Poor use of information.

Your Garmin is a dedicated device and does not need to share resources with a phone, a calendar, a calculator, email, music and player, web browser, camera, angry birds, weather app, etc.

I did allude to that when I mentioned that most cell phone users prefer not storing the whole world so they could use the RAM for other things.

Also, your Garmin does not have the detail (roads, traffic, satellite, bike paths, footpaths,) that a phone does. My Nexus 4 will show me my house to where I can make out my mailbox.
Depends on which Garmin. My Nüvi has roads & traffic (delivered by FM radio stations), a map of London, UK with the tube schedules in it. I was surprised it also had the "public footpaths" on the map as well. Garmin sold GPS with av charts, roads, and marine charts installed in the same unit. They have units dedicated to hiking as well. All very useful "off the grid". I know I saved a ton of money not using phone maps in England.

Speaking of 'money from data plans'...any idea who is turning the Internet Provider industry on it's ear by offering it's own service in 3 major markets? Kansas City, Austin, and I forget the third...Utah somewhere I think. This company thinks the Service Providers for years has been ripping off the American consumer by charging WAY too much for limited bandwidth. They are lighting up the fiber in those three markets providing 1 Gig download speed for $60 per month. (At 1 Gig you could download an HD movie in 2 to 3 seconds)

Yup...Google is doing that.


edit to add: Provo UT is the third city. Here's a link:

Google Fiber
Probably the same reason Google came out with it's own phone operating system for phones, tablets, and even its own tablets. They get control over the platform, advertising, and sale of apps and a cut of the profits from everything.
 
Here's the overview:

Near as I can tell, out of everyone on this thread I am the only one supporting Google. I suspect each and every one of you use Google however. If you don't, well I really don't care. It's not my job to convert anybody to anything. I think they are a great company, but that's me.

Search
 
Here's the overview:

Near as I can tell, out of everyone on this thread I am the only one supporting Google. I suspect each and every one of you use Google however. If you don't, well I really don't care. It's not my job to convert anybody to anything. I think they are a great company, but that's me.

Search
I don't think anyone thinks they are a particularly bad company, but they are out to make a profit. NTTAWWT, but they aren't benevolent either. Facebook is another data-mining company, as is Apple.

I think most of the posters are realists- Google gives useful information, but at the cost of getting information from its users. As mentioned earlier, for Google traffic to work, the users need to supply periodic location information so the traffic can be determined (crowd sourced data). Some of the data we provide is used to generate profiles that are used to sell us something.
 
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I did allude to that when I mentioned that most cell phone users prefer not storing the whole world so they could use the RAM for other things.

Depends on which Garmin. My Nüvi has roads & traffic (delivered by FM radio stations), a map of London, UK with the tube schedules in it. I was surprised it also had the "public footpaths" on the map as well. Garmin sold GPS with av charts, roads, and marine charts installed in the same unit. They have units dedicated to hiking as well. All very useful "off the grid". I know I saved a ton of money not using phone maps in England.

Probably the same reason Google came out with it's own phone operating system for phones, tablets, and even its own tablets. They get control over the platform, advertising, and sale of apps and a cut of the profits from everything.

Or why they purchased competitor Doubleclick, including Performics, renamed it Google Affiliate Network, and ran it into the ground. Incidentally, a few days before Google announced that they were killing GAN, they were still accepting enrollments. They were also sending me notices of new advertisers who (presumably) were good matches for my sites. Now Google's giving a giant middle finger to all of their GAN publishers and advertisers.

I actually feel more sorry for the advertisers than the publishers. Revenue on GAN has sucked ever since Google took it over, so from my perspective, good riddance to it. But for those advertisers who trusted Google with their businesses' life blood and have no other affiliate channels, it could be catastrophic.

On the other hand, it could just be a form of commercial Darwinism. Any company whose management is silly enough to trust Google probably has bigger problems, anyway.

-Rich
 
I don't think anyone thinks they are a particularly bad company, but they are out to make a profit. NTTAWWT, but they aren't benevolent either. Facebook is another data-mining company, as is Apple.

I think most of the posters are realists- Google gives useful information, but at the cost of getting information from its users. As mentioned earlier, for Google traffic to work, the users need to supply periodic location information so the traffic can be determined (crowd sourced data). Some of the data we provide is used to generate profiles that are used to sell us something.

Not a word in there I don't agree with.

RJM, Google goes through buys sprees snatching up dozens of companies in short time. Sometimes they buy for the technology and sometime to acquire talent. Not fair to hold up 1 or 2 acquisitions and say, "see? That's what they do!"
 
Here's the overview:

Near as I can tell, out of everyone on this thread I am the only one supporting Google. I suspect each and every one of you use Google however. If you don't, well I really don't care. It's not my job to convert anybody to anything. I think they are a great company, but that's me.

Search

I agree with you. Google not only helps me get an incredible amount of information for no more cost than having ads that I am easily able to totally ignore, but they also pay a couple a couple friends quite well to work for them. According to them, Google is a fantastic place to work.
 
Not a word in there I don't agree with.

RJM, Google goes through buys sprees snatching up dozens of companies in short time. Sometimes they buy for the technology and sometime to acquire talent. Not fair to hold up 1 or 2 acquisitions and say, "see? That's what they do!"

It's just the most recent example. As in, the imminent death of GAN was announced about two weeks ago. And a day or two before, they were still enrolling publishers and sending out new advertiser notices.

Nothing wrong with that, though, right? I'm sure they had a good reason. Maybe some time between signing up their last publishers and advertisers, and the start of business the next morning, they figured out it wasn't as profitable as they'd thought it was the day before; so they decided to throw their publishers and their advertisers under the bus together, thus saving time, being the efficient company that they are.

Again, this is not the only example of the kind of "great company" Google is. It's just the most recent one. But hey, don't take my word for it. Google it.

-Rich
 
Here's the overview:

Near as I can tell, out of everyone on this thread I am the only one supporting Google. I suspect each and every one of you use Google however. If you don't, well I really don't care. It's not my job to convert anybody to anything. I think they are a great company, but that's me.

Being critical of something doesn't mean they are a bad company or that one doesn't support their exisitance. My concerns stem from the value proposition and the fact that people don't really understand what/how information is collected/used and the value of that information. The "user" of the so-called "free" service is, in fact, the product being sold. If you're going to pimp me out, at least pay me what I'm worth (in cash or in kind).

The pimp -er media/online company - will always provide as little value as possible to the user while charging the maximum possible amount to the advertiser. That maximizes profit margin. When the user is kept in the dark as to the value of thier personal details, the user can never obtain maximum value for their information.

I worked for many years in a "traditional" media company - uses a similar business model of selling viewers/listeners to advertisers - you'd know who it is instantly. Although we collected whatever data we could, the fact remained that personal info was of limited usefulness for the mass-media offerings (by definition, we couldn't personalize the product). We could never realize the full value potential from advertising because of that - the holy grail was the kind of situation that Google, Apple, Spotify, Facebook, etc have today. Before I left, we were well on the road to creating online services that were sold as "providing services to the user", but were really all about collecting information to sell to advertisers.

So, while you may not care about being identified, classified, and sold, some of us are uncomfortable with a commercial company acting as big brother and brokering that information. Even if it's done by computer, the information is still collected and mined. Having seen, in person, the capabilities of that data mining, I can tell you that on a daily basis I question whether or not it's good for society & mankind. Information is power.

Enjoy Google. Some of us remain cautious of companies (or governments) that know too much about us. I'd rather have some control of my personal information....
 
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Being critical of something doesn't mean they are a bad company or that one doesn't support their exisitance. My concerns stem from the value proposition and the fact that people don't really understand what/how information is collected/used and the value of that information. The "user" of the so-called "free" service is, in fact, the product being sold. If you're going to pimp me out, at least pay me what I'm worth (in cash or in kind).

The pimp -er media/online company - will always provide as little value as possible to the user while charging the maximum possible amount to the advertiser. That maximizes profit margin. When the user is kept in the dark as to the value of thier personal details, the user can never obtain maximum value for their information.

I worked for many years in a "traditional" media company - uses a similar business model of selling viewers/listeners to advertisers - you'd know who it is instantly. Although we collected whatever data we could, the fact remained that personal info was of limited usefulness for the mass-media offerings (by definition, we couldn't personalize the product). We could never realize the full value potential from advertising because of that - the holy grail was the kind of situation that Google, Apple, Spotify, Facebook, etc have today. Before I left, we were well on the road to creating online services that were sold as "providing services to the user", but were really all about collecting information to sell to advertisers.

So, while you may not care about being identified, classified, and sold, some of us are uncomfortable with a commercial company acting as big brother and brokering that information. Even if it's done by computer, the information is still collected and mined. Having seen, in person, the capabilities of that data mining, I can tell you that on a daily basis I question whether or not it's good for society & mankind. Information is power.

Enjoy Google. Some of us remain cautious of companies (or governments) that know too much about us. I'd rather have some control of my personal information....

I just now had a discussion with a client that's somewhat related to this topic.

Briefly, the client is a wholesaler of certain industrial stuff, and has maybe 25 users with email addresses. The person I deal with there is the owner's son, who recently came of age and took over that end of the business.

The first thing the son did upon arriving was require that all of the users use gmail to collect their mail. They previously had used Thunderbird by default, although they were allowed to use other standard email clients if they preferred.

It didn't take the son long to realize that gmail basically sucks when it comes to handling third-party mail. The biggest problem was that from time to time, there would be delays -- sometimes several hours -- before the external mail was available to be read using gmail.

I suggested to the son that they simply use a regular email client, but he refused. He's a fanboy, and Google can do no wrong as far as he's concerned. His solution was to have his users all create gmail addresses, and then create forwarders to forward their email to gmail; and then the employees would reply from their domain email addresses from within gmail.

The problem with that solution is that it means, firstly, that the users have an extra step they have to go through; and secondly, that they get two copies of every email. A third problem is that from time to time, gmail stops emptying the boxes on the servers for no apparent reason, and they fill up.

Now... I dunno... Gmail is a webmail client, and not a very special one at that as far as I'm concerned. In fact, they're all pretty much the same as far as I'm concerned. I happen to like RoundCube best, in fact, which I provide to all my clients if they want to use it. I really don't get the attraction of gmail. It's neither better nor worse than any of the other dozens of webmail clients out there, in my opinion.

And then there are the privacy issues. Google scrapes all the mail it handles. Now, if he has no problems with that, then I frankly don't, either. But his clients may have a problem with it. I explained this to the son during the hundredth discussion we've had about the question of why there's sometimes a delay of several hours between the forwarded version of an email and the original showing up in his users' gmail accounts.

As a test some time ago, I deleted some users' addresses and just left the aliases in place. The problem with this was that when the users tried to reply through gmail, the sends failed, of course, because the alias wasn't an authenticated user. I was going to try a few things to fix that, but the son told me to just leave the actual addresses and the forwarders in place.

So now his complaint is that the forwarded mail arrives so far ahead of the actual, original email that users sometimes forget they already took care of whatever the email was about.

My advice to the son, as it has been for years, is to use a standard email client. But that's the one solution he won't consider. It has to be gmail. Why, I have no idea.

I'm ready to just put them on Google's mail service altogether, to tell you the truth, just so I don't have to listen to his complaints any more. Let him try to find a living human being at Google the next time he has an email problem.

In the meantime, Lord, save me from the fanboys.

-Rich
 
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Please don't lump us all together. From your story it sounds like gmail isn't working for him. If that's the case then he'd be a fool to not fix it or find an alternative solution. I've never said you should use Google no matter what. Your story seems to imply all us fanboys are of that mind set.

I use gmail for personal email and it works just fine. I do not run a business off it. If I tried to run my business on it and it didn't work I'd be the first to dump it. There are plenty of Google products I don't use.
 
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