New twist on the same old question.

Maxmosbey

Maxmosbey

Final Approach
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I need to get serious.
Here it is, just for fun. It is my wife an my 26th anniversary, and my father-in-law bought me an hour of 172 time for a gift. He bought my wife an hour of flight time too, so that's good in that she has been taking some lessons with Tony. But anyway, my father-in-law told me last week that if I'm out flying some day, he would like to come along and fly over some land that he owns, to take a look at his waterways. I flew up over it last week and took some pictures for him while I was out joy riding, but he wants to get the bird's eye view for himself. So here is the question. If I take him flying, does anyone think that am I in violation because he paid for the time? I'm pretty interested in how this one is going to be interpreted here, because my in-laws are always buying me flying time for, birthdays, Christmas, and whatever.
 
You can give a ride to any one at any time. he bought you an hour? be sure you do not use that hour when you take him flying.
 
There is no reason he can't pay $200.00 for the ride to the airport.

There is nothing wrong with him giving you a gift of flight time for your birthday or other reason (any reason). You can ask him to go along for a ride if you like.

What he can't do is say "I want you to fly me over my house I will pay for everything."

Dan
 
IANAL - I, for one, don't believe you would be in violation of anything.
 
Bob Noel said:
IANAL - I, for one, don't believe you would be in violation of anything.
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You think wrong. Unfortunately the FAA views this as being a commercial operation as he is being paid to fly the customer (his inlaw) over their house.

That said, no reason he can't just give you $200 for being a good son-in-law. There is also no reason that you can't take your father-in-law flying for being a good father-in-law.

Basically, in the end, as long as your father in law doesn't go complaining to the FAA about your ride or the local charter company sees you taking their clients and complains to the FAA, you'll be fine.
 
> Unfortunately the FAA views this as being a commercial operation...

well, it probably won't be the last time the FAA has its head, well, you know.

(>-{
 
jesse said:
You think wrong. Unfortunately the FAA views this as being a commercial operation as he is being paid to fly the customer (his inlaw) over their house..
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I disagree. Father-in-law gave a gift - not a quid-pro-quo of compensation in exchange for transportation.

This is one of those areas where being hyper-technical about the regulation results in silliness. You end up with posts about $200 drives to the airport (although I have to admit I really =like= the "be sure you do not use that hour" answer :D ).

The whole idea of these rules is to prevent potential abuse - abuse of passengers who know nothing about who is qualified to take their money in exchange for transportation and abuse of commercial operators who spent the big bucks to meet the qualifications.

I'm trying to picture Max walking into his local FSDO after the flight and saying, "Guess what, my father-in-law bought me an hour of flight time and I used it to to take him for a ride," and getting violated for it.

Puh-lease!
 
Maxmosbey said:
Here it is, just for fun. It is my wife an my 26th anniversary, and my father-in-law bought me an hour of 172 time for a gift. He bought my wife an hour of flight time too, so that's good in that she has been taking some lessons with Tony. But anyway, my father-in-law told me last week that if I'm out flying some day, he would like to come along and fly over some land that he owns, to take a look at his waterways. I flew up over it last week and took some pictures for him while I was out joy riding, but he wants to get the bird's eye view for himself. So here is the question. If I take him flying, does anyone think that am I in violation because he paid for the time? I'm pretty interested in how this one is going to be interpreted here, because my in-laws are always buying me flying time for, birthdays, Christmas, and whatever.
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Oh good f-ing God, put him in the plane and fly him, don't give it another thought.
 
Henning said:
Oh good f-ing God, put him in the plane and fly him, don't give it another thought.
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Don't worry about that, we'll go flying. I just put this out for discussion. I'm not concerned at all that the FAA is going to come and get me for taking my father-in-law for a flight that he paid for, even if it were not an anniversary gift. My father-in-law is a great guy, and we do a lot of things together. I just thought that it would be fun to get other people's thoughts on it.
 
Max forgot to mention that he has a flyer on the FBO wall saying he'll give rides for $200, but only to his father in law.







:D
 
Anthony said:
Max forgot to mention that he has a flyer on the FBO wall saying he'll give rides for $200, but only to his father in law.:D
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And though John McCain's "Joe Plumber" might not be reading this thread, it might be monitored by snooping "Joe FAA Guy."

HR
 
No, it isn't legal by FAA standards -- you're getting paid to provide air transportation. However, as long as your father-in-law doesn't complain to the FAA about this, you won't get in trouble. And if he does, you've got bigger problems than that.

Best bet is to tell him to keep his wallet in his pocket around the airport, but if next week he wants to buy you a headset or something as a gift, that would be fine.
 
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You would only be "getting paid" if you used the money he gave you or the gift certificate for that specific flight.

Just go and use the gift certificate for a flight this weekend or whenever you go up next by yourself or with your wife. Then, schedule the flight with your father in law if you are concerned at all about it. That way, the money he gave you or the gift certificate was already used, and he didn't pay for the flight you took him up on.

Another thought,.. he bought you one hour right? So go fly 2.1 and he paid his share, while you still paid pro-rata.

Go enjoy yourself.
 
Would things change if said 172 were on a treadmill???








:D
 
Time? What time? And if you happened to fly over his house??

What happens in a 172, stays in a 172. That's what I say.:D
 
flyersfan31 said:
What happens in a 172, stays in a 172. That's what I say.:D
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As long as your passenger feels the same, you won't have an FAA troubles. It's when your passenger takes something like that out of the plane that you can have FAA troubles. So, you gotta ask yourself this question: "Do you trust your passenger today? Well, do ya -- punk?"
 
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