No more flyovers....

ktup-flyer

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ktup-flyer
Due to budget cuts the government has decided to end all flyovers. I don't agree with this as I feel they are one of those bone chilling moments that everyone should be able to experience. Why couldn't they ground Air Force One and make Obama fly commercial or something? how do you guys feel about it?
 
What!?!?!?!? Is this a joke? They're awesome recruitment for the military; who doesn't want to--at least a little bit--fly one of those when the fly over just as the National Anthem ends and the fireworks go off? One of my favorite moments in football was when they flew over the Gamecocks stadium right at twilight with full afterburner... simply awesome.
They're no more expensive than training flights :(
 
from the CAF's email newsletter today:

SEQUESTRATION UPDATE: AIR SHOW IMPACT

On Friday, February 15, air shows and open houses scheduled at four U.S. Air Force installations (Luke AFB in Arizona, Langley AFB in Virginia, Dover AFB in Delaware, and Seymour Johnson AFB in North Carolina) were cancelled within a few hours of one another. Fortunately, though it is clear that other military bases are making contingency plans to cancel their events if sequestration cuts are made, there have been no additional cancellations this week.

Contrary to what you may have heard elsewhere, none of the jet teams or single-ship demos have cancelled their 2013 performance schedules. The teams and the single-ship demos will continue to practice and perform through March 31. If sequestration cuts are not avoided or rolled back by then, all military performers will stand down. They will cease to practice or perform unless/until sequestration is subsequently "undone." So, for example, if sequestration cuts are in place on April 1, the Blue Angels, Thunderbirds, Raptor demo and Navy single-ship demos will stop practicing and will not perform at scheduled shows. If, however, Congress later takes action to roll back those cuts, the various demonstration teams/pilots will resume practice and begin performing at previously scheduled air shows again once they are current...a process that may take just a few days or weeks, depending on how long they have not been practicing. Obviously, the military may change their position on this plan at any point, but this is their position now. If you hear about or suspect any change to the military's plans for its demonstration aircraft, please confirm with your military point of contact before making decisions or taking action based on those possible changes.

no bucks, no buck rogers
 
Due to budget cuts the government has decided to end all flyovers. I don't agree with this as I feel they are one of those bone chilling moments that everyone should be able to experience.

Why should my tax dollars be spent to give you bone-chilling moments?

Why couldn't they ground Air Force One and make Obama fly commercial or something? how do you guys feel about it?
Better do some research on Air Force one...it's a bit more than a 747 with wider seats.

The miltary demo teams are a nice feel-good exercise, but I really doubt they help recruiting that much. The Army probably got more new recruits from that free video game they developed than from years of Golden Knight airshows.

Ron Wanttaja
 
Why should my tax dollars be spent to give you bone-chilling moments?


Better do some research on Air Force one...it's a bit more than a 747 with wider seats.

The miltary demo teams are a nice feel-good exercise, but I really doubt they help recruiting that much. The Army probably got more new recruits from that free video game they developed than from years of Golden Knight airshows.

Ron Wanttaja

Because your tax dollars will be spent anyway. To cancel flyovers is rediculas. A flyover comes out of the Squadron's alloted flying hour program. It's a formation training event. Static displays at air shows are cross country training events. We did flyovers in the Army and static displays and we never even came close to our max allowed flight hours for the year. I've seen my Company numbers and we had plenty of leftover money. I rather see money spent on flyovers than cross countries for the $1,000 hamburger.

Recruiting is only part of the mission for military demo teams. For instance the Thunderbirds:

To support Air Force recruiting and retention programs
To reinforce public confidence in the Air Force and to demonstrate to the public the professional competence of Air Force members
To strengthen morale and esprit de corps among Air Force members
To support Air Force community relations and people-to-people programs
To represent the United States and its armed forces to foreign nations and to project international goodwill
 
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The government doesn't cut where it counts. They only cut where it's visible.
 
The fact that demo teams are going on until 31 March is interesting. A lot of frontline units are canceling training missions right now.
 
cut the fly overs.

been there, seen that, and it's boring, boring, boring

go to a tractor pull for the sound, ice follies for the precision, or NASCAR for the implied danger
 
Because your tax dollars will be spent anyway. To cancel flyovers is rediculas. A flyover comes out of the Squadron's alloted flying hour program. It's a formation training event. Static displays at air shows are cross country training events. We did flyovers in the Army and static displays and we never even came close to our max allowed flight hours for the year. I've seen my Company numbers and we had plenty of leftover money. I rather see money spent on flyovers than cross countries for the $1,000 hamburger.
I'd rather see the "training time" spent practicing air-to-air and dropping bombs. You know, the things we HAVE an Air Force for....?

Recruiting is only part of the mission for military demo teams. For instance the Thunderbirds:

To support Air Force recruiting and retention programs
To reinforce public confidence in the Air Force and to demonstrate to the public the professional competence of Air Force members
To strengthen morale and esprit de corps among Air Force members
To support Air Force community relations and people-to-people programs
To represent the United States and its armed forces to foreign nations and to project international goodwill

And put a dollar value on any of that. Convince me that the money spent on aerial demonstration teams is worth the money spent on them. Tell me why it's more important to have the Thunderbirds or Blue Angels at an airshow than to develop improved body armor for ground troops.

Ron Wanttaja
 
I'd rather see the "training time" spent practicing air-to-air and dropping bombs. You know, the things we HAVE an Air Force for....?



And put a dollar value on any of that. Convince me that the money spent on aerial demonstration teams is worth the money spent on them. Tell me why it's more important to have the Thunderbirds or Blue Angels at an airshow than to develop improved body armor for ground troops.

Ron Wanttaja

And you're still missing the point. EVERY Squadron / Company is alotted so many hours. Doing these flyovers are part of that years budget and there's no way anyone is exceeding their alloted hours for the year. A flyover is just another formation training flight. By doing it, IT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY FROM OTHER TRAINING EVENTS. Simply cutting a flyover doesn't mean they'll substitute dropping bombs instead. Not everything in military aviation deals with combat training. Plenty of X-country flights or MTRs that can roll into a flyover. We also had PR events to get out and see the public. The more they see and know about our military the more they'll be supportive of what their tax dollars go to.

No one is saying the Thunderbirds or Blues are more important than improved body armor for ground troops. There's no shortage in money or improvements in body armor. You've got pilots in the 80's and 90's that used the same old crap. After 9/11 and three deployments, I had a new vest or type of armor plating in each deployment. They're constantly improving on our survival equipment. When is comes to force protection or troop welfare while deployed, the U.S. can't be beat.

You can't tell me a 2.4 percent budget cut should have this drastic effect on operations. There's plenty of other waste that can get cut besides air shows and flyovers...believe me.
 
I'd rather see the "training time" spent practicing air-to-air and dropping bombs. You know, the things we HAVE an Air Force for....?



And put a dollar value on any of that. Convince me that the money spent on aerial demonstration teams is worth the money spent on them. Tell me why it's more important to have the Thunderbirds or Blue Angels at an airshow than to develop improved body armor for ground troops.

Ron Wanttaja

Convince me why my tax dollars should be spent giving Obama phones and ebt cards to addicts, when that money could be better spent on demonstration teams?

Where did you see that money was cut from body armor development to fund demonstration teams anyway?
 
Where did you see that money was cut from body armor development to fund demonstration teams anyway?

Just to be clear, it was a rhetorical question. Didn't mean to imply an actual example. The fact is, it is a budget. I can get the car fixed, or I can spend the money on movie tickets and walk to the theater.

If you don't like the choices made, convince the electorate to select better representatives to make the decisions.

Ron Wanttaja
 
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And you're still missing the point. EVERY Squadron / Company is alotted so many hours. Doing these flyovers are part of that years budget and there's no way anyone is exceeding their alloted hours for the year. A flyover is just another formation training flight. By doing it, IT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY FROM OTHER TRAINING EVENTS.

Lemme get this straight. All the resources spent on the Thunderbirds and Blue Angels...months of training sessions every year, tons of support aircraft, PR troops, flying local media...is just what every other Air Force or Navy tactical squadron flies?

Tell it to the marines, the sailors won't believe it.



Ron Wanttaja
 
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I could volunteer to do flyovers. Would that help promote GA? :)

I don't think many people would notice you doing a flyover of a Vikings home game... except for maybe the F18's on your tail.
 
I'd rather see the "training time" spent practicing air-to-air and dropping bombs. You know, the things we HAVE an Air Force for....?



And put a dollar value on any of that. Convince me that the money spent on aerial demonstration teams is worth the money spent on them. Tell me why it's more important to have the Thunderbirds or Blue Angels at an airshow than to develop improved body armor for ground troops.

Ron Wanttaja

I would much rather see the government spending money endorsing aviation than spending $750k on a new soccer field for detainees held at Guantanamo Bay. Would you rather have your tax dollars help keep the aviation industry alive or bail out companies like Fannie Mae or GM? FWIW watching the Blue Angels and Thunderbirds when I was little helped get me into this and I would be signing up for the Navy to fly fighters if my vision met the requirements. You can't lie and say that you haven't watched a demonstration by either team and wished you weren't in their spot flying f-16s or f-18s at 700mph 50+ feet above the ground
 
Convince me why my tax dollars should be spent giving Obama phones and ebt cards to addicts, when that money could be better spent on demonstration teams?

I hope you meant Reagan phones.
 
I don't think many people would notice you doing a flyover of a Vikings home game... except for maybe the F18's on your tail.

MN ANG flies F-16's.

I'll just perform an overhead break, turn off my mode-C, and lose them in a cloud! :rofl:
 
Lemme get this straight. All the resources spent on the Thunderbirds and Blue Angels...months of training sessions every year, tons of support aircraft, PR troops, flying local media...is just what every other Air Force or Navy tactical squadron flies?

Tell it to the marines, the sailors won't believe it.



Ron Wanttaja

You don't go to too many air shows do you? Yes the Air Force has demo teams from tactical units for the A-10, F-16, F-4 and F-15E Heritage Flights. Also before the squester the F-22 had a full flight demo schedule. On the Navy side, VFA-122 and VFA-106 had a full F-18 flight demo schedule at the start of the year. I know on the Marine side the AV-8B and MV-22 had a demo schedule posted before the sequester as well. For awhile Ft Hood had an AH-64 Longbow demo team. From CH-7 0f AR 360-1:

"Maximum advantage for Army recruiting will be taken at public events where aerial demonstrations are authorized."

Flyovers and other PR events are mostly done by active duty and NG non-demo teams. A request is sent to public affairs, they weed it down to the most visible events that would have a positive impact for the armed forces. They then send that to the individual units and you get a bunch of pilots to plan the details. As I said, the training value of a flyover can easily be incorporated into an IFR cross country.

Just on the Army side, myself and my friends have done flyovers for sporting events, static displays at air shows, schools, malls, convention centers, etc. In combat and stateside we fly PR stuff like sports athletes, actors, cheerleaders, wrestlers, singers / bands, media etc. We even have a spousal flying program. It's all authorized IAW AR 95-1, AR 360-1, and DOD travel manual.

None of these flights are suppose to affect combat readiness or exceed our annual flying hour program. I won't go into the hours alloted for a typical combat unit, but having seen ours, we never came close.
 
FWIW when we do flyovers, we are restricted to 3000' AGL minimum and basically 250-300 kts. My squadron has done probably a dozen of them in the last year, and the general gist of every brief is that it just isn't worth deviating from that. There is bound to be some retired dude in the crowd who is going to call you in otherwise, which is a quick trip to the long green table, a FNAEB, and potentially losing one's wings. So unfortunately, for better or for worse, the days of supersonic treetop level flybys are probably over forever. Maybe things are different on the AF side, but I seriously doubt it. I'd personally rather be the ground coordinator than actually fly in the thing itself to be quite honest.

The real bummer about this from my perspective is that it has pretty much shelved any and all weekend cross country flights for fear of breaking a jet on the road and having to use TAD funds to send out a rescue det of maintainers to fix it. From outward appearances, taking jets on the road to go visit some random place might seem wasteful and self serving. But in reality, it is a very good way to burn a lot of flight hours that Ops needs to burn one way or the other. I'll take that over launching on a Tuesday night into crap weather that precludes any tactical training, just to go out into the W-72 and turn circles at 30k ft and 250 kts for an hour and a half or so. That gets real old, real fast and actually provides less useful training than an airnav to somewhere new.
 
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<snip>So unfortunately, for better or for worse, the days of supersonic treetop level flybys are probably over forever. < snip>

Glad I got to see up close, way back in the '90s from the threshold of 13R @ BFI, one of the Blue Angles break ground on takeoff and do a 360 degree roll for the tower.... before things turned into what they are these days.
 
Glad I got to see up close, way back in the '90s from the threshold of 13R @ BFI, one of the Blue Angles break ground on takeoff and do a 360 degree roll for the tower.... before things turned into what they are these days.

The Blues and other demo teams are exceptions to the flyby rules I mentioned. Obviously they exceed those limits to a very large extent. I'm just speaking to fleet/operational units conducting non-airshow flyovers. Pretty sure the dirty roll is still part of the Blue Angel routine. Of potential interest, due to the dirty loop they do (which hits 350 kts), the Blues are certified to fly with the gear extended about 100 kts faster than the rest of us are. No change in the airframe, but IIRC they just conduct a post flight inspection that isn't normally part of a Hornet turnaround or daily inspection.
 
We cancelled ALL xc training because its by far the least important training we do. When hours are cut, no fighter pilot is going to say "yeah, let's do some IFR training and a flyby; screw that 4v8 crap!" YGBSM! Cut our ours, we cut the flyby and airshows - that is an obvious first step. The only USAF people that do IFR xc training in times like these are training command guys and you can't do airshows or flybys with students. The rest of us are too busy trying to maintain the bare minimum qualification for our wartime mission to waste sorties on flybys.

35: our reg is 1000' and 300kts. Mistype when you said 3k?
 
Yeah, 1000/300. Not saying people don't go below it, because people have.....just that the mentality out there now is just different than I'm guessing it used to be. I'd agree about tactical flights being the priority, but when you can't get those out for wx or mx, then a ccx is a good way to make up lost hours without making the squadron fly 3 million sortie weeks.
 
On the training command side of the house they're starting to rumble about student cross-countries. Who knows what will happen since in the AETC undergraduate flying world MX is about exclusively civilian. With the projected furloughs forget about breaking off-station. Weekend XC might have to be moved to the week and/or local O&Bs. Not insurmountable, but a reduction in production will be substantial and felt on the "real AF" in due time.
 
The government doesn't cut where it counts. They only cut where it's visible.

That's exactly what all this silly sequestration nonsense is about. It's public display of all the wonderful things that the government does for us. The cuts are designed to provoke maximum outrage from the people so that we'll pick up the phone and call our representatives and beg them to cave in and do whatever it takes to get the government funded and our cool stuff back. Basically, ask them to borrow more money and tax the rich bastards.:rolleyes::mad2:
 
So unfortunately, for better or for worse, the days of supersonic treetop level flybys are probably over forever.

You know where you guys could probably still do those super sonic fly bys? In the Black Rock desert during Burning Man. I bet most everyone there would love it.
 
Why should my tax dollars be spent to give you bone-chilling moments?


Better do some research on Air Force one...it's a bit more than a 747 with wider seats.

The miltary demo teams are a nice feel-good exercise, but I really doubt they help recruiting that much. The Army probably got more new recruits from that free video game they developed than from years of Golden Knight airshows.

Ron Wanttaja

The Blue Angels and Thunderbirds are 100% directly responsible not only for my interest in aviation, but for my interest in joining the military.
 
The Blue Angels and Thunderbirds are 100% directly responsible not only for my interest in aviation, but for my interest in joining the military.

Would you feel the same way if your job in the military ends up not being that of a pilot or aircrew? Most people who join the military don't get to be pilots. Most aren't competitive enough to qualify, medically or otherwise.

I only ask because I would like to see if the recruitment dynamics are similar to what NASA experienced in their engineering corps (most were astronaut wannabes that would never get there, but still contributed to NASA). I.E. is it an overall macro-level successful recruitment tool or is it really only something that appeals to the demographic that's likely to be competitive to be a pilot in the first place? (at which point the economies of scale doesn't make it all that sucessful of a tool). I think that's the point Ron was trying to make.

I think it's the former. I think most kids sign up with dreams of flying F-16s for the military. By the time their disillusionment about not being competitive or qualified, or able due to lack of openings to become one sink in, they're economically accustomed to the contract they've made. Which is a great success in recruitment in my opinion, albeit makes for a high turnover workforce (and a disillusioned one).
 
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The Blue Angels and Thunderbirds are 100% directly responsible not only for my interest in aviation, but for my interest in joining the military.
Certainly, no doubt the demonstration teams attracted many fine servicepeople.

The question, though, is not WHETHER it works, but whether, in a cost-constrained environment, it's a cost-effective way of gaining recruits. The Army sponsors a NASCAR race car. Is the cost per recruit gained less than the Thunderbirds?

The fact is, it's all...the demo teams, the race cars...just for Public Relations. If it were a recruiting tool, when the Blues come to town, new Navy recruits would get rides, not the weatherbabe at the local TV station.

Contemplate that, for a moment. Why does the Air Force need Public Relations? It's not like the American public is going to turn away and hire a competing air force.

Well, actually, in a way, they might. If the Air Force doesn't convince the taxpayer that it does good things, the Navy might grab more of the defense budget.

In other words, the Air Force spends taxpayer money to convince the taxpayer to give it more taxpayer money.

In any case, we should contemplate the future of military aircraft demonstration teams as military tactical aircraft are replaced by drones. No one's going to come out to the airport to watch a bunch of robots fly, and will the services allocate a half-dozen manned aircraft to a demo team when they only have fifty or so?

Ron Wanttaja
 
Conservatives: "I'm believe we must reduce the size of government. The sequestration may not be the best way, but it is doing that, so I'm becoming more supportive of it."

Liberal: "I'm all for reducing the size of the military. The sequestration may not be the best way, but it is doing that, so I'm becoming more supportive of it."

The Blue Angels are going to be grounded and towers are going to be closed.
 
Air shows aren't just about recruiting pilots. They're about recruiting in general. Go to any major air show and you'll see all the branches set up boothes. The air show is an excellent way to get the word out to the public in areas that don't have much of a military presence.

I would hope that the job all of us do was influenced at some point by an event. For me it was in high school when the National Guard flew helicopters to our school during recruiting day. To talk to pilots and see the aircraft first hand, sealed the deal for me. I think most military pilots were influenced by some PR event such as air shows or static displays. It's a way of educating future prospects that can't be read in a brochure or seen in some movie.

Air shows, static displays and flyovers are also a way for the American people to come out and say thanks. We have sporting events where people go out see athletes making millions. Our military men and women don't make millions, so what's wrong with going out and at least giving them the respect they deserve for the sacrifices they make? Also it's a way for the public to see first hand what their tax dollars go for.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all for eliminating waste in DOD right now. But lets make some rational reductions to important programs, not eliminations. Instead of 35 air shows for the Blues or Tbirds, why not 25? If units can't meet their combat training goals, then reduce the flyovers. I just fail to see how a whopping 2.5 % reduction in spending can have such drastic cuts programs.
 
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Sorry for the long post, but it seems directly relevant based on the "why does such a small cut mean so much?"

Why A Modest Cut To The Budget Will Cause Major Damage To The Military
2/25/2013
Loren Thompson
Forbes

As the March 1 deadline for averting across-the-board cuts to federal spending approaches, the ready and resilient military force that America has spent trillions of dollars creating since 9-11 is beginning to unravel.

The Commandant of the Marine Corps says that if nothing changes, by January over half of his ground combat units and a third of his aviation units “will not be trained to the minimum readiness level required for deployment and crisis response.” The Army says two-thirds of its brigades will be similarly unprepared for combat.

The Navy has five aircraft carriers tied up at its base in Norfolk, Virginia, all subject to various budget constraints. It says by the end of 2013, over half of the fighters flying off carriers will be unavailable for operations due to deferred maintenance. Plans are being made to drastically scale back naval operations in the Middle East and Western Pacific.

The Air Force says it will cancel over 200,000 hours of flight time, forcing whole units to stand down as early as May. The result, it says, will be a “severe, rapid and long-term combat readiness degradation.”

To put it bluntly, the measures military leaders are contemplating to cope with budget cuts amount to a collapse in the global readiness of the joint force. Outside a few combat zones like Afghanistan, the ability of U.S. soldiers, sailors and airmen to cope with unexpected challenges will quickly whither. Needless to say, troublemakers from Pyongyang to Teheran are watching closely.

But how can this be happening? Republican proponents of budget sequestration — formulaic reductions — have correctly pointed out that the cuts amount to a very small portion of the federal budget. Roughly two-percent to be exact. Is it possible the military is using scare tactics to prevent even modest cuts to its oversized budget, which currently represents nearly half of all global military spending?

The answer is “no.” All military leaders are doing is responding to the legal mandates they have been issued by the President and Congress, planning on the very realistic possibility that those mandates will not change anytime soon. Amazingly enough, it only requires modest cuts to the federal budget to severely unbalance the nation’s global military posture, because of the way in which pending cuts are structured and what has come before. Here’s a brief explanation.

First of all, defense spending only represents a fifth of the federal budget, but under the sequestration provisions of the Budget Control Act half of all the mandated savings must come from the military. The other half is supposed to come from so-called discretionary domestic spending, which essentially means programs that aren’t entitlements. In other words, most of the federal budget is exempted from sequestration, and the military bears a disproportionate burden in reducing the deficit.

Second, even before the Budget Control Act became law, military spending was already programmed to decline to a mere 13% of federal spending in 2017, the final year of the second Obama administration. That shrinking share mainly reflected the winding down of foreign wars and the inexorable growth of entitlements. But if you then subtract hundreds of billions of dollars in sequester-driven reductions, the military ends up claiming less than one in eight federal dollars by 2017.

Third, sequestration is not the first big hit that defense spending has taken in the Obama years. The administration’s Pentagon team spent its first two years seeking savings from weapons programs, killing or delaying many of the biggest efforts. Then, the Budget Control Act was passed mandating half a trillion dollars in defense savings over a decade in ten equal, annual increments. Sequestration, the second wave of cuts under the budget law, doubles that amount. So a department that two years ago was planning for a base budget of $600 billion in 2013 now will need to get by on a hundred billion less.

Fourth, the Budget Control Act permits the President at his discretion to exempt pay for military personnel from sequestration, which he announced he would do last July. However, that means the Pentagon’s other accounts then must be cut more to achieve the annual savings required by the law. Defense secretary Leon Panetta says that those other accounts will be debited 9% in fiscal 2013 following adjustments made in the January “fiscal cliff” compromise. But with half of the fiscal year nearly gone, the full-year savings will have to be realized in six months, so it will feel more like an 18% cut.

Fifth, the budget law requires that all accounts not exempted from sequestration in 2013 be cut by the same percentage down to the individual program level. Planners can’t cut weapons more than operations to protect readiness, because the law subjects each category of defense spending to the same formula in imposing reductions. And because the budget authority targeted by the law typically gets spent much faster in operations and maintenance than in other areas, it is there that the pain will be felt fastest.

So the bottom line on how sequestration will play out at the Pentagon is that a full year’s worth of savings must be generated in half a year, and there is little flexibility for allocating cuts in a manner that will ease dislocations. Operations and maintenance, the account most closely tied to readiness, is structured in a way that affords somewhat more flexibility than weapons accounts, but on the other hand budget authority gets spent faster there so the money dries up faster.

If this sounds like a confusing mess, it’s at least in part because it was designed that way. The geniuses at the White House budget office who re-invented sequestration to deal with the challenge posed by the Tea Party figured that both parties would come to their senses and compromise when confronted with the waste and destruction caused by formulaic cuts. Well, guess again. Not only did the parties not compromise — leading to the likely triggering of sequestration on March 1 — but they didn’t even manage to pass an appropriations law for fiscal 2013 to fund the government.

Which brings me to the final factor explaining why modest cuts to the federal budget can cause major damage to the military. The entire government is operating right now under what’s known as a Continuing Resolution, meaning a law that maintains federal spending at last year’s level. Legislators have increasingly resorted to such stopgap measures in recent years to get around the fact that they can’t agree on a budget.

The current resolution is due to expire on March 27. If nothing takes its place, the government shuts down. The smart money in Washington is betting Congress extends the Continuing Resolution to the end of the year, meaning defense spending will have to remain at last year’s level. That would have the effect of giving the military more money than it needs for weapons and less money than it needs for operations; unfortunately, such resolutions typically prevent shifting funds between major accounts.

If Congress does not replace the current Continuing Resolution with one providing more flexibility to move money around in response to urgent needs, then the shortfall in funding for readiness created by sequestration turns into a genuine crisis. The Army, for instance, would be short $18 billion in operations and maintenance funding due to a combination of the Continuing Resolution, sequestration, and unexpected costs in Afghanistan imposed because our good friends the Pakistanis have made it harder to move supplies in and out of the country.

That explains why two-thirds of the Army’s brigade combat teams may not be ready to respond to emergencies by the end of the year. To make sure troops in Afghanistan are not put at risk, the service is draining money out of other accounts including stateside training and maintenance. If the law requires you to debit your operations and maintenance accounts by 9% for the year, and then you have to find all those savings in six months, and then you have to make sure forces in harms way are not subjected to unnecessary risks — well, there just isn’t much money left to train and maintain forces that aren’t headed for war zones anytime soon.

Thus, what looks like a modest cut to the federal budget results in rapid erosion of combat skills across the joint force. Years of spending to achieve high rates of readiness are squandered. The services say that once they start deferring maintenance for aircraft, ships and vehicles, it will take years to get back to the levels of readiness considered prudent in an unpredictable world — unless, of course, the political system decides to give them a lot more money in future years to make up for the shortfall this year. But most observers say the budget is likely to just keep going down until some big new threat comes along to wake up Washington to the consequences of its actions.

And therein lies the greatest danger of the process we now generically refer to as sequestration. As military readiness and overseas presence decline, potential aggressors in Africa, the Middle East, Northeast Asia and elsewhere will be emboldened. With less U.S. forces nearby, it will seem like a good time to take chances. And that means America’s military may have to respond to threats without sufficient equipment or training. Many warfighters may die due to lack of preparedness. It has happened before, and it could happen again. If it does after investing so much money in the joint force since 9-11, the stupidity of Washington’s budget wars will be all too obvious.
 
Sorry for the long post, but it seems directly relevant based on the "why does such a small cut mean so much?"

Why A Modest Cut To The Budget Will Cause Major Damage To The Military

LOL, the only thing that can destroy the US Military is the US Military. The Military is bankrupting this country just like what happened before the fall of the Soviet Union.
 
Too many entitlements. It's estimated that given recent trends military entitlements and personnel costs will take up the entire defense budget by 2039.

Retirement pay, disability, medical, dental, GI Bill etc. Take it. I don't need that stuff.

If we just cancel the F-35, all of our problems will be solved. :)
 
Too many entitlements. It's estimated that given recent trends military entitlements and personnel costs will take up the entire defense budget by 2039.

Retirement pay, disability, medical, dental, GI Bill etc. Take it. I don't need that stuff.

If we just cancel the F-35, all of our problems will be solved. :)

The thing is everything you mentioned is a domestic spending program which is beneficial to our economy. It's cash flow within our economy, the head of 'trickle down'. This should surprise no one, Eisenhower told us it was happening in his departing speech, it is what we have based our economy on since WWII. What we have to reduce is the capital outflow side of the military budget and right now that is fuel.

BTW, government is not the problem, it's those that control the government.
 
LOL, the only thing that can destroy the US Military is the US Military. The Military is bankrupting this country just like what happened before the fall of the Soviet Union.


LOL. Military budget never exceeded more than 27% of the federal budget since the 80s. It's been dropping fairly steadily ever since. I fail to see how that is bankrupting this country.
 
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