Ouch-Car owners beware
- Thread starter Flymeariver
- Start date
Lawsuit time.
N747JB
Final Approach
There are times when I don't like some of my fellow car dealers!
It should be a simple insurance claim, our guy wrecked it, it's worth $XXX, here's your check. Let the insurance companies hash it out if you don't want to get murdered in the press.
It's no different than if it was stolen by the valet at the Cheesecake Factory, you are obligated to make the owner whole, no matter the nature if the business involved. Personally, I would most likely just get them a new car, swap collateral on their loan, so they would owe no more or less, and take the insurance proceeds. The rest is written off and maybe sue the fired employee for the money, if he has anything. 
denverpilot
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poadeleted21
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I don't get "cars". So, I can't really sympathize with the owners. I'd rather have a 10 year old Civic than whatever that car was.
But, at the end of the day, it seems they were willing to take the other car and $11,000 instead of the offered $5,000… at a $6,000 price delta, looks like the dealership would have taken it, the good-er-ish publicity and the ability to stay out of court.
But, at the end of the day, it seems they were willing to take the other car and $11,000 instead of the offered $5,000… at a $6,000 price delta, looks like the dealership would have taken it, the good-er-ish publicity and the ability to stay out of court.
Flymeariver
Pattern Altitude
It has made the rounds through every car group, FB, yahoo etc. quite bad idea for a dealership who generally is higher end. Their Facebook was so bombarded that they took the page down lol. What is sad is that the dealer principal has listed the statement on their website. Why anyone would come to them when they do that is beyond me. I have no skin in the game but felt important to share.
N747JB
Final Approach
Flip it around and say an employee of the FBO took your plane for a joy ride and crunched it on the end of the runway.
It does sound a little like the car owners are being overly difficult, but as a dealership owner, you can't stand bad publicity.
My ex-BIL was the GM at a local Ford store, they sold a used truck to a bag boy at the local grocery store, the guy was "slow" as they say. Well instead of letting the guy bring the car back or renegotiating the deal, he stuck to his guns. Basically, "he's old enough to sign a contract and nobody forced him to buy it!"
The local news loved it, the local fire department had a Boot Drive to raise money to buy the guy a new truck, from another dealership of course and the town revolted against the dealership.
It was sold less than a year later.
As my old general manager was fond of saying, "You can often win the battle and lose the war."
It does sound a little like the car owners are being overly difficult, but as a dealership owner, you can't stand bad publicity.
My ex-BIL was the GM at a local Ford store, they sold a used truck to a bag boy at the local grocery store, the guy was "slow" as they say. Well instead of letting the guy bring the car back or renegotiating the deal, he stuck to his guns. Basically, "he's old enough to sign a contract and nobody forced him to buy it!"
The local news loved it, the local fire department had a Boot Drive to raise money to buy the guy a new truck, from another dealership of course and the town revolted against the dealership.
It was sold less than a year later.As my old general manager was fond of saying, "You can often win the battle and lose the war."
The amount of bad PR will far exceed the value of the car. Pretty stupid.
N747JB
Final Approach
Very true!
Oyyy, the dealer is an idiot. The problem is his under standard bailment terms, just turn it in to the insurance and get the guy a new ZL-1, they still make the dang things. Crap like this can cost you your whole damned business. People will drive another 15 miles just to avoid you, and service is the bread and butter of a dealership.
poadeleted21
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Flip it around and say an employee of the FBO took your plane for a joy ride and crunched it on the end of the runway.
It does sound a little like the car owners are being overly difficult, but as a dealership owner, you can't stand bad publicity.
My ex-BIL was the GM at a local Ford store, they sold a used truck to a bag boy at the local grocery store, the guy was "slow" as they say. Well instead of letting the guy bring the car back or renegotiating the deal, he stuck to his guns. Basically, "he's old enough to sign a contract and nobody forced him to buy it!"
The local news loved it, the local fire department had a Boot Drive to raise money to buy the guy a new truck, from another dealership of course and the town revolted against the dealership.
As my old general manager was fond of saying, "You can often win the battle and lose the war."
I'm insured. If they do so, they do it at their own risk, I'll smile pretty big if they day. Plane is just a toy/tool. It is VERY replaceable.
N747JB
Final Approach
All my service advisors have keys, they rotate opening the service lane at 6:30 AM, they also rotate closing nights as well. I'd say most dealership service advisors have keys, but very few take joy rides in customer's cars!!
N747JB
Final Approach
And new cars are much more replaceable than old airplanes
it's the people's heads that are hard to fix. 
Bad publicity of this type spreads faster than a California brush fire. Should the dealership do anything less than give him a new car for no additional cost it will haunt them big-time.
timwinters
Ejection Handle Pulled
The article never said what year the car was. Or did I miss it?
There's one that I agree with you on. I never thought twice about what Z06_Mir meant until the recent thread about buying something new.
I just don't have see the allure but to each his/her own.
There's one that I agree with you on. I never thought twice about what Z06_Mir meant until the recent thread about buying something new.
I just don't have see the allure but to each his/her own.
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Flymeariver
Pattern Altitude
$60,000 2012 ZL1
Flip it around and say an employee of the FBO took your plane for a joy ride and crunched it on the end of the runway.
It does sound a little like the car owners are being overly difficult, but as a dealership owner, you can't stand bad publicity.
As a car gal, I don' think they're being overly difficult. I'm taking my new-to-me Cadillac into the dealership this week. If they wrecked it I would need an identical vehicle. Not a different color, not a different year, and not more miles. Because my car is not easy to find I'm sure the dealership wouldn't like that but that's their problem, not mine. If it takes ordering a brand-new one to get one in my color, options and condition that isn't my problem. If you want to replace a vehicle that is now used however, one should carry declared value on their policy to account for that difference.
Dan Thomas
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I bet it's already too late for that. People will remember that it took a public outcry to force that dealer do the right thing. The dealership now appears to be untrustworthy and they'll avoid it.
Dan
poadeleted21
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And new cars are much more replaceable than old airplanes
That's why I was sort of giggling at the 1 to 2 year old "show-winning, pristine, fully documented car with much less mileage" aspect of the article… not to mention now, all of a sudden, they could never afford another one.
If the insurance company said "sue me" over $6,000, I'm a little leery to be too sympathetic to the owners.
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Exactly. No matter what they do at this point, they're screwed from a PR standpoint. The damage is done.
N747JB
Final Approach
OK, let's say it was wrecked by the guy at Jiffy Lube, same demands?
I said I would pretty much do whatever's as reasonable to make them happy, it is clearly the dealership's fault. My issue is that every time something happens at a dealership folks think they've won the lottery. The car is worth what it's worth. Should the dealership in this case figure out a way to make them happy? Yes. I'm not sure how rare this car is, but I'm pretty sure there is another out there somewhere that can be bought, and that is what the insurance company has to find and pay the owner the replacement cost of a similar car. It happens everyday all across the country, cars get wrecked, cars get stolen, trees fall on them, if the car is so special that it cannot be replaced, it should be insured as you say for stated value. I'm sure they had a nice car, and maybe if the dealership had handled it better from the start, they would have been more cooperative, it's hard to know what happened with only one side of the story. I'm just glad it wasn't one of my guys!!
I said I would pretty much do whatever's as reasonable to make them happy, it is clearly the dealership's fault. My issue is that every time something happens at a dealership folks think they've won the lottery.
The car is worth what it's worth. Should the dealership in this case figure out a way to make them happy? Yes. I'm not sure how rare this car is, but I'm pretty sure there is another out there somewhere that can be bought, and that is what the insurance company has to find and pay the owner the replacement cost of a similar car. It happens everyday all across the country, cars get wrecked, cars get stolen, trees fall on them, if the car is so special that it cannot be replaced, it should be insured as you say for stated value. I'm sure they had a nice car, and maybe if the dealership had handled it better from the start, they would have been more cooperative, it's hard to know what happened with only one side of the story. I'm just glad it wasn't one of my guys!!
denverpilot
Tied Down
N747JB
Final Approach
My point is an accident is an accident, people just expect a dealership to do things they wouldn't expect from other parties responsible for damaging their cars. Again, in this case the dealership should have folded like a cheap suit, made the people happy and kept this out of the paper and off the Internet.
timwinters
Ejection Handle Pulled
My point is an accident is an accident, people just expect a dealership to do things they wouldn't expect from other parties responsible for damaging their cars. Again, in this case the dealership should have folded like a cheap suit, made the people happy and kept this out of the paper and off the Internet.
I don't believe anyone feels they won the lottery but rather...
An employee stole the car, took it for a high speed joy ride, and crashed it. That's no accident.
It'd be a bit different if it fell of the lift or something. That's an accident.
I'd be far more understanding and forgiving of the latter than the former.
denverpilot
Tied Down
My point is an accident is an accident, people just expect a dealership to do things they wouldn't expect from other parties responsible for damaging their cars. Again, in this case the dealership should have folded like a cheap suit, made the people happy and kept this out of the paper and off the Internet.
Taking someone's car off the lot for a joy ride isn't an accident. It's grand theft auto.
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poadeleted21
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In theory, I agree.
Not so sure about in the eyes of the law though.
If I park my car at your house and tell you to take care of it and toss you the keys. Do you get at GTA charge for taking it to the convenience store?
denverpilot
Tied Down
Not me, but if I call the cops and say an employee took it off my property without my permission, sure. That's exactly the defense this dealership is attempting to use.
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OK, let's say it was wrecked by the guy at Jiffy Lube, same demands?
I said I would pretty much do whatever's as reasonable to make them happy, it is clearly the dealership's fault. My issue is that every time something happens at a dealership folks think they've won the lottery.
I do agree with you. But I would not want to be compensated with a vehicle that had damage history, more miles and two previous owners if I purchased the vehicle brand new. I'd want the closest to my car possible (I'm sure they can do better than they say) and cash to compensate for the fact a vehicle I bought brand-new is now gone and Im stuck making payments on a new-car price when I have a used car.
poadeleted21
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It's not really the dealerships fault they financed a $60,000 toy and are "stuck making payments" on it.
Dr. O
Pattern Altitude
Well, could be worse.
On the boat forum, a fella just bought a new boat ($60K also) and took it home.
Apparently did not put insurance on it YET (shrug)
Boat had warranty issues and a day or two later a mechanic drove from dealer to guy's house and picked up the boat to do the work. On the trip back he gets into a crash and kills someone and totals the boat.
Dealer now telling him they have no liability for the boat loss as he asked them to pick it up instead of bringing it in himself. so he is SOL.
AND apparently the dead guys family is including him in their lawsuit.
On the boat forum, a fella just bought a new boat ($60K also) and took it home.
Apparently did not put insurance on it YET (shrug)
Boat had warranty issues and a day or two later a mechanic drove from dealer to guy's house and picked up the boat to do the work. On the trip back he gets into a crash and kills someone and totals the boat.
Dealer now telling him they have no liability for the boat loss as he asked them to pick it up instead of bringing it in himself. so he is SOL.
AND apparently the dead guys family is including him in their lawsuit.
IIRC Bailment begins at the time they take possession, in this case at the guy's house.
dweyant
Pre-takeoff checklist
Let me relate a different story.
We are all quick to yell when dealerships screw up (I have done my share, or more), but probably not as fast to speak up when they do the right thing.
We bought my wife a brand new 2011 Volvo Convertible. She loved the car, and it was a lot of fun to drive. Unfortunately it had an intermittent computer issue. It kept throwing codes, and the dealership could not get the problem fixed.
Fortunately part of the deal with Volvo (and something I'm sure I paid for in the price of the car) included a loaner car anytime the vehicle was in for service/warranty work. Because of this I didn't pay a lot of attention to how much her car was in the shop.
After we had the car for about a year, I noticed one day that she was going on a loaner for 10+ days, as they attempted to "isolate" the issue. At that point I went back and added up all of the days the car had been in the shop. 42 days in just under one year!
I placed a call to the service manager and said this is ridiculous, what are we going to do to fix this. He was very polite, but basically said he couldn't do anything beyond what they were doing and suggested I call the GM. I left a message with the GM's secretary, and he called me back within a few hours.
I explained the issue to him, and asked what our options were. He said give me until tomorrow morning to check into this and I'll get back with you. He called me the next morning and said come get a new car. They wound up replacing her ~12 month old 15,000 mile car with a brand new 2012 Volvo at exactly no cost to us other than some time to fill out new paperwork.
I was quite impressed, and car dealerships rarely impress me.
-Dan
We are all quick to yell when dealerships screw up (I have done my share, or more), but probably not as fast to speak up when they do the right thing.
We bought my wife a brand new 2011 Volvo Convertible. She loved the car, and it was a lot of fun to drive. Unfortunately it had an intermittent computer issue. It kept throwing codes, and the dealership could not get the problem fixed.
Fortunately part of the deal with Volvo (and something I'm sure I paid for in the price of the car) included a loaner car anytime the vehicle was in for service/warranty work. Because of this I didn't pay a lot of attention to how much her car was in the shop.
After we had the car for about a year, I noticed one day that she was going on a loaner for 10+ days, as they attempted to "isolate" the issue. At that point I went back and added up all of the days the car had been in the shop. 42 days in just under one year!
I placed a call to the service manager and said this is ridiculous, what are we going to do to fix this. He was very polite, but basically said he couldn't do anything beyond what they were doing and suggested I call the GM. I left a message with the GM's secretary, and he called me back within a few hours.
I explained the issue to him, and asked what our options were. He said give me until tomorrow morning to check into this and I'll get back with you. He called me the next morning and said come get a new car. They wound up replacing her ~12 month old 15,000 mile car with a brand new 2012 Volvo at exactly no cost to us other than some time to fill out new paperwork.
I was quite impressed, and car dealerships rarely impress me.
-Dan
THAT is a good story. That dealership is a good one and probably earned your loyalty for a long while.
Ted
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iFlyNothing
I've heard a lot of bad stories with American car make dealerships especially. When I had my Dodge, the only good dealer experience I had was with the parts guy. He and I got along well. One of those "Woe is me" sorts, which doesn't bother me. We were walking out to look at a damaged bedliner I wanted to buy (it was going to get damaged anyway when I used it), I said I was a Jaguar mechanic. He stopped in his tracks, looked at me, and said "You poor soul. I thought I had it bad."
Otherwise, they tried to sell me a truck I didn't want for too much, got mad when I bought one from another dealer. The other dealer charged me extra to install parts that were already on the truck, you get the idea. Lincoln pulled a similar stunt on an LS we were looking at new a few years ago...
My local GM dealer parts department was always great in PA. I had a guy spend 30 minutes trying to find an obscure O-ring for my '95 Suburban. Cost of the part: 14 cents. He did it with a smile, too.
Otherwise, they tried to sell me a truck I didn't want for too much, got mad when I bought one from another dealer. The other dealer charged me extra to install parts that were already on the truck, you get the idea. Lincoln pulled a similar stunt on an LS we were looking at new a few years ago...
My local GM dealer parts department was always great in PA. I had a guy spend 30 minutes trying to find an obscure O-ring for my '95 Suburban. Cost of the part: 14 cents. He did it with a smile, too.
coolbreeze
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Wouldn't this fall under the lemon law? I know it varies by state, but this seems like it would have qualified.
dweyant
Pre-takeoff checklist
Might have, but I "think" since they gave us a loaner car it doesn't. Fortunately we didn't have to go that route.
I don't buy cars very often, but if my wife ever decides she wants another Volvo you can bet we will use the same dealership.
-Dan
Ted
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Depends on the state, but in NY it would be a lemon law. My friend had about the same issue on a Mini, and had to lemon law it. Then lemon lawed the car he got out of the lemon law.
coolbreeze
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coolbreeze
Wow, that seems unusual. That would make some people stay away from that brand, if they were the same make/model.
Ted
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iFlyNothing
Yep, they love their little car and say "It's not that bad." One year they had more miles on loaners than their own car.