@$#% Punks

AdamZ

AdamZ

Touchdown! Greaser!
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Messages
14,872
Location
Montgomery County PA
Display Name
Adam Zucker
Home Airfield
KLOM
Went to the airport yesterday to speak with the FBO owner who is major league annoyed. Turns out over night some A$$ vandalized the airport by taking a hammer to the PAPIs busting up a taxi way sign knocking out some REILs and a few runway lights. The runway lights were easily replaced but he tells me the PAPIs cost 30K each.
I first thought it was perhaps one of the Anti Airport neighbors but most signs point to it being some Punk A$$ kid. Boy would I like to get my hands on him or her ( See I'm being PC here). The area surrounding the airport is pretty well to do and I'm betting its some wealthy little Sh*t.
If they catch him any ideas what to suggest to the court as to how to teach him a lesson. I mean a real lesson about how idiotic and dangerous what he or she did was. All though skinning him alive would be tempting. Teaching this person the seriousness of what they did ALONG WITH PUNISHMENT would be great.
 
Besides restitution, make him (do you REALLY think it's a her?) participate in the replacement labor. Take him up in a plane and show him what the lights do. Do some unexpected aerobatics...just to keep things lively.
 
AdamZ said:
If they catch him any ideas what to suggest to the court as to how to teach him a lesson. I mean a real lesson about how idiotic and dangerous what he or she did was. All though skinning him alive would be tempting. Teaching this person the seriousness of what they did ALONG WITH PUNISHMENT would be great.
Click to expand...

Option 1. Make him work as a line boy for the FBO wearing a shirt that says "I am the airport vandal/criminal). Also make him do community service at the airport, cleaning, mowing the lawn, servant, whatever until the cost of the damage is recouped.

Option 2. Take him up in a Huey and play "you are a VC/NVA spy".
 
Anthony said:
Option 2. Take him up in a Huey and play "you are a VC/NVA spy".
Click to expand...

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: ROLMFAO Anthony when ever you get back here we are going to have too much fun!
 
AdamZ said:
Teaching this person the seriousness of what they did ALONG WITH PUNISHMENT would be great.
Click to expand...

Adam,

You're a lawyer so probably have access to the "official rules" but my understanding is that destruction of an aircraft or airport property is a federal offense, a felony. Simply tresspassing or siponing fuel from an aircraft counts. Call the FBI.

Len
 
Under no circumstances take him (or her) up in an aircraft.
That would be a reward, not a punishment!

--Kath
 
kath said:
Under no circumstances take him (or her) up in an aircraft.
That would be a reward, not a punishment!
Click to expand...

Kath,

Anthony was referencing a interrogation tactic reportedly from the Vietnam era. Kind of like flour bombing but with enemy combatants instead of common baking ingredients.

Len
 
We had one or more maroons go from plane to plane breaking windows. Dozens were damaged. As has been said, each hit is a federal offense. Try to get the local cops to pay attention, though.

Maybe when you call the feds you should say the witnesses said they might have been wearing burnooses.
 
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We caught a local kid pulling up all the stakes in one of our subdivisions that was under development. Actually, a neighbor saw him and let one of our folks know. We got the bill from the engineer to re-stake, walked over to his house and presented it to his parents. :target: Told them they could either pay it or we would report it to the police. Wheeeew!!! They did some things to that kid our justice system doesn't allow. We never did press collection, but the kid was walking sideways for awhile, was real nice to our folks and we never had any problem again.


Dave
 
AdamZ said:
Went to the airport yesterday to speak with the FBO owner who is major league annoyed. Turns out over night some A$$ vandalized the airport by taking a hammer to the PAPIs busting up a taxi way sign knocking out some REILs and a few runway lights. The runway lights were easily replaced but he tells me the PAPIs cost 30K each.
I first thought it was perhaps one of the Anti Airport neighbors but most signs point to it being some Punk A$$ kid. Boy would I like to get my hands on him or her ( See I'm being PC here). The area surrounding the airport is pretty well to do and I'm betting its some wealthy little Sh*t.
If they catch him any ideas what to suggest to the court as to how to teach him a lesson. I mean a real lesson about how idiotic and dangerous what he or she did was. All though skinning him alive would be tempting. Teaching this person the seriousness of what they did ALONG WITH PUNISHMENT would be great.
Click to expand...

Mowin lawns and cleaning toilets doesn't relly fit the bill, does it? How about assigning the vandal airport-specific mx chores for oh, 400 hours? He gets to ride along with mx personnel and does the grunt work under close supervision. The lesson there will be a finer appreciation of not only what it takes to maintain the equipment but also how important that equipment is. Of course, that is in addition to any sentence.
 
kath said:
Under no circumstances take him (or her) up in an aircraft.
That would be a reward, not a punishment!
Click to expand...
Not if, as was done in the referenced incidents, you only took them up, not down, and no parachutes provided. However, if it really is a kid who doesn't appreciate the consequences of his actions, taking him up and showing him a night landing without lights might be a real head-turner and put the kid back on the path to righteousness. Remember, you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.

But the point is well made that this is a Federal offense and the FBI should be notified. And save the one-way flight for the second offense.
 
IME, this sounds like juvenile mischief. Mindless and not all that fun. Which pretty much means the feds will not be in the picture. This will be local law enforcement and juvenile court for the little b------s (a legal term I sometimes use for our juvenile clients here, who can be real dumb punks). I would think that significant community service, like washing airplanes, would be in order. Perhaps helping with the mowing and weed control that are eternal at an airport. In juvenile, they can get probation, they can get placed somewhere, they can get put in "secure placement", they can get confined in what is basically juvenile jail. This sort of property damage would not ordinarily remove them from the home for a long period of time. But that probation can carry many punitive, humiliating, and unpleasant tasks with it.

For sure, the "children" (as the system calls them) should be shown the importance of those lights. I like the suggestion of a light's off landing at night. That should scare the crap out of some wiseas(s) teenager.

Jim G
 
Dave Siciliano said:
walked over to his house and presented it to his parents. :target: Told them they could either pay it or we would report it to the police. Wheeeew!!! They did some things to that kid our justice system doesn't allow.
Click to expand...

This assumes that the parents care and are trying to raise a good kid... which is not always the case. I'm glad it worked in your case it's always better to try that first. They may even make him/her spend time working at the airport to make up for it.

Missa
 
Considering the current anxiety over aviation related events, I think the FEDS would take a very dim view of tresspassing at an airport much less vandalizing it. If the locals don't do anything constructive, maybe the National Response Center is the place to call (1 866 GA SECURE).

Actually, I was surprized with the response (or lack of it) in the Ct late night joyride. Maybe the FEDS are too wrapped up in the ADIZ to worry about the rest of the country.
 
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Dave Siciliano said:
We caught a local kid pulling up all the stakes in one of our subdivisions that was under development. Actually, a neighbor saw him and let one of our folks know. We got the bill from the engineer to re-stake, walked over to his house and presented it to his parents.
Click to expand...
In college I worked on a survey crew. There was one subdivision where we'd stake out a road, next day they were run over. This went on for a couple of nights. So then we staked it, and in the middle of the line of stakes walked a pace off the line of stakes and drove rebar into the ground, leaving about 18 inches off the ground. The next day, half the stakes were mowed down and there was oil on the ground near one of the rebars. Didn't have that problem again.
 
Adam,

Was this at Wings?

RE - working off the cost of the damage at the airport.

If the PAPIs are $30,000 each...are there two or four of them....either way...that is several years of grass mowing, gas pumping and snow shoveling. No way anyone is gonna do that based on a gentleman's agreement. Besides, who would want this person on the property for that long anyway.

I'd call the law and I'd make sure they knew that the cost of the equipment was significant. No reaction from law enforcement, I'd call the local newspaper, let them take pictures of the busted equipment and let them know all the safety of flight issues.

Len
 
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Len Lanetti said:
Adam,

Was this at Wings?

RE - working off the cost of the damage at the airport.

If the PAPIs are $30,000 each...are there two or four of them....either way...that is several years of grass mowing, gas pumping and snow shoveling. No way anyone is gonna do that based on a gentleman's agreement. Besides, who would want this person on the property for that long anyway.

I'd call the law and I'd make sure they knew that the cost of the equipment was significant. No reaction from law enforcement, I'd call the local newspaper, let them take pictures of the busted equipment and let them know all the safety of flight issues.

Len
Click to expand...

But with it being a felony - the insurance company can and probably will go after the kid (or parents) for restitution/reimbursement of the PAPI costs, if you find out what kid did it.
 
Missa said:
This assumes that the parents care and are trying to raise a good kid... which is not always the case. I'm glad it worked in your case it's always better to try that first. They may even make him/her spend time working at the airport to make up for it.

Missa
Click to expand...

Yes Missa, we were prepared for the parents to blow us off, in which case we were prepared to report the incident to the police and take legal action against the parents. Even if not successful, we would have filed suit and caused them to focus on the matter. But these parents took matters into their own hands--and other objects from what we were told :D

Dave
 
silver-eagle said:
Considering the current anxiety over aviation related events, I think the FEDS would take a very dim view of tresspassing at an airport much less vandalizing it. If the locals don't do anything constructive, maybe the National Response Center is the place to call (1 866 GA SECURE).

Actually, I was surprized with the response (or lack of it) in the Ct late night joyride. Maybe the FEDS are too wrapped up in the ADIZ to worry about the rest of the country.
Click to expand...

John:

Couple weekends ago some of us at my hanger watched a black pick up truck and a second car get through an access gate behind someone before the gate closed. The person that legally went through the gate pulled too far forward and the other vehicles got in. The first vehicle stopped and the guy (who we all knew) waived at the other vehicles for them to stop; they waived back and kept going. We watched the suspisious vehicles stop down the taxiway; go to the front of a locked hanger and mill around; then one vehicle backed into a telephone pole. We had been contemplating what to do. We called the hot line you mentioned. They told us to call 911 and report it to the local police--which we did. By the time the local police arrived over ten minutes later, the parties above were gone. The 800 number folks didn't do a thing. The did ask why we were calling and we informed them unidentified parties had come through the access gate. They didn't ask anything more; just told us to call 911.

Oh, I got to give a report and discuss the incident with the local police for some time. They said they'd keep an eye out for these folks and to call them immediately if we saw them again. :confused:

Dave
 
Ken Ibold said:
In college I worked on a survey crew. There was one subdivision where we'd stake out a road, next day they were run over. This went on for a couple of nights. So then we staked it, and in the middle of the line of stakes walked a pace off the line of stakes and drove rebar into the ground, leaving about 18 inches off the ground. The next day, half the stakes were mowed down and there was oil on the ground near one of the rebars. Didn't have that problem again.
Click to expand...

I'll keep this in mind Ken!! Unfortunately, the stakes removed in this case weren't along a road.

Dave
 
Yes Len it was wings. Local PD were called out. I know some pretty well and I know they will make sure to pursue this. Problem is catching vandals is so darn difficult unless someone sees them.
 
AdamZ said:
Problem is catching vandals is so darn difficult unless someone sees them.
Click to expand...

Yep and while the "kids" were stupid enough to do it they are probably smart enough to keep their mouths shut.

Len
 
Every now and then the punks get rewarded -

One of our local dummies thought it would be funny to throw up ON his teacher.

He's just been sentenced to four months of cleaning puke out of the back seats of police cars.
 
Dave Siciliano said:
Yes Missa, we were prepared for the parents to blow us off, in which case we were prepared to report the incident to the police and take legal action against the parents. Even if not successful, we would have filed suit and caused them to focus on the matter. But these parents took matters into their own hands--and other objects from what we were told :D

Dave
Click to expand...

It's so nice to hear about parents who care about how their kids turn out... I bet your stake kid learned his lesson better from his parents then he would ever had learned it from the law.

Hope they find the airport kid and his parents are willing to make the same point. :eek:

Missa
 
Matthew said:
Every now and then the punks get rewarded -

One of our local dummies thought it would be funny to throw up ON his teacher.

He's just been sentenced to four months of cleaning puke out of the back seats of police cars.
Click to expand...

Now that's Justice at work! :vomit:

Missa
 
Dave;
If that is the response you got from the National Response Center, then someone is blowing smoke up a lot of skirts. They have been touted as a coordination point for emergency response for the AOPA Airport Watch as well as the US CG's Waterway Watch. So, what IS their purpose, where's the money going if not to 'coordinate', and how can we expect to forstall the congress from infringing on us if the system doesn't work?
More buracracy, no benefits. Government in action.
 
Got this from a friend; seems appropriate.

Subject: How Government Works

A NEW DISCOVERY

A Breakthrough In Government.
A major research institution has recently announced the discovery of
the heaviest element yet known to science. The new element has been

named "Governmentium".

Governmentium has one neutron, 12 assistant neutrons, 75 deputy

neutrons, giving it an atomic mass of 312 particles. These 312 particles are held together by forces called morons, which are surrounded by vast quantities of lepton like particles called peons.
Since Governmentium has no electrons, it is inert. However, it can

be detected because it will always impede every action with which it comes

into contact. A minute amount of Governmentium causes a reaction to take four days to complete, when it would normally take less than a second.

Governmentium has a normal half-life of 4 years. It does not decay, but instead under goes a reorganization in which a portion of the assistant neutrons and deputy neutrons exchange places. In fact, Governmentium's Mass will actually increase over time since each reorganization will cause morons to become neutrons, forming isodopes.

This characteristic of moron promotion leads some scientists to believe that Governmentium is formed whenever morons reach a certain quantity in concentration. This hypothetical quantity is referred to as "Critical Morass."

When catalyzed with money, Governmentium becomes Administratium-an element which radiates just as much energy as Governmentium since it has half as many "peons" but twice as many morons.

 
Len Lanetti said:
Yep and while the "kids" were stupid enough to do it they are probably smart enough to keep their mouths shut.

Len
Click to expand...


That would be inconsistent with what I usually see. Often, our local law enforcement has one of these "difficult to solve" crimes solved by a stupid defendant who either brags to his friends or confesses. It won't take long for the story of these kids and their "derring do" to make it around the local school/camp/etc. The cops will catch them. And juveniles usually are quick to admit, as they haven't learned that they have rights that it is wise for them to exercise.

Good luck Adam. Sounds like you are going to have a lawn mowing crew into the extended future. And I do mean crew. Teenagers are a lot like dogs. One running alone will often not run deer. Two or more... That's a pack, and a different story. This sort of stupidity usually involves a "pack". Sometimes armed with a video camera.

Jim G
 
Regarding AOPA's Airport Watch and the USCG Waterway Watch and the National Response Center, at the bottom of the flyers it says: "To report suspicious activity, call the National Response Center. For immediate danger to life or property 911."
Seems to me, they either want to know or they don't. So like I said, more government buracracy at work.... or not.
Oh, and for those who need it, the numbers are:
USCG Waterway Watch 800-424-8802 or 877-24watch
AOPA Airport Watch 866-GA-SECURE
I guess it is a good thing I have 911 on speeddial and not the National Response Center.
 
" More buracracy, no benefits. Government in action."

THATS the purpose! Your starting to catch on!
 
silver-eagle said:
...I guess it is a good thing I have 911 on speeddial...
Click to expand...

The emergency responders don't want you to have 911 on speeddail. They get to many accidental calls where they get to hear random conversations.

They have to make an effort to see if they can figure out where the caller is and dispatch. There'll be a lot of that when GPRS becomes common and they can locate mobile phones.
 
Here's a didja know that I just learned recently....cell phones that are no longer in service must still be able to make 911 calls. Learned it during a Cub Scout leader training meeting.

Len
 
Len Lanetti said:
Here's a didja know that I just learned recently....cell phones that are no longer in service must still be able to make 911 calls. Learned it during a Cub Scout leader training meeting.

Len
Click to expand...

That's why a lot of groups (like women's shelters) like to get old cell phones. They give them out to people to have access to 9-1-1 in emergencies. I've donated several old phones to battered women shelters and aid groups.
 
Len Lanetti said:
Here's a didja know that I just learned recently....cell phones that are no longer in service must still be able to make 911 calls. Learned it during a Cub Scout leader training meeting.

Len
Click to expand...

Yep. That's why we still have, and keep charged, the prepaid cellphone I bought Cathy when she was preggers.
 
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