Repaire or Replace Century I A/P

Artiom

Artiom

Pre-takeoff checklist
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Artiom
I'm considering buying a share in 1975 C182P partnership. The plane is in a good shape, has GNS430W and KX-155 + KI-208(No GS).
It also has Century I A/P which is INOP. That's the only thing I don't like about this plane so far. I really like to have GPS coupled autopilot. Let's just say it is my requirement.
I'm preparing to the meeting with the seller and have couple question that I need your help with:
1. Is it possible to fix Century I those days?
2. How much it may cost and is it even worth the effort? I have no idea what exactly is broken so I'm looking for ballpark numbers.
3. If I choose to and convince other partners to replace Century I with another A/P with altitude hold and GPS coupling what are the options and how much may it cost?

Thanks in advance for your help.
 
This is a bit of a complex question. It's impossible to know what exactly is wrong with the C-I. What you can likely expect is for it to break again if you repair it. It may be smple and cheap, may be expensive. I've only dealt with C-IIIs, but I'd suspect the C-I is repairable. For C-IIIs, I've put money towards repairing them, and they've been ok for a bit but then broken again. I've decided on the 310 that I'm not repairing it anymore. When it breaks, it's getting replaced. It doesn't work great, even working at its best state.

If you replace it, you can get a setup that will be more capable, but it won't be cheap to install. So the other question is how much you're willing to spend on an AP. There are lots of options with different prices. Personally, I'd look at the S-Tecs, but I think there are some other good ones coming out.
 
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if you really want an autopilot I would replace the century 1 with something like a stec 30 and GPSS. You can often get the 30 installed for about $14k-$17k. you will then need a DG with heading bug $300-$1200 and GPSS for $700-$2000. The price on DG and GPSS is used and new prices.
 
Ted nailed it, WHY is it inop?

Also is it properly disabled and placarded?
 
Everyone talks about some guy in OK that is the guru of the Century AP's, but I think Lafayette Avionic in IN is pretty good as well. I am fortunate that my IIB works pretty well. It does need to be calibrated though, left turns are about 25* but right turns will whip right over to 45* quickly. Those are pretty simple adjustments, I just need time to fly with my A&P and make the adjustments. The dollar amount BJC quoted are accurate but find out what is wrong first.
 
Tim, your AI might be causing that problem. The AI (52D66, I think) feeds the AP. We were having issues with that in the 310. Swapped AIs, much better.
 
I plan to be in Muncie Thursday to have the electric trim looked at. I will ask Bill about it and see what he says.

You should come up to MGY Saturday and have some dogs and burgers with us.
 
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Ted DuPuis said:
This is a bit of a complex question. It's impossible to know what exactly is wrong with the C-I. What you can likely expect is for it to break again if you repair it. It may be smple and cheap, may be expensive. I've only dealt with C-IIIs, but I'd suspect the C-I is repairable. For C-IIIs, I've put money towards repairing them, and they've been ok for a bit but then broken again. I've decided on the 310 that I'm not repairing it anymore. When it breaks, it's getting replaced. It doesn't work great, even working at its best state.

If you replace it, you can get a setup that will be more capable, but it won't be cheap to install. So the other question is how much you're willing to spend on an AP. There are lots of options with different prices. Personally, I'd look at the S-Tecs, but I think there are some other good ones coming out.
Click to expand...

I don't know yet what is wrong with Century I and agree with your approach to replace it. I guess that would be a problem to convince the other partners to spend $20k on new A/P.
 
jsnapp said:
if you really want an autopilot I would replace the century 1 with something like a stec 30 and GPSS. You can often get the 30 installed for about $14k-$17k. you will then need a DG with heading bug $300-$1200 and GPSS for $700-$2000. The price on DG and GPSS is used and new prices.
Click to expand...

Thanks for info. It's good to have an idea of how much it may cost.
 
The C-I is a basic, simple autopilot, and is still current production. I would seriously consider repairing it if the cost is not outrageous. It can be updated (if not already so-equipped) with a "radio tracker" which would allow it to track an OMNI or (if so-equipped) a GPSS computer.

You can even retain the C-I as a backup to another Century autopilot, and the C-I is rate-based (like S-Tecs), so independent of the attitude indicator.
 
SCCutler said:
The C-I is a basic, simple autopilot, and is still current production. I would seriously consider repairing it if the cost is not outrageous. It can be updated (if not already so-equipped) with a "radio tracker" which would allow it to track an OMNI or (if so-equipped) a GPSS computer.

You can even retain the C-I as a backup to another Century autopilot, and the C-I is rate-based (like S-Tecs), so independent of the attitude indicator.
Click to expand...

Assuming C-I can be repaired for reasonable amount of $$$ is there any way of adding altitude "A/P" to control altitude and climb/descent?
 
Dean V said:
If the partnership has been unwilling to repair or replace an inop autopilot, what other repairs are the partners deferring?
Click to expand...

Will check it out too.
I don't think INOP autopilot alone indicates anything. I know many pilots that don't want A/P. I'll ask why A/P repair was deferred when I meet seller and other partners.
 
Skylane81E said:
Yep. Stec makes stand alone pitch APs
Click to expand...

S-TEC web site is useless. Very hard to find the right product.
I see two models:
S-TEC Cobham - SYSTEM 30 ALT
Single-axis Altitude Hold Autopilot


S-TEC Cobham - SYSTEM 60-1
Single Axis Autopilot
 
Artiom said:
S-TEC web site is useless. Very hard to find the right product.
I see two models:
S-TEC Cobham - SYSTEM 30 ALT
Single-axis Altitude Hold Autopilot


S-TEC Cobham - SYSTEM 60-1
Single Axis Autopilot
Click to expand...

You're right about the website!

The first serves only to hold altitude (which is a useful function); the second is NOT a pitch autopilot; it is a roll-only autopilot.

The second S-Tec (Cobham) option for pitch is the System 60-Alt, which adds onto any autopilot and can do not only altitude hold, but also, capture a pre-set altitude and capture a glideslope.
 
Artiom said:
S-TEC web site is useless. Very hard to find the right product.
I see two models:
S-TEC Cobham - SYSTEM 30 ALT
Single-axis Altitude Hold Autopilot


S-TEC Cobham - SYSTEM 60-1
Single Axis Autopilot
Click to expand...

I think that's them
 
SCCutler said:
You're right about the website!

The first serves only to hold altitude (which is a useful function); the second is NOT a pitch autopilot; it is a roll-only autopilot.

The second S-Tec (Cobham) option for pitch is the System 60-Alt, which adds onto any autopilot and can do not only altitude hold, but also, capture a pre-set altitude and capture a glideslope.
Click to expand...

You're right - second one is called System Sixty PSS.
 
You folks do know that the Century I is still available from the factory, don't you?

Why trade out one unit for somebody else's version of the same thing?
 
Clark1961 said:
You folks do know that the Century I is still available from the factory, don't you?

Why trade out one unit for somebody else's version of the same thing?
Click to expand...

You wouldn't,

You would trade it for a more capable AP
 
Dean V said:
If the partnership has been unwilling to repair or replace an inop autopilot, what other repairs are the partners deferring?
Click to expand...

Depends. APs are a pretty common deferral and doesn't necessarily indicate an improperly maintained airplane otherwise. APs can be something of black magic to repair. I've talked to many folks who've spent thousands of dollars and gotten no improvements, so it's easy to see why they'll decide "Forget this, I have more important things to spend my money on."

The question should always be asked "What repairs have been deferred?"
 
Update: I met the seller and seems to be miscommunication between us. They didn't defer fixing Century-I and at the time we spoke the A/P was removed and diagnosed and they were looking for parts.
I also asked about adding altitude A/P and been told that members have to agree on installing it. Will ask this question again when I meet other members.
No other deferred maintenance and all AD's are completed.
 
Artiom said:
Update: I met the seller and seems to be miscommunication between us. They didn't defer fixing Century-I and at the time we spoke the A/P was removed and diagnosed and they were looking for parts.
I also asked about adding altitude A/P and been told that members have to agree on installing it. Will ask this question again when I meet other members.
No other deferred maintenance and all AD's are completed.
Click to expand...

Sounds good to me, now verify it
 
One more thing - this plane doesn't have engine monitor. I see EDM700 for 6cyl and fuel flow option is $3.3k. How much does installation of it costs?
 
Artiom said:
One more thing - this plane doesn't have engine monitor. I see EDM700 for 6cyl and fuel flow option is $3.3k. How much does installation of it costs?
Click to expand...
Takes the better part of a day assuming no major issues like access to exhaust risers or the need to rebuild the panel to make room for the unit. On a simple 4 cyl airplane with easy access to engine and panel it could be done in half a day if the person doing the work has a few similar installs under their belt. And you might be able to do a lot better than 3.3 AMU for the unit, either through a high volume dealer, especially at major events like SnF and Osh.
 
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