Rental tracking with SPOT

zaitcev

zaitcev

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Pete Zaitcev
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How many owners now track their fleet with onboard SPOT? Do they inform the renters about it?

From the other perspective, how easy it is to rig a SPOT box so that it draws the onboard power and then goes into standby mode when avionics master is off (to preserve the main battery), yet retains its built-in battery so it can report for a few minutes, in case. I hope I am not asking for too much.

Also, what service plan is right for this kind of use?
 
I think the installation would have to be signed off by someone with an inspection authorization, and in order to make it legal for IFR flights, someone would have to do testing to confirm that it didn't interfere with the IFR avionics.
 
spot requires a button push to turn on and is powered by AAA batteries. i don't think it is the solution for fleet tracking airplanes. i think there are devices designed for that purpose though
 
zaitcev said:
How many owners now track their fleet with onboard SPOT? Do they inform the renters about it?

From the other perspective, how easy it is to rig a SPOT box so that it draws the onboard power and then goes into standby mode when avionics master is off (to preserve the main battery), yet retains its built-in battery so it can report for a few minutes, in case. I hope I am not asking for too much.
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You are asking for too much ;) Can't imagine a SPOT would work for this application.

Google "automated flight following iridium". Prepare for sticker shock. The capability ain't cheap.
 
How would owners use such info?
Has there been problems with folks going to forbidden airports etc?
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
How would owners use such info?
Has there been problems with folks going to forbidden airports etc?
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I've seen it used as a selling tool for flight schools. They can tell the student, Don't worry we will ALWAYS know where you are
 
Spidertracks would be much more suited to this, and isn't prohibitively expensive (starts at $995).
https://www.spidertracks.com/store/fleetpro

They also have an SOS button like the SPOT, but they use the Iridium network (much more reliable). Also they're pretty much automatic... they'll provide position reports when they start moving, or you can set up a "boundary" so that position reports are only given when the plane leaves a 20nm ring, or however large you want to set it.

Also interesting is the monthly service is set up by "included flight hours" that will include the number of position reports you'll need.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Has there been problems with folks going to forbidden airports etc?
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I asked for a specific permission once and the owner said "No! But... If you go there, and do not break anything, I'll pretend not to know". I sensibly declined, but eventually rented from his competitor from across town, who did not have the restriction. That went well, but unfortunately, neither FBO would let me fly into the fun meetings that our state pilot association carries out at grass strips.

The ultimate fix is to own, of course. I just do not know if I'm ready.
 
AdamZ said:
I've seen it used as a selling tool for flight schools. They can tell the student, Don't worry we will ALWAYS know where you are
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Such are the newer generations, actually wanting to be nannied?
I would see it as a privacy intrusion.
 
If they don't trust their renters, they shouldn't be handing over the keys.
 
Palmpilot said:
If they don't trust their renters, they shouldn't be handing over the keys.
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That's all fine and good to say but I have heard quite a few stories about what people have claimed to do with rental airplanes...
 
I still say that's what insurance is for. And I'm not convinced tracking folks will prevent bad behavior. What's next, videos in the cockpit?
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
I still say that's what insurance is for. And I'm not convinced tracking folks will prevent bad behavior. What's next, videos in the cockpit?
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Like Pete said, the solution would be to own your own airplane, but I think that the owner of a rental airplane can set conditions, including tracking, if he or she wants.
 
our club has a restriction - no airports shorter than 2500 feet. There is a 2300 ft airport right near my spot on the chesapeake bay (4 hr drive for me these days) arrggh. I haven't asked yet - but i'm guessing the 2500 ft restriction is an insurance deal. Maybe with a "checkout" they'll let me fly there.

Understand 2500 feet can be too short with a high altitude (or density altitude) airport but 2300 feet, at sea level is plenty safe for me to get in a lightly loaded 152

We don't have a grass restriction which is nice.
 
dell30rb said:
our club has a restriction - no airports shorter than 2500 feet. There is a 2300 ft airport right near my spot on the chesapeake bay (4 hr drive for me these days) arrggh. I haven't asked yet - but i'm guessing the 2500 ft restriction is an insurance deal. Maybe with a "checkout" they'll let me fly there.

Understand 2500 feet can be too short with a high altitude (or density altitude) airport but 2300 feet, at sea level is plenty safe for me to get in a lightly loaded 152

We don't have a grass restriction which is nice.
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At my airport we have a King Air that flies in and out with 2444 feet.

I was amused when a place I rented from near Everett, WA required a special checkout to use an airport as "short" as my home field. I guess for some people, three times the ground roll is just not enough.
 
Everskyward said:
That's all fine and good to say but I have heard quite a few stories about what people have claimed to do with rental airplanes...
Click to expand...

Considering some of the restrictions, you almost have to break the imposed rules or not fly rentals at all.
 
fgcason said:
Considering some of the restrictions, you almost have to break the imposed rules or not fly rentals at all.
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The owners have right to set the rules. The potential renters can decide whether or not they want to rent or not. Let me add that the stories I've heard go a lot further than bending the rules slightly.
 
Kent can probably speak to the capabilities that the G1000 has to report on fleet movement, engine operation, and the like. Not comparable to SPOT or the like that give real-time information, but still the potential for privacy intrusions. Or, OTOH, finding "teaching moments" to tell people how to best run the engines!
 
Everskyward said:
Let me add that the stories I've heard go a lot further than bending the rules slightly.
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I started hearing them too when I grew in stature a little bit and went for my Complex etc. Mostly it's some off-airport landing or the other. What's worse is when renters try to lie out of the obvious. So unmanly.
 
If you're renting to someone you don't trust. Stop. ;)

Perhaps it's just the world showing you what a bad judge of character you are, and your experience as an owner who rents is only there to serve as a warning to others...

... to paraphrase the Demotivator(TM) posters. ;)
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Such are the newer generations, actually wanting to be nannied?
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Yes, Dave. Unfortunately, the vast majority of people not only like being nannied, they demand it. Companies and the government know this, which is why corporate marketing now uses this fact everywhere ("This body scanner is for your protection" or "We've cancelled your credit card for your protection").
 
Palmpilot said:
I was amused when a place I rented from near Everett, WA required a special checkout to use an airport as "short" as my home field. I guess for some people, three times the ground roll is just not enough.
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I grew up in Everett, and started my flight training there. Which airport?
 
sba55 said:
Yes, Dave. Unfortunately, the vast majority of people not only like being nannied, they demand it. Companies and the government know this, which is why corporate marketing now uses this fact everywhere ("This body scanner is for your protection" or "We've cancelled your credit card for your protection").
Click to expand...

The NSA guy just got grilled before congress asking if they can track the locations and travels of individuals by their cell phones. Each time he said, "We don't have legal authority..." Note, he didn't say the NSA doesn't have the technical capability to track them. :hairraise:

Now you know why they want to know who you are even if you buy a pre-paid phone.
 
August edition of AOPA flight training has a system described on page 20, www.wi-flight.net subscription model marketed for flight schools keeping tabs on the rental fleet. Sone info and prices given on this full page.
 
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Rob Schaffer said:
August edition of AOPA flight training has a system described on page 20, www.wi-flight.com subscription model marketed for flight schools keeping tabs on the rental fleet. Sone info and prices given on this full page.
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Must not be doing a good business because the domain name is for sale...
 
it's .net, not .com:
http://www.wi-flight.net
And from a quick skim, It doesn't look like a real time reporting, which i think was what the OP wanted.

As for why someone would want to track their fleet, it's not just a trust thing. Some people are nosy and they like to know what other people are doing, especially when using their stuff. And I'd guess there's some piece of mind in being able to figure out where your plane is when it's not back on time.
 
shenanigans said:
it's .net, not .com:
http://www.wi-flight.net
And from a quick skim, It doesn't look like a real time reporting, which i think was what the OP wanted.

As for why someone would want to track their fleet, it's not just a trust thing. Some people are nosy and they like to know what other people are doing, especially when using their stuff. And I'd guess there's some piece of mind in being able to figure out where your plane is when it's not back on time.
Click to expand...

ADS-B solves the tracking problem anyway. All the flight school has to do is get a ground receiver and they can figure out where you are. A certain school in Daytona Beach does that even.
 
shenanigans said:
it's .net, not .com:
http://www.wi-flight.net
And from a quick skim, It doesn't look like a real time reporting, which i think was what the OP wanted.

As for why someone would want to track their fleet, it's not just a trust thing. Some people are nosy and they like to know what other people are doing, especially when using their stuff. And I'd guess there's some piece of mind in being able to figure out where your plane is when it's not back on time.
Click to expand...
That and finding out about shenanigans like students landing on truly dangerous beaches, going to places they shouldn't, etc... I've heard some wacky stories from reliable sources. The students posted stuff online to prove it, too.

Ryan
 
Back when I was much younger and doing GA Avionics we used to get calls from the FBO's every once in a while because somebody had removed the tach cable from the back of the tach on a rental plane and had not gotten it put back together properly when returning the plane.

This was a common method of getting free hours and not paying for them and was solved by installing a Hobbs. True story! It takesall kinds I guess.
 
I would think it easier to disconnect the hobbs than a tach cable.
 
True, every hobbs I've seen installed has been at the bottom of the panel.
 
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