NTSB Accident search

Discussion in 'Aviation Mishaps' started by Mrtibs, Oct 20, 2020.

  1. Mrtibs

    Mrtibs Filing Flight Plan

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    Any one attempt to search for an aviation accident on the NTSB website lately?
    They have apparently removed the monthly accident list and replaced it with a new search function.
    I currently find the new search function as virtually useless if you don't know the exact file name, date, state, city etc.

    Maybe I can't crack the code.

    Your thoughts and experiences with the new search function on the NTSB website.
     
  2. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

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    It absolutely sucks. You can’t even find a report knowing the N number, date and state.
     
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  3. Kynadog

    Kynadog Pre-Flight

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    I thought it was just me. The site is next to useless now.
     
  4. wanttaja

    wanttaja En-Route

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    I've noticed some weirdness on the query pages, too. Searches just keep coming up blank.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
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  5. luvflyin

    luvflyin Final Approach PoA Supporter

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  6. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    ***UPDATE*** See Post #10 below for tips on using the new search function.

    It would appear the NTSB no longer cares about folks being able to learn the lessons of others' mistakes. The 'old' search tool will not result in anything newer than 2007 and the new seach tool sucks moist ass.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2020
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  7. Kynadog

    Kynadog Pre-Flight

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    I agree 100%. We’ve lost a great safety too.

    I’ve written to them to complain and to ask them to bring back the old search functionality. I hope a lot more people write and complain.
     
  8. MauleSkinner

    MauleSkinner Final Approach

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    What’s the best address/contact to write and complain?
     
  9. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    Maybe here? Although selecting "Comment or complaint about web page" brings you to a "Request for Information Product" form page, it seems to at least be an option with a large free-forn text box.

    https://app.ntsb.gov/pubmail/pubmail.aspx
     
  10. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    UPDATE!!!

    The landing page for the new "CAROL Query" is obviously a real turd. You need to have very specific information in order to generate any results...

    However.....

    The same function that we have grown accustomed to over the years is still there, it is just not as easy to see initially.

    From the landing page, gaze up at the top of the screen and you will see a few different choices:

    Keyword Search (the landing page)
    Basic Search
    Query Builder

    "Basic Search" will allow you to seach a date span and include City/State/Country data.

    If you select "Query Builder", you can "build" the same search criteria that you used to be able to use on their old search site, one data block at a time.

    It is pretty clunky to use and apparently only goes back to 2010 (no idea how to get specific searches for 2009) , but it does work. Setting up a search using "Make" as the field and "Piper" as the query value resulted in 3067 results.
     
  11. MauleSkinner

    MauleSkinner Final Approach

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    @smv , thanks...I’ll still complain (what else is new ;) ), but at least there’s an option that kinda works.
     
  12. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    Yah. It is a bit kludgy and the results are only available in PDF (no more HTML), but at least it is there...
     
  13. Jim Carpenter

    Jim Carpenter Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Holy C%#p! Just spent 45 minutes trying to learn this new CAROL search thing. Yes, eventually you can find results....but, who comes up with this "new and improved" garbage?
    Granted, I'm old, (a child of DOS 3.0), but I'm not exactly tech illiterate, either. And, it's not just NTSB or .gov; banks, retailers, yes, even forums, every time I see one bringing out a "new" webpage, I shudder.
     
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  14. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    Some government drone needing to justify their existence.
     
  15. wanttaja

    wanttaja En-Route

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    You really have to admire the dedication of government programmers who offer detailed file outputs only with the date given in UNIX Epoch Time... e.g., the number of seconds since 1 January 1970. So you have your choice between that, or a CSV file that only contains a few of the parameters, not including aircraft make and model.

    Sheesh.

    They still have the traditional database available for download (which is what I use for most of my analyses), but the new Carol is nearly worthless for quick checks.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  16. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    To be honest, the vast majority of the searches I did with the old interface were based upon one or two search criteria (typlically date and city, or make and model). This new interface still allows the same criteria, it just does not make it nearly as easy to enter that criteria.

    If you drill deep enough into the filter choices, it does have some neat stuff under "Event Category" that would have likely been nearly impossible to parse out in the papas

    Screenshot_20201119-193637_Firefox.jpg
     
  17. weilke

    weilke Touchdown! Greaser!

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    In this case, more likely a government contractor who got the job after a convoluted federal procurement process. That prime then farmed the job out to the lowest bidder who assembled a team of database designers to do the work. That group worked on DOTs 'bridge and retaining wall' database until just a week before.
     
  18. wrbix

    wrbix Pattern Altitude

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    I’ve found that searching Kathryn’s Report is more productive, by an order of magnitude. Therein one can find link to the NTSB report, as well as other info.
     
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  19. Racerx

    Racerx Line Up and Wait

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    Once again an example of (1) government screwing the pooch. And (2) an attempt at making something that worked fine, better. And just completely failing and left with something useless with a lot of money spent. Usually by someone who doesn't understand what they're actually making. My county assessor did the same thing. Now to find property taxes or ownership of a house you want to purchase is utterly impossible. Whereas before it was so simple. Why we gotta screw up a good thing?
     
  20. smv

    smv Pattern Altitude

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    One justification may be that they consolidated all of the NTSB reports into a single database. You want to search Aviation, Highway, Maritime, Railroad, Pipeline, or Hazmat? All in a single search from a single page.
     
  21. Racerx

    Racerx Line Up and Wait

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    If they were starting up the database I could see keeping everything together. But at this point....why?!. I really hate when entities, especially public ones attempt to fix unbroken things.
     
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  22. wanttaja

    wanttaja En-Route

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    It looks like they may have fixed this. Last JSON result I got had the date in a more-normal format.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  23. Vance Breese

    Vance Breese Line Up and Wait

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    I just checked for gyroplane accidents in 2020 and found nothing. I hope they fix it because I found value in it.
     
  24. Kynadog

    Kynadog Pre-Flight

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    Sorry for the delayed response.

    There is a link for feedback on their landing page. When you click it, it allows you to email safti@ntsb.gov

    The link is in the box on the right side of the page and it says “Feedback”

    https://www.ntsb.gov/pages/carol.aspx

    I encourage everyone to write to to them and let our opinions of the improvements be heard!
     
  25. wanttaja

    wanttaja En-Route

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    On the plus side, the format of the output has been changed to provide more summary information in the output data row.

    Also, it's nice that they include a link to the full docket for cases that have Probable Causes.

    Ron Wanttaja
     
  26. wanttaja

    wanttaja En-Route

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    Not only that, but they've removed the pre-2008 data from the DOWNLOADABLE data set. The 1982-2007 data is now a separate download. Again, results in needless duplication of effort for those of us looking at long-term trends.

    Ron Wanttaja