Partial panel

[GauzeGuy]

I put 1.0 under the hood today practicing the ILS Y 29R at KBJC today. The first couple went pretty well, so I tried one partial panel. To make life easier, I used the 430's graphical track on the position page for part of the approach.

So, this makes me wonder. On the instrument check ride, will an examiner usually allow use of the 430 and/or the iPad GPS for added SA during a partial panel approach?

 

[bbchien]

Nope. They turn all the goodies off. Timed turns, freeze the TC and if no climb/descent, look at the compass. Keep track in your head, the number of standard rate seconds away you were from you last known heading....

 

[spiderweb]

I put 1.0 under the hood today practicing the ILS Y 29R at KBJC today. The first couple went pretty well, so I tried one partial panel. To make life easier, I used the 430's graphical track on the position page for part of the approach.

So, this makes me wonder. On the instrument check ride, will an examiner usually allow use of the 430 and/or the iPad GPS for added SA during a partial panel approach?

Agree with Bruce, but even if the examiner did let you use the GPS or an iPad (justifiable because of the notion that one should use every available tool), it would still be best to be able to execute an approach PP without goodies.

 

[Z06_Mir]

On my checkride my partial panel approach was no-gyro. It was a GPS approach though, so I had the GPS. During my training though we typically did much harder scenarios, like no gyro+no GPS approaches with one VOR and timed turns. Those prepared me for the relatively easy no gyro on the checkride. My DPE says he does that because people are so used to training for the worst that when it's not that bad they screw up more.

 

[Threefingeredjack]

Agree with Bruce, but even if the examiner did let you use the GPS or an iPad (justifiable because of the notion that one should use every available tool), it would still be best to be able to execute an approach PP without goodies.

Train for the worst, hope for the best. IFR can be merciless when things go South. Shortcuts in check rides do you no favors.

 

[DutchessFlier]

Sorta makes me chuckle....I was partial paneled for the VOR28 into KALB with a howling wind out of the north-northwest, I started my turns from southwest of the field already on an easterly heading to intercept the inbound radial and was counting seconds in the turns and following the mag compass. My DPE left the GPS on, and available, but I was so totally trained to go to the basics, that I never even looked at the GPS (I don't even remember if I loaded the approach in the 430?)

He actually asked me WTH I was doing, and why didn't I use the 430 for situational awareness? I told him that I could fly the approach with the clock, the mag compass and my DME and the GPS never even crossed my mind. Not a problem, and when he debriefed the checkride with me and then my CFII, it was all good.

Now, just about everything I fly are RNAVs with vectors.....oh well...

 

[JHW]

having been weaned on gps and used to making a correction for every slight movement, you are going to have to re-learn your scan for partial panel.

you need to slow down. Yourself that is, not the plane. One thing that helps many people is to fly with your feet and cross your arms.

Also keep in mind that post-checkride, you probably aren't going to fly around indefinitely with no vacuum instruments. A loss of gyros should be treated as an emergency and the purpose of your partial panel work is to safely get into VMC, not to fly halfway across the country.

 

[poadeleted20]

The examiner certainly can take away all those other GPS-based tools, so make sure you can do without them. However, all the examiners I know want to see you at least try to use whatever you have available which can help, because failing to use all the appropriate tools you have available in an emergency situation does not display good judgment. Further, with one exception, I've not seen an examiner take away such tools during an IR practical test, and I've observed at least half a dozen such tests by many different examiners every year for the last seven years. The one exception is an examiner who takes away the GPS to do a couple of timed turns before giving it back for the partial panel approach.

 

[azure]

The examiner certainly can take away all those other GPS-based tools, so make sure you can do without them. However, all the examiners I know want to see you at least try to use whatever you have available which can help, because failing to use all the appropriate tools you have available in an emergency situation does not display good judgment. Further, with one exception, I've not seen an examiner take away such tools during an IR practical test, and I've observed at least half a dozen such tests by many different examiners every year for the last seven years. The one exception is an examiner who takes away the GPS to do a couple of timed turns before giving it back for the partial panel approach.

Concur. My DPE covered both the AI and the HSI for partial panel and had no problem with me using the GPS for situational awareness. He did want to me use the correct and legal primary guidance for the approach (a VOR approach), so I tuned in NAV 2. After the formal partial panel approach, I then had a chance to demonstrate what I would do "for real" -- the instrument cover had hit something on the Sandel and thrown it into a mode I didn't recognize. This was just as I was shipped back to departure who told me to proceed direct to the IAF for my next approach (RNAV). Rather than try to figure it out in that high-workload situation, I just reverted to using the GPS NAV page until I was at a safe altitude and established on course. Later, the DPE said the way I handled that situation was "worth 100 points right there".

Having said that, I don't consider myself very proficient at partial panel. I had a hard time getting any of my instructors to fail instruments or do any other kind of stress training under the hood. I did a little bit early on with my first CFII, then some more during checkride prep, and pretty much not at all in between. I hope to rectify that deficiency on my first IPC.