Reminder to check CTAF freqs....

AirBaker

AirBaker

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AirBaker
Monday we were flying in to Pine Mountain Lake on a return trip from the weekend. Since we were set up for a long final, I opted to fly a straight-in instead of the full patern. I had reported a 15, 10, 6 and a 3 mile final when a 182 had turned base in front of us. I slowed down as much as possible to give more room to the other aircraft.

The 182 landed and rolled out to the end of the runway at a slow taxi pace. My wheels were about 10 feet off the ground when I decided to go around instead of land. I flew the patern and came back in.

E45 (Pine Mountain Lake) had changed its CTAF frequency from 123.05 to 122.9 earlier this year. I had reported my position on 122.9 throughout the flight, but the other aircraft aparently had been on 123.05. Earlier in the year, I was monitoring both when flying into E45. I thought it had been long enough but in hind site it wasn't. There was aparently another near-incident a few months ago with 2 other aircraft. That time there was one aircraft departing 27 while the other was final for 9.

I was mad at myself for not monitoring the other frequency. If nothing else I could have 'informed' the other guy of the new frequency.
 
AirBaker said:
Monday we were flying in to Pine Mountain Lake on a return trip from the weekend. Since we were set up for a long final, I opted to fly a straight-in instead of the full patern. I had reported a 15, 10, 6 and a 3 mile final when a 182 had turned base in front of us. I slowed down as much as possible to give more room to the other aircraft.

The 182 landed and rolled out to the end of the runway at a slow taxi pace. My wheels were about 10 feet off the ground when I decided to go around instead of land. I flew the patern and came back in.

E45 (Pine Mountain Lake) had changed its CTAF frequency from 123.05 to 122.9 earlier this year. I had reported my position on 122.9 throughout the flight, but the other aircraft aparently had been on 123.05. Earlier in the year, I was monitoring both when flying into E45. I thought it had been long enough but in hind site it wasn't. There was aparently another near-incident a few months ago with 2 other aircraft. That time there was one aircraft departing 27 while the other was final for 9.

I was mad at myself for not monitoring the other frequency. If nothing else I could have 'informed' the other guy of the new frequency.
Click to expand...

And you know what? I just had yet another pilot scoff at me for using the A/FD; he was only the most recent in a long line of pilots I've known who consider using the A/FD beneath them. I consider it cheap insurance. My previous home field also changed frequencies. People were still using the wrong frequency more than a year after it changed. Through several editions of A/FDs and at least two editions of sectionals.

Judy
 
Even six years after the tower went up at SBY, we still get a couple of folks a year calling "Salisbury Traffic" on the old CTAF freq...must be relatives of the Smoketown Bandits.
 
Ron Levy said:
Even six years after the tower went up at SBY, we still get a couple of folks a year calling "Salisbury Traffic" on the old CTAF freq...must be relatives of the Smoketown Bandits.
Click to expand...

So, Ron, what do YOU think of the A/FDs? I don't think I have EVER found anyone other than student pilots who buy them, besides me. They just aren't that expensive, and they have all kinds of useful (and even humorous) information that isn't available elsewhere. For example, I once landed in Pratt, KS, just because of something in the "remarks" section of the A/FD.

But seriously, I've found numerous bits of information in A/FDs that you just couldn't get elsewhere because of the timing of the changes. Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.

Judy
 
Ron Levy said:
Even six years after the tower went up at SBY, we still get a couple of folks a year calling "Salisbury Traffic" on the old CTAF freq...must be relatives of the Smoketown Bandits.
Click to expand...
I can go one better: my PPL checkride DE told me about a guy that hadn't flown into Phoenix for 30 YEARS...and came straight in, calling out stuff on the old CTAF frequency. He threw the traffic off for HOURS. The FAA wouldn't let him fly until he had done a safety counseling session with my DE.
 
judypilot said:
So, Ron, what do YOU think of the A/FDs? I don't think I have EVER found anyone other than student pilots who buy them, besides me. They just aren't that expensive, and they have all kinds of useful (and even humorous) information that isn't available elsewhere. For example, I once landed in Pratt, KS, just because of something in the "remarks" section of the A/FD.

But seriously, I've found numerous bits of information in A/FDs that you just couldn't get elsewhere because of the timing of the changes. Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.

Judy
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It's part of my subscription from Sporty's. That and every chart I MIGHT need comes regularly.
 
Brian Austin said:
It's part of my subscription from Sporty's. That and every chart I MIGHT need comes regularly.
Click to expand...

Whew! Thanks, Brian. Sounds like you're even a shade more obsessive than I am, which is a good thing.

I'm serious, by the way. I've been shocked at the casual attitude toward this particular publication. Even people who wouldn't dream of going out without a current chart turn their noses up at the A/FD, despite the fact that other sources for the same information (if any!) are demonstrably inaccurate and out of date.

Judy
 
I've been shocked at the casual attitude toward this particular publication. Even people who wouldn't dream of going out without a current chart turn their noses up at the A/FD, despite the fact that other sources for the same information (if any!) are demonstrably inaccurate and out of date.Judy
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My stus get the idea when I ask them info found only in the AFD EVERY SINGLE session. They buy the AFD. Then it goes out of date. I start asking again. Then they buy the AFD.

There's always a current AFD in my bag. They see that, too. First impression is most powerful......
 
First off, are your charts current? Not just 'new' but valid correct dates. As to AF/D, I've used Jepp because it is convenient. I can pull the pages out and keep them in hand for the approach.
Based on a previous thread, it seems the only valid things to carry are the AF/D and a current sectional. It doesn't do any good to have AIRNAV, AOPA, or AEROPLANNER. So my next swing through the FBO, I'm getting my AF/D. I'll put up with the discomfort of having ALL the airports in my hand.
 
judypilot said:
I don't think I have EVER found anyone other than student pilots who buy them, besides me.

Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.

Judy
Click to expand...

You're not. I buy 'em and use 'em all the time.
 
I actually had a current one this weekend. I don't buy them often, but I was flying to AZ and figured I'd want to know about the other airports along the way. You never know when you have to stop in somewhere unexpectedly.
 
Well, I'm a newbie, but I've already had the AFD example dirven home in the real world. I Love the Flight Guide's format, and use it while flying. But I now keep a current AFD at all times, and reference planned airports prior to departure to make sure the Flight Guide is correct.

On one of my student solo Xc's, I was flying to Lansing. I tuned approach first, to listen in a little. Heard nothing, save for a motor glider trying in vein to reach them. I tuned ASTIS in the flip flop and activated it. The approach frequency was not correct in the Flight Guide (updated a couple times a year) but fortunately was being broadcast over the ATIS. On my return to the FBO, I picked up a current AFD and haven't been without one since :yes: .
 
AirBaker said:
Monday we were flying in to Pine Mountain Lake on a return trip from the weekend. Since we were set up for a long final, I opted to fly a straight-in instead of the full patern. I had reported a 15, 10, 6 and a 3 mile final when a 182 had turned base in front of us. I slowed down as much as possible to give more room to the other aircraft.

The 182 landed and rolled out to the end of the runway at a slow taxi pace. My wheels were about 10 feet off the ground when I decided to go around instead of land. I flew the patern and came back in.

E45 (Pine Mountain Lake) had changed its CTAF frequency from 123.05 to 122.9 earlier this year. I had reported my position on 122.9 throughout the flight, but the other aircraft aparently had been on 123.05. Earlier in the year, I was monitoring both when flying into E45. I thought it had been long enough but in hind site it wasn't. There was aparently another near-incident a few months ago with 2 other aircraft. That time there was one aircraft departing 27 while the other was final for 9.

I was mad at myself for not monitoring the other frequency. If nothing else I could have 'informed' the other guy of the new frequency.
Click to expand...

No you are not the only one as I keep one around that is currant all the time. It is keep in the pocket of the seat so anytime I have a question it is handy. I learned the hard way once by not keeping it currant. I landed at an airport that had changed its CTAF. No problem but got my attention quick enough.:) :) :)
 
judypilot said:
So, Ron, what do YOU think of the A/FDs? I don't think I have EVER found anyone other than student pilots who buy them, besides me. They just aren't that expensive, and they have all kinds of useful (and even humorous) information that isn't available elsewhere. For example, I once landed in Pratt, KS, just because of something in the "remarks" section of the A/FD.

But seriously, I've found numerous bits of information in A/FDs that you just couldn't get elsewhere because of the timing of the changes. Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.

Judy
Click to expand...

I prefer Flightguide for my VFR purposes. It's just easier to read. But I do have a current A/FD in my bag in case there's something I can't find in the Flightguide.
 
A/FDs are good I also get the updated CATF / Tower info in my Jepp Low Alt Enroute subscription with my almost weekly Chart Notam delivery from Jepp.
 
I buy the A/FD for Texas; each issue. When I travel to other areas, I don't purchase every issue for each area over which I fly, but try to either get the destination edition or check all the info before I leave. Since I have and IFR certified GPS which is current each cycle, frequencies are on there. Other information may not be like unusual traffic patters ceilings or directions.

The pilot of the Citation that landed at the airport that was closed to jet traffic at Atlantic City would certainly have benefited from checking the A/FD before landing there and winding up in the water!!

Best,

Dave
 
I have 18 current sectionals and all but one current AF/D. I have a sporty's subscription for 6 sectional charts (the state of Michigan requires FOUR!) and the AF/D that covers the Great Lakes area.
 
Joe Williams said:
I prefer Flightguide for my VFR purposes. It's just easier to read. But I do have a current A/FD in my bag in case there's something I can't find in the Flightguide.
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Joe, I couldn't agree more.....
T Bone said:
I Love the Flight Guide's format, and use it while flying. But I now keep a current AFD at all times, and reference planned airports prior to departure to make sure the Flight Guide is correct.
Click to expand...

Trouble is, the Flight Guide doesn't update as frequently as the AFD (I notice you also keep a current one). I'd suggest checking frequently used airports whenever the new AFD comes out, and verifying freqs on flight planning before going up. That way, the Flight Guide can be used as known to be accurate, and you won't run into what I almost did (If KLAN hadn't listed the correct approach frequencies on ATIS, my first student solo Xc probably would've been scrubbed with a RTB, empennage properly tucked between my legs....).
 
T Bone said:
Joe, I couldn't agree more.....


Trouble is, the Flight Guide doesn't update as frequently as the AFD (I notice you also keep a current one). I'd suggest checking frequently used airports whenever the new AFD comes out, and verifying freqs on flight planning before going up. snip
Click to expand...

Actually, that's exactly what I do. Airports and freqs I intend to use are double checked before flight. I hate surprises in the air!
 
You're all doing my heart good. Interesting, but most of the pilots I've met who are casual about these things do not participate in web forums, so far as I know. Bruce, I've done the same thing with students. I just hope they don't forget once they've graduated.

Judy
 
I too always have the current local with me. And I buy all for a cross country. There is much more than airport info too. VOR test points, FAA phone numbers, preferred IFR routes, flight watch antenna locations to name a few.

Eric
 
judypilot said:
You're all doing my heart good. Interesting, but most of the pilots I've met who are casual about these things do not participate in web forums, so far as I know. Bruce, I've done the same thing with students. I just hope they don't forget once they've graduated.

Judy
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I'm obsessive about current charts. I've been flying in the Phx area for all my two years in the air but NEVER fly without a current AFD, TAC, and sectional. It's on my kneeboard immediately after takeoff.
 
judypilot said:
So, Ron, what do YOU think of the A/FDs? I don't think I have EVER found anyone other than student pilots who buy them, besides me. They just aren't that expensive, and they have all kinds of useful (and even humorous) information that isn't available elsewhere. For example, I once landed in Pratt, KS, just because of something in the "remarks" section of the A/FD.

But seriously, I've found numerous bits of information in A/FDs that you just couldn't get elsewhere because of the timing of the changes. Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.

Judy
Click to expand...

Judy, I carry the AF/D with me on all flights. Guys laugh, glad to be the butt of the joke, but it's so much useful information for so little cost. I have a stack of them and sometimes compare information on most used aprts. Having it in the cockpit saves me from having to write something down--all I do is locate the needed info and make note of the page number. At least it's good reading while waiting for the fuel truck after hours at Podunk Intl.
 
judypilot said:
So, Ron, what do YOU think of the A/FDs?
Click to expand...
Like that other green thing, I don't leave home without it. You look in my nav bag, you find current copies of the sectionals, L-charts, approach charts, and A/FD's for the whole area in which I fly (New England down to Georgia and west to Ohio). Also, we wrote into the rule book for the university a requirement for a current A/FD and sectional on EVERY flight, even just going up in the pattern (what happens if someone prangs in the middle of the runways and you have to divert to Cambridge or Easton or Ocean City?). So that's what I think of the A/FD's.
 
judypilot said:
So, Ron, what do YOU think of the A/FDs? I don't think I have EVER found anyone other than student pilots who buy them, besides me.
Click to expand...

I'll add to your list of folks who religiously use the A/FD. A subscription service delivers the NE A/FD. When it arrives it gets taken to the airport and placed on the back seat of the Mooney; the old A/FD from the back seat goes in the recycle bin in the hanger. If I leave my home area I purchase A/FDs for the intended route and a healthy buffer area left/right of course.

That said, while conducting Wings Weekend stuff I have noticed that "kick the tires, light the fires" is more prevalent than I would have previously thought or would prefer.

But then again, I'm from Smoketown. :)
 
judypilot said:
You're all doing my heart good. Interesting, but most of the pilots I've met who are casual about these things do not participate in web forums, so far as I know. Bruce, I've done the same thing with students. I just hope they don't forget once they've graduated.

Judy
Click to expand...

Aren't you gonna tell us what they do for your laughs in Pratt ?

I always have 'em in my bag & require students use them.

Most then promptly delete their use when on their own PPL...
because Primacy is EASILY superceded by I'm-gonna-do-what-I-wantacy...
 
Dave Krall CFII said:
Aren't you gonna tell us what they do for your laughs in Pratt ?

I always have 'em in my bag & require students use them.

Most then promptly delete their use when on their own PPL...
because Primacy is EASILY superceded by I'm-gonna-do-what-I-wantacy...
Click to expand...

AFD saved my bacon one day...in fact - first flight after getting PPL. I went to a mini fly-in that my school was holding. On the way back to Albuquerque, tornadoes and thunderstorms all over the place - nastiness all over the 'burque. Had to divert to Santa Fe....pulled out the AFD and got frequency and runway layout information. Without it - I would have gotten the frequencies, but what would I have done for the runway layout? Santa Fe is kinda confusing with its layout....all runways cross in the middle.

Thats the kind of lesson that teaches me to keep my AFD within arms length anytime I'm behind the yoke and the wheels are off the ground.
 
judypilot said:
Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.

Judy
Click to expand...

I always have a fresh copy in my bag, along with a current sectional for the area of travel. Like you said, cheap insurance. And, I must be a geek, but I enjoy thumbing thru them once in a while just to look at airports. I, too, have flown to some airports just because of the writeup in the A/FD.

What I haven't bought a copy of since my private is the FAR/AIM.
 
Dave Krall CFII said:
Aren't you gonna tell us what they do for your laughs in Pratt ?

I always have 'em in my bag & require students use them.

Most then promptly delete their use when on their own PPL...
because Primacy is EASILY superceded by I'm-gonna-do-what-I-wantacy...
Click to expand...

Cap'n Ron--I knew I could count on you!

Dave (and all),

OK, here's the notation that got me to Pratt, KS: "Do not mistake lighted cattle pens for lighted runways." I was headed from E95 to MDW, with an overnight in LBL, and, well, let's just say that in the morning, my biobladder has a lower capacity than my fuel bladders, so when planning a long trip, I always include the possibility of a pit stops. That notation made me choose Pratt. I just HAD to see what they were talking about.

Turns out Pratt is one of those airports used for training during WWII that had 3 runways in a triangle. They'd dug up two of them and turned them into long feed pens that are lighted at night. I asked the airport manager about the remark in teh A/FD, and he said he was out there one night during a storm, and some guy, who had been lost, dropped out of the clouds and lined up on final for one of the cattle pens. The manager got on the radio and screamed "Go around, go around!" at the same time flipping on the pilot-controlled runway lights. The guy went around at the last possible second.

After that incident, the manager convinced the FAA to allow them to leave the runway lights on low intensity all night (that's expensive, so it took some doing to convince the FAA to allow it).

Isn't that a great story? I just attended an FAA safety seminar, and the topic was charts and A/FDs (and I learned nothing I didn't already know, which is good, I think, because it means I have been paying attention). The guy was emphatic about carrying the "ugly green books", and so I told him about Pratt, and I think he's going to use it in his presentations in the future.

Judy
 
That is cool.
Hey, do you really need FAA approval to leave rwy lights ON at night? Amazing.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
That is cool.
Hey, do you really need FAA approval to leave rwy lights ON at night? Amazing.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the FAA pays the electric bill, and even at low intensity, those bulbs burn a lot of energy. PCL works 99% of the time, so why not save the money? But it is a good lesson on why people should pay attention to what they're doing and try not to get lost....in weather.....at night. I don't think the guy was instrument rated, but I'm not sure. I really do find it scary how incompetent some pilots are.

Judy
 
Brian Austin said:
It's part of my subscription from Sporty's. That and every chart I MIGHT need comes regularly.
Click to expand...

Me, too. I get the A/FD, the NY and Washington sectionals, and the NYC and Philly TAC's. (I live on the NY/Philly boundary)

Anything I need less often I order separately or buy at the FBO.
 
That's it... I'm going to Pratt right away !

TKS !

judypilot said:
Cap'n Ron--I knew I could count on you!

Dave (and all),

OK, here's the notation that got me to Pratt, KS: "Do not mistake lighted cattle pens for lighted runways." I was headed from E95 to MDW, with an overnight in LBL, and, well, let's just say that in the morning, my biobladder has a lower capacity than my fuel bladders, so when planning a long trip, I always include the possibility of a pit stops. That notation made me choose Pratt. I just HAD to see what they were talking about.

Turns out Pratt is one of those airports used for training during WWII that had 3 runways in a triangle. They'd dug up two of them and turned them into long feed pens that are lighted at night. I asked the airport manager about the remark in teh A/FD, and he said he was out there one night during a storm, and some guy, who had been lost, dropped out of the clouds and lined up on final for one of the cattle pens. The manager got on the radio and screamed "Go around, go around!" at the same time flipping on the pilot-controlled runway lights. The guy went around at the last possible second.

After that incident, the manager convinced the FAA to allow them to leave the runway lights on low intensity all night (that's expensive, so it took some doing to convince the FAA to allow it).

Isn't that a great story? I just attended an FAA safety seminar, and the topic was charts and A/FDs (and I learned nothing I didn't already know, which is good, I think, because it means I have been paying attention). The guy was emphatic about carrying the "ugly green books", and so I told him about Pratt, and I think he's going to use it in his presentations in the future.

Judy
Click to expand...
 
I also have a standing subscription to the Northeast AF/D and carry it in my flight bag. Like you said, cheap insurance.
 
judypilot said:
Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.

Even if I am, though, I'm not gonna stop.
Click to expand...

It's part of my regular chart subscription, too... I've always obtained the latest AF/D before a flight. On my "gotta have" list.

Troy
 
judypilot said:
Please tell me I'm not the only one who actually reads the things and carries them.
Click to expand...
Not at all, I have a Vrotate (or whatever they call themselves now, Aviation Publications or something) subscription to the East Central A/FD and the 4 sectionals that cover Michigan. When I finish my IR I will probably add on the approach plates and the two low altitude charts that cover MI.

That said, I actually prefer the Michigan Airport Directory and MDOT VFR chart for routine use - but I always carry a current A/FD and sectional in my flight bag.

Liz
 
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