Seeking pre-buy recommendations

GaryO

GaryO

Pre-takeoff checklist
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Messages
295
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Display name:
Gary Ostrander
I am looking at an AA1B in NJ. I'm hoping someone can recommend a Grumman knowledgeable A&P for the pre-buy inspection.
 
Gary,

Word of advise, If the annual is over three months old, make the pre-buy an annual inspection, it will save you money.
 
Dean said:
Gary,

Word of advise, If the annual is over three months old, make the pre-buy an annual inspection, it will save you money.
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I would do an annual even if the seller had one done yesterday. It all depends on WHO does the annual and I'd rather have my mech, that I know and trust do it than the seller's.

Good luck with the AA1, they are a blast.
 
GaryO said:
I am looking at an AA1B in NJ. I'm hoping someone can recommend a Grumman knowledgeable A&P for the pre-buy inspection.
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Jay Stout at Lancaster, PA. They're the local reference Grumman Shop.
 
bbchien said:
Jay Stout at Lancaster, PA. They're the local reference Grumman Shop.
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Thanks. I'll give them a call.
 
Nothing against Jay Stout, but if you're willing to go to Lancaster, either consider my mechanic, Jay Shearer, Shearer Aviation at Deck (9D4) in Lebanon, PA 717-866-2184. He has maintained my and other Tigers and AA1's on the field for years. Ed Guthrie has said good things about Dutchland Aviation at Smoketown (S37) 717-293-9824.
 
bbchien said:
Jay Stout at Lancaster, PA. They're the local reference Grumman Shop.
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I used to recommend Jay Stout's Flying Tigers shop; I do not any more. No further details in writing. Anthony's recommendation is a better choice.
 
Regardless of where or who inspects your new aircraft you should order the aircraft records from the FAA registry it only costs $5.00 per N-number. Having offical aircaft data in hand may save you a trip and lots of time and money.

As a suggestion when you find a aircraft you are considering contact your local FSDO and have a FAA Airworthiness Inspector (Maintenance) person run the N-number and see if the aircraft has and accident or incident history. They may not give you the hard copy of the report, but may tell you over the telephone of problems noted in the report. When purchasing an aircraft the FAA is you best friend.

And make sure you sign a contract and include a pre-purchase inspection as part of the contract. This is the only legal document that will protect you incase something is wrong with the aircraft after purchase that the owner did not tell you about.

If you would like send me a private e-mail and I may be able to assist you.

Stache
 
Gary: Don't know where in Jersey the plane is but Hortman Aviation at KPNE ( Northeast Philly airport) has its own fleet of AA-1s. They do all the work on them with thier own A&P. you may want to check them out. A lot of folks around here use them for work on thier Tigers and Cheetas.
 
Ron Levy said:
I used to recommend Jay Stout's Flying Tigers shop; I do not any more. No further details in writing. Anthony's recommendation is a better choice.
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ooh! PM me....
 
bbchien said:
ooh! PM me....
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Dr. Bruce, I have this mental picture of you dancing around, all animated and excited-like...


...I'm easily amused?
 
Ron Levy said:
I used to recommend Jay Stout's Flying Tigers shop; I do not any more. No further details in writing. Anthony's recommendation is a better choice.
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Ditto the "no" to Jay Stout's Flying Tigers shop, as in no way in h#@%! If in doubt, pull up Marietta, PA in an NTSB accident search. Use "maintenance" as a search criteria.
 
bbchien said:
ooh! PM me....
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No need for a PM--do an NTSB search as I suggest in an previous post (Marietta, PA + "maintenance"). You'll find 2 fatals in the past 7 years (Tiger and Aerostar). I have my own personal horror story involving an M20A picked up from an extensive annual at Flying Tigers which I then ferried to California for a client.
 
Stache said:
Regardless of where or who inspects your new aircraft you should order the aircraft records from the FAA registry it only costs $5.00 per N-number. Having offical aircaft data in hand may save you a trip and lots of time and money.

As a suggestion when you find a aircraft you are considering contact your local FSDO and have a FAA Airworthiness Inspector (Maintenance) person run the N-number and see if the aircraft has and accident or incident history. They may not give you the hard copy of the report, but may tell you over the telephone of problems noted in the report. When purchasing an aircraft the FAA is you best friend.

And make sure you sign a contract and include a pre-purchase inspection as part of the contract. This is the only legal document that will protect you incase something is wrong with the aircraft after purchase that the owner did not tell you about.

If you would like send me a private e-mail and I may be able to assist you.
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Truer words never written; personal experience; and Stache is a valuable resource.

HR
 
Anthony said:
Nothing against Jay Stout, but if you're willing to go to Lancaster, either consider my mechanic, Jay Shearer, Shearer Aviation at Deck (9D4) in Lebanon, PA 717-866-2184. He has maintained my and other Tigers and AA1's on the field for years. Ed Guthrie has said good things about Dutchland Aviation at Smoketown (S37) 717-293-9824.
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I will gladly repeat my recommendation for Dennis Glick, owner of Dutchland Aviation. Excellent choice. I have 13 years of great maintenance stories involving Dennis. Dennis and his shop have literally saved me $1,000's over the years. Anyone interested in Dennis' shop or specific experiences please send me an email or PM.
 
And, of course, if you can a) get the seller to take the plane to Forest Hill Industrial Airport in Forest Hill MD (MD31, about 15 nm north of MTN airport), and b) get Bill Broach to free up the time to do it, you'll get as good a pre-buy as you can anywhere. (410) 879-1073 for Chesapeake Aircraft Maintenance, and Bill knows Grummans. Some sellers don't like doing this since if there's anything truly unairworthy about the plane, they'll be walking home.
 
Len Lanetti said:
What is a PM? I take it from context not Preventative Maintenance.

Len
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Private Message... you can send any other member of the board a Private Message; it uses the same interface as a normal post, but only that member gets it...
 
Ron Levy said:
And, of course, if you can a) get the seller to take the plane to Forest Hill Industrial Airport in Forest Hill MD (MD31, about 15 nm north of MTN airport), and b) get Bill Broach to free up the time to do it, you'll get as good a pre-buy as you can anywhere. (410) 879-1073 for Chesapeake Aircraft Maintenance, and Bill knows Grummans. Some sellers don't like doing this since if there's anything truly unairworthy about the plane, they'll be walking home.
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I couldn't work out a way to move the plane any significant distance for the pre-buy, so I had Caldwell Air Service do an annual/pre-buy. They appear to have done a good job and I purchased the plane.
But bad weather prevented me from getting my 5 hours with an instructor and flying it home so I flew back commercial and looked for a ferry pilot. The ferry pilot asked if I could get it IR certified so I arranged for that inspection. Neithor I nor the previous owner are IR so the IR cert had expired.

After that is when the problems started. The ferry pilot is also an FAA examiner so he needed to verify that everything was in order before the flight. He called back wanting to know where the current W&B and 337 forms were. I told him the W&B should be in the plane and that there weren't any 337 - I had already gotten the FAA records.

He told me that the avionics had obviosly received a major upgrade which required a new W&B and form 337. All we had was the original W&B. I was informed that without the updated paperwork it was illegal to fly. If I was caught flying it I would probably only get a slap on the wrist, but if an FAA examiner was caught flying it he would get crucified.
I knew that the avionics had been upgraded but didn't think to check the records for it. A check of the log books revealed that the work had not been logged either.

The previous owner learned to fly in the plane and had only 10 hours when he had the avionics upgraded. he said he didn't know what was required and didn't realize that the paperwork had not been done. It also appears that he was drastically over-charged for the work which was done 3 years ago.

I have contacted the avionics shop and they informed that the mechanic who performed the work is no longer there precisely because of things like this. They are accepting responsibility for the problem and say they are willing to set things right. The catch is that they want the plane brought to them so their current mechanic can verify that the work was done properly.

The good news is that the records have now been gone over with a fine tooth comb and, when this is resolved, I can be sure that everything is in order. And really the only thing it's costing me is a delay in getting it home.
 
Thank you guys for your private messaging. It appears that the compulsivity of the father was not transferred to the son. Sigh.
 
GaryO said:
After that is when the problems started. He told me that the avionics had obviosly received a major upgrade which required a new W&B and form 337. All we had was the original W&B. I was informed that without the updated paperwork it was illegal to fly.
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Wow, you're lucky. I was starting to have visions of "stolen avionics" installed... wouldn't that be a mess!?

Congrats on the new bird... you have pictures to post??
 
Troy Whistman said:
Wow, you're lucky. I was starting to have visions of "stolen avionics" installed... wouldn't that be a mess!?

Congrats on the new bird... you have pictures to post??
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I think I got it now.

It need paint but otherwise seems to be in good shape. Everyone who has looked at tells me that.

I'm trying to not get excited until I get it home.
 
Doesn't a ferry permit by it's very nature cancel the need for a current W&B? I know he didn't say ferry permit, only ferry pilot, but I'm asking...
 
GaryO said:
I think I got it now.

It need paint but otherwise seems to be in good shape. Everyone who has looked at tells me that.

I'm trying to not get excited until I get it home.
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Congratulations. And you're right smart to not get excited about it. No sense in building yourself up just to let yourself down. That doesn't need paint...not yet.
 
Richard said:
Doesn't a ferry permit by it's very nature cancel the need for a current W&B? I know he didn't say ferry permit, only ferry pilot, but I'm asking...
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I don't have a ferry permit and I am trying to avoid having to get one.
But without a current W&B I can't move it (or have it moved) unless I get a ferry permit.
 
Richard said:
That doesn't need paint...not yet.
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It's going to be tied down about 200 yards from the Gulf of Mexico. It will need all the protection I can give it.
 
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