it.

I set it up for digital over-the-air TV using only an antenna (for now). There are over 25 channels to be had in Chicago, and I had it scan and add what it could find it said there were 45. A lot of those were too distant to be reliable, like in Milwaukee and Indiana.

When I went to my DirecTivos I noticed that half of my season passes were for channels I could get in on the antenna.

Once you get it on your home network the Series 3 has about 75% of the advanced features of the Series 2. It does have streaming music, Yahoo traffic and weather, it can access to pictures and music on your PC or Mac, and Podcaster, so you can subscribe to podcasts. You can schedule recordings remotely over the web. It doesn't have TiVo2Go which lets you watch recordings on your PC. I hope that TiVo works that permission out with the CableCARD and movie barons.

When you sign up, the web site asks if it's OK for the TiVo to download content. It occurred to me that what's behind that is someday for TiVo to offer you current content as video on demand which it'll download from the 'net. Apple will be doing the same with iTV.

I'll choose TiVo's UI over Apple's now and for as far into the future as I can imagine. It would be nice if Apple bought TiVo.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

I'll choose TiVo's UI over Apple's now and for as far into the future as I can imagine. It would be nice if Apple bought TiVo.

Mike...

Are you actually bashing Apple?!?

(Have you seen Apple's interface yet? How do you know TiVos's is better?)

 

[mikea]

Mike...

Are you actually bashing Apple?!?

(Have you seen Apple's interface yet? How do you know TiVos's is better?)

I know how Front Row works. It's not the same. It just starts with a carousel of graphics.

I thought Steve said that everything has to be one click away.

It pretty much is on a TiVo.

 

[Greebo]

Now Mike you know I love TiVo, but the "one click away" simply isn't really true, or feasible IMO (unless the S3 is radically redesigned). On my stand alone series 2, to get to my recorded shows is two clicks (main menu first), and to pick an actual show is several clicks (scrolling), a click to look at the details, and a click to play.

Picking shows to record is also a many click operation.

That said, I still think the UI for TiVo is dirt simple to use.

 

[mikea]

Now Mike you know I love TiVo, but the "one click away" simply isn't really true, or feasible IMO (unless the S3 is radically redesigned). On my stand alone series 2, to get to my recorded shows is two clicks (main menu first), and to pick an actual show is several clicks (scrolling), a click to look at the details, and a click to play.

Picking shows to record is also a many click operation.

That said, I still think the UI for TiVo is dirt simple to use.

Yeah. It's not one click but the peanut remote is as good, dare I say better, design as the iPod. It's better for the job than the Front Row remote which is iPod-like. I'm sure that Steve hates all the buttons the TiVo remote has but those serve the job really well and are all laid out better than any other TV remote going.

I can zip around at lightning speed to do what I want by touch alone. In fact, this new Series 3 has an updated remote that in backlighted with a slightly different key layout that I'm having some trouble with. I'm hitting thumbs up when I want chan/page up/down. I can still use the old one. I had the same problem when they moved one button on the second gen remote.

It is the remote working with the UI that is large part of what makes the TiVo user experience great.

Other than that they always had logical functionality and features and they added in response to customer feedback and many to copy what the "unauthorized" hackers did. That's the benefit of building on an open source Linux kernal where under the GPL they had to release part of the source code. Web access, TiVo2Go, and all of the network features like music and picture sharing were done by the TiVo underground first. I wonder how much of THIER code TiVo ended using.

This one now has a conflict manager to help stymie the goofs at NBC who schedule shows to start a minute earlier or run a minute longer. Users have asked for that for a long time.

 

[mikea]

When you sign up, the web site asks if it's OK for the TiVo to download content. It occurred to me that what's behind that is someday for TiVo to offer you current content as video on demand which it'll download from the 'net. Apple will be doing the same with iTV.

I'll choose TiVo's UI over Apple's now and for as far into the future as I can imagine. It would be nice if Apple bought TiVo.

It could happen! The rumor is that Apple is going to license TiVo
http://ce.seekingalpha.com/article/21872

I imagine Apple had to get a license from TiVo because, among other reasons, TiVo has patents on several key and wonderful DVR technologies like the time line and the video back space.

 

[woodstock]

my stupid Dish network "tivo" is finally acting up big time. it isn't the recording/viewing that is at issue, it just won't properly lock onto the satellites so not only are some channels impossible to get (at various times) I can't get into the "guide" or search anything. meaning, I cannot see what else is on other than by clicking up and down the various channels, some of which won't lock in anyway.

they told me it's time for a new one, which is fine as far as that goes but there is no way to save all the movies I've recorded and still never watched. sigh.

 

[mikea]

my stupid Dish network "tivo" is finally acting up big time. it isn't the recording/viewing that is at issue, it just won't properly lock onto the satellites so not only are some channels impossible to get (at various times) I can't get into the "guide" or search anything. meaning, I cannot see what else is on other than by clicking up and down the various channels, some of which won't lock in anyway.

they told me it's time for a new one, which is fine as far as that goes but there is no way to save all the movies I've recorded and still never watched. sigh.

If it's like the DirecTivo you will still be able to watch the recorded content even if there's no Dish. (I have no idea if Dish's work that way.)

I would not rush to buy a new Dish PVR unless you can get the new AT&T Universal one that has the Yahoo home networking features. You have to be in an AT&T DSL area for that I think.

Dish is going to try to get you to go for a new box and commit to a year or two of service. Right now I wouldn't commit to anything. Too many things are changing. Analog over the air TV is still scheduled to end in February 2009. These new DVR home media devices will be coming out by mid next year. You should see which ones look good.

Right now what looks best to me is over the air digital TV which has an amazing amount of content, and CableCARD or downloadable premium content all of which should be on the Series 3 TiVo, and may be coming on the Apple iTV. CableCARD still has the onerous content lockdowns and cable companies fighting it even though it'll bring them customers. The movie industry is still insisting on being stupid and fighting pretty much any downloadable content where they can't get paid for each person at each showing.

 

[ScottM]

Analog over the air TV is still scheduled to end in February 2009.

In 2005, the U.S. Senate passed a budget bill that calls for over-the-air television stations to cease their analog broadcasts by 2009-02-17. This is not the first date and the cut-off date has been moved forward several times already and may do so again. After the cut-off date, TVs and other equipment with legacy NTSC (Never The Same Color) tuners would be unable to receive over-the-air broadcasts, but who cares if you have cable or sat? You already are not watching TV form over the air. It would not make your TV not work if you are using some sort of converter box already.

 

[ausrere]

Now Mike you know I love TiVo, but the "one click away" simply isn't really true, or feasible IMO (unless the S3 is radically redesigned). On my stand alone series 2, to get to my recorded shows is two clicks (main menu first), and to pick an actual show is several clicks (scrolling), a click to look at the details, and a click to play.

Picking shows to record is also a many click operation.

That said, I still think the UI for TiVo is dirt simple to use.

While it's still not "one click", I use some of the short cuts on Tivo to get to places that otherwise would be browsing through menus... like:

TiVo button + 1 (or TiVo + TiVo) will get you to the Now Playing list.
TiVo button + 2 To Do List
TiVo button + 3 Wish Lists
TiVo button + 4 Browse by Name
TiVo button + 5 Browse by Channel
TiVo button + 6 Browse by Time
TiVo button + 7 Record Time/Channel (manual recording)
TiVo button + 8 TiVo Suggestions
TiVo button + 9 Network Showcases
TiVo button + Slow Motion button Messages and Setup

The only complaint I have with the Tivo remote is that it's not universal and I can't program it to control my surround sound system/DVD player... yet anyway.

Lisa

 

[mikea]

In 2005, the U.S. Senate passed a budget bill that calls for over-the-air television stations to cease their analog broadcasts by 2009-02-17. This is not the first date and the cut-off date has been moved forward several times already and may do so again. After the cut-off date, TVs and other equipment with legacy NTSC (Never The Same Color) tuners would be unable to receive over-the-air broadcasts, but who cares if you have cable or sat? You already are not watching TV form over the air. It would not make your TV not work if you are using some sort of converter box already.

Right. There is so much confusion that blog articles "setting the record straight" have comments that proceed to set the record wrong. Like saying CABLE will change from analog to digital.
http://www.macobserver.com/article/2006/12/04.9.shtml (The article is right. Some of the comments are wrong.)

Cable has been transitioning all along and that makes no difference except to people hooking the cable directly to a TV with no cable box for basic service. They will see fewer and fewer channels that way.

Cable companies want the $10+ a month for the box and they will fight anything that prevents that.

Also digital TV is not HDTV. HDTV is carried over digital TV. Most of what I see on digital TV is SD.

The bottom line is as you say, only people who have been getting (non digital) TV over the air off an antenna are going to stop getting it.

Here I go diving in...I'll stop.

 

[DeeG]

This new TiVo has 300 hours capacity. I'm a video pack rat.

I'm kinda of a pack rat as well. Not counting any of our King videos (I think Pete really likes MK,,,) we have well over 1000 DVDs, VHSs, and laser discs. Yup I really do have laser discs......

I don't rent, I buy.

 

[ScottM]

The bottom line is as you say, only people who have been getting (non digital) TV over the air off an antenna are going to stop getting it.

Here I go diving in...I'll stop.

I don't know anyone that still does that. But I know some still do that.

 

[mikea]

I don't know anyone that still does that. But I know some still do that.

There are a lot of poor and elderly that just have built-in rabbit ears. That's where the outrage is going to come from.

I figured that we'd have $20 (and less) digital tuners from China at Wal-Mart, Walgreens, and Target by now. We will have those by 2/2007.