Preheating temp?

[ScottM]

I had an IR lesson flight tonight, and the 160hp Lycoming in a C-172R started right up, to my surprise. Here's the METAR at start-up:

Bad night for IR training. Great night for a sightseeing VFR flight though!!

How is the IR rating coming?

 

[nddons]

Bad night for IR training. Great night for a sightseeing VFR flight though!!

How is the IR rating coming?

Yea, that's what my CFII said.

It was moving well until I learned about this icing thing in Wisconsin. I was flying at least once a week (twice in the summer), but then had to cancel more than 10 times since mid-November due to Wx, either icing, snow, or mega-winds.

Tonight was tough, but I felt I just had to get up. Since I hadn't been under the hood since 10 November, we did some basic hood work and then flew up to West Bend to do the LOC RWY 31 approach. Winds were stiff and it was very choppy below 3,000ft, and not a pretty approach.

Also, preflights SUCK when it's this cold and windy. I had to watch to make sure I didn't rush through anything.

Still, it felt very good to get some distance between myself and terra firma for 1.4 hours.

Thanks for asking.

 

[gprellwitz]

Stan, you should have come to the get-together at Pilot Pete's! Just shoot an approach into ORD, go missed, and bounce over to 06C VFR! (Schaumburg doesn't have any approaches, probably because it's so close to O'Hare.)

 

[nddons]

Stan, you should have come to the get-together at Pilot Pete's! Just shoot an approach into ORD, go missed, and bounce over to 06C VFR! (Schaumburg doesn't have any approaches, probably because it's so close to O'Hare.)

I know, I was bummed when I saw the pictures. Actually I lost track of that meeting with PJ (I think he was weathered out once) and it fell off my radar. Hopefully next time!

I'll mention doing practice approaches into ORD to my 9,000 hour CFII. When he's done laughing, I'll say let's just grab a coffee at Pilot Pete's instead!

 

[Geico266]

I have heard stories about bush pilots draining the oil at night and putting it on the stove over night to keep it hot. They would add the oil back in the engine the next day and take off.

 

[ScottM]

Stan, you should have come to the get-together at Pilot Pete's! Just shoot an approach into ORD, go missed, and bounce over to 06C VFR! (Schaumburg doesn't have any approaches, probably because it's so close to O'Hare.)

Normally you shoot one of the DPA approaches in and then cancel IFR and go VFR to 06C. I have done this once.

 

[gprellwitz]

Normally you shoot one of the DPA approaches in and then cancel IFR and go VFR to 06C. I have done this once.

It's MUCH more fun to shoot an ORD approach!

 

[gprellwitz]

I know, I was bummed when I saw the pictures. Actually I lost track of that meeting with PJ (I think he was weathered out once) and it fell off my radar. Hopefully next time!

I'll mention doing practice approaches into ORD to my 9,000 hour CFII. When he's done laughing, I'll say let's just grab a coffee at Pilot Pete's instead!

Hey, Leslie's shot an approach to ORD TO LANDING!

 

[Ted]

I have heard stories about bush pilots draining the oil at night and putting it on the stove over night to keep it hot. They would add the oil back in the engine the next day and take off.

I remember seeing a story about someone who had to do this for similar reasons. If you don't have a pre-heater, it makes sense. It's good to at least get the oil warmed up, although it is best to get the cylinders warmed as well. As such, if you can get some pre-heaters that do the cylinders and the oil, all the better.

 

[Dan Thomas]

We run seven flight training aircraft, all Lyc-powered. Four are O-320s, one is an O-540, one an IO-360, and one an O-235. We store them in a hangar heated to +5°C (41°F), and that's where they'll be started, max, on a winter morning. After that they sit outside and are blanketed until the next flight, unless it's pretty cold (-15°C/-5°F) and they sit too long. We don't fly them at all below -25°C/-13°F; the CHTs and oil temps just won't come up enough for safe operation below that, and they'll tend to quit in the overshoot after an extended glide.

Only one of these engines minds this treatment. The O-235 has low CHT and oil temps anyway, even in the summer, and condensation in the case and on the cylinders causes corrosion that results in excessive cylinder wear, requiring a top at about half TBO. All of the others make it to TBO with the compressions in the high 70s and no metal in the filters. These are training aircraft, remember: frequently flown but often abused, and make TBO even without preheating below 40°F as so many pilots think is necessary.

We use Aeroshell 15W50 exclusively year-round. The multigrade allows oil to flw at lower temps; too many cold engine wear problems are because guys are using 80, which stiffens up and the pump can't suck it up from the case very fast. Put a jug of it in the freezer sometime and see how it pours. Big mistake: running the RPM well over 1000 right after startup when cold. No lubrication once the pumps starts cavitating.

The Aeroshell also has the Lycoming LW16702 additive in it to stop cam and lifter wear and we have absolutely no trouble with valve train problems. We used to have such wear when using other oils without the additive.

Our biggest hassle with cold starts involves too much prime, which just floods things and wets the plugs, or priming too early, with the prime condensing on the intake walls and running down into the carb. Prime should happen immediately before cranking. And if, with a really cold engine, the engine starts and then quits and won't catch again, the plugs have frosted over with the moisture from combustion and they'll not fire any more at all. You'll just kill the battery, and a dead battery's freeze point comes way up. It'll freeze and split.

Dan

 

[sba55]

These are training aircraft, remember: frequently flown but often abused, and make TBO even without preheating below 40°F as so many pilots think is necessary.

Dan,

Just to clarify - I don't think pre-heating is necessary. Frankly, the majority of engines break due to other issues, like running at certain mixture settings, not running often enough, etc. That said, pre-heating is one of the many tools that can give you an advantage. My previous plane is now TBO+650 and running great!

-Felix

 

[murphey]

How the heck do you guys keep the engines warm enough when you are flying? My flight back from FL where I hit -20C temps really stressed the low end of the oil temp gauge. When I flew the Cessna we had little covers that went on the cowl to close up the openings. but the Piper has nothing like that. Do you guys just tape up the oil cooler and close the cowl inlets with something?

dunno about a cessna, but on the cherokees, there's an owner/operator-installable cover on the oil cooler. Supposed to put it on when the ambient temp is 50F and below. It's really nothing more than a 4 or 5 inch on a side light-weight aluminum. Tape works, but I always worry about it being sucked into the oil cooler itself. Couple years ago I grabbed some aluminum sheeting, cut it to size (I have privs at the local A&P school and can use the equipment if it's available). When it's really cold, works great. But the problem (advantage to the tape!) is when it's cold in the early morning but warms up after lunch. I've noticed AM temps around 180 (middle of the green) but after lunch, it's pushing close to the red line on the upper end of the oil temps. I cut about 3/4 inch off the bottom of the cover this morning. Seemed to solve the problem today. Took off when it was 0F, came home at 55F.